mikkey 0
Recommended Posts
Okay I'm as confused as you are over actual numbers of AQ activists.
I reckon they will have gained support of late and by inference we could assume that actual numbers may have increased.
As to the far fetched thing, well, thats how I would fight Great Satan if I were in their sandals. If you don't expect your operatives to survive their mission, there is no reason to train them in a variety of tasks, ergo minimal, if any training camps as we might traditionally expect.
As for the communication network, part of the arrangement I describe is already being used by organised crime gangs, so why not terrorists?
I reckon they will have gained support of late and by inference we could assume that actual numbers may have increased.
As to the far fetched thing, well, thats how I would fight Great Satan if I were in their sandals. If you don't expect your operatives to survive their mission, there is no reason to train them in a variety of tasks, ergo minimal, if any training camps as we might traditionally expect.
As for the communication network, part of the arrangement I describe is already being used by organised crime gangs, so why not terrorists?
--------------------
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
QuoteOkay I'm as confused as you are over actual numbers of AQ activists.
I reckon they will have gained support of late and by inference we could assume that actual numbers may have increased.
As to the far fetched thing, well, thats how I would fight Great Satan if I were in their sandals. If you don't expect your operatives to survive their mission, there is no reason to train them in a variety of tasks, ergo minimal, if any training camps as we might traditionally expect.
As for the communication network, part of the arrangement I describe is already being used by organised crime gangs, so why not terrorists?
Oh, I agree about how I would fight "The Great Satan" if I was wearing their sandals, too. I just find it a little hard to believe that they have been able to train over 16,000 new terrorists without being detected. Especially flight training, although I'm sure a computer program like MS Flight Simulator is a valuable tool, I would think that at some point, they need to get behind the controls of a real aircraft.
I suppose it doesn't require a lot of training to become a homicide bomber and that could be taught most anywhere. Wonder what one needs to know to carry out an attack with a "dirty nuke", or a chemical or biological weapon?
"Wonder what one needs to know to carry out an attack with a "dirty nuke", or a chemical or biological weapon?"
Chemical attack, its as easy as sprinkling the stuff out the window of a Cessna over a downtown area, or even just pouring the stuff out on a subway a la Japan sarin attack, although this is not a particularly efficient use of your chemical agent.
Nuke, well destruction and death may not really be necessary. Take a low level isotope (available at any number of scrapyards between Rotterdam and Jordan apparently), grind it up, place the powdered remains in a firecracker, set it off in a highly congested area such as a subway station, et voila, dirty bomb, or just bag the powdered isotope and sprinkle as per a chemical attack.
Max chaos, as the dirt has to be cleaned up, lots of panic/disruption etc and an overloaded medi care system as people stand in line to get checked out.
A child could make one.
Point being you don't have to kill an whole lot of people to bring a city to grinding halt, spread panic and paranoia etc, its especially easy if your bomb makers don't have to survive the manufacturing process.
edit to add...theres no big secret to making dirty bombs, our BBC ran a programme about how easy it is about a year ago, so I'm not really giving anyone anything new or dangerous.
Chemical attack, its as easy as sprinkling the stuff out the window of a Cessna over a downtown area, or even just pouring the stuff out on a subway a la Japan sarin attack, although this is not a particularly efficient use of your chemical agent.
Nuke, well destruction and death may not really be necessary. Take a low level isotope (available at any number of scrapyards between Rotterdam and Jordan apparently), grind it up, place the powdered remains in a firecracker, set it off in a highly congested area such as a subway station, et voila, dirty bomb, or just bag the powdered isotope and sprinkle as per a chemical attack.
Max chaos, as the dirt has to be cleaned up, lots of panic/disruption etc and an overloaded medi care system as people stand in line to get checked out.
A child could make one.
Point being you don't have to kill an whole lot of people to bring a city to grinding halt, spread panic and paranoia etc, its especially easy if your bomb makers don't have to survive the manufacturing process.
edit to add...theres no big secret to making dirty bombs, our BBC ran a programme about how easy it is about a year ago, so I'm not really giving anyone anything new or dangerous.
--------------------
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
kallend 2,027
Quote
QuoteKind of far fetched, but it still doesn't explain why the same orginization said exactly the same thing last October that they are saying now. If both statements are true, we must conclude Al Qaeda has not recruited any new terrorists since last October.
Seems like you're "hoping for the best" instead of "planning for the worst"
It's a little hard to plan anything when you post bogus information from an organization that clearly lies and distorts the truth about Al Qaeda.
The Bush administration is lying again?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
If you're referring to the time when they "almost got Zawahiri" : that was the Pakistanis, in Pakistan actually. And they wouldn't let the US come over to their side of the border to help.QuoteWhat do you think we should do about it?
1. Concentrate on getting Bin Laden. We're looking like idiots lately - "The US is closing in on high value targets on the Pakistan border! Oops, they all got away."
Speed Racer
--------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------
damion75 0
QuoteOkay I'm as confused as you are over actual numbers of AQ activists.
I reckon they will have gained support of late and by inference we could assume that actual numbers may have increased.
I doubt that there is anything as structured as the discussion here appears to believe. These guys are not exactly card carrying members of a carefully structure organisation.
I would expect that it was more a case of a set of 'hard core' members to plan with a network of supporters to provide the goods (weapons, lodgings, money etc) which is probably the 2000 originall quoted but I would be surprised if it was not more. Other than that, the bulk of what the press looks at as 'Al Quaeda' is probably the young and disaffected who can be manipulated to the goals of the leadership. This is the way that most terrorist organisations work.
Under those terms, discussion of the 'size' of the organisation is a bit meaningless. The only bits which are valuable to the organisation are the planners and the 'quartermaster' types. All of the others are expendable, the drones if you like. It doesnt matter whether there are 2000 of them or 18000 - the strength of AQ lies with the planners and those who fund / supply them.
How to 'beat' them? I don't think it is possible to completely destroy such an organisation, just to cripple it. Removing the key leaders and planners, cutting supplies etc will help, but longer term the answer is to try and reduce the pool of disaffected people for them to tap in to and find their 'foot soldiers'.
To that end I think that our money might be better spent on helping out the poorer countries than on such complex and expensive weapons systems (and this coming from a soldier!!) weltpolitik is probably the only way forward.
Why are they really attacking us? I think that it has more to do with jealousy than religion - we have, they 'have not' and they want. So they try to destroy what they cannot have...
Just some random thoughts from a cluttered mind... flame away!
***************
Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus.
Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus.
"I doubt that there is anything as structured as the discussion here appears to believe."
Agreed. We don't even know where they are, let alone how many of them there are.
"but longer term the answer is to try and reduce the pool of disaffected people"
Yep, reduce their potential for propaganda, behave like the nice, likeable folks the rest of the world really knows we are.
"Why are they really attacking us?"
And there lies the million dollar question. I believe, and have said it here several times, we should be dealing with the cause, not the symptom.
"and this coming from a soldier"
Is that a Royal Artillery team rig you've got?
Agreed. We don't even know where they are, let alone how many of them there are.
"but longer term the answer is to try and reduce the pool of disaffected people"
Yep, reduce their potential for propaganda, behave like the nice, likeable folks the rest of the world really knows we are.
"Why are they really attacking us?"
And there lies the million dollar question. I believe, and have said it here several times, we should be dealing with the cause, not the symptom.
"and this coming from a soldier"
Is that a Royal Artillery team rig you've got?
--------------------
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
tkhayes 348
perhaps sticking our noses into ANYONE's business is what is pissing them off. Name 20-30 countries in the world that do NOT poke around in foreign countries governments- Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Scotland, Finland, Poland, etc etc etc. Why is it that these countries do not seem to have half the world pissed off with them?
Getting back to the source of the problem.... stop fucking around and sticking your arrogant nose into places where it does not belong might be a good start.
We typically try to CONTROL everything in the world, power, business, economics and money, but mostly POWER. My guess is that is what is pissing them off. How about we stop affecting foreign governments, close all the foreign bases, take care of the people at home and mind our own business.
TK
Getting back to the source of the problem.... stop fucking around and sticking your arrogant nose into places where it does not belong might be a good start.
We typically try to CONTROL everything in the world, power, business, economics and money, but mostly POWER. My guess is that is what is pissing them off. How about we stop affecting foreign governments, close all the foreign bases, take care of the people at home and mind our own business.
TK
kallend 2,027
QuoteHow about we stop affecting foreign governments, close all the foreign bases, take care of the people at home and mind our own business.
TK
You're just a damn troublemaker, TK.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
damion75 0
QuoteYep, reduce their potential for propaganda, behave like the nice, likeable folks the rest of the world really knows we are.
Not sure that they would ever go for that!
But if they have a little bit better quality of life, some education, some hope of a better future... then perhaps they will focus on that instead of getting angry. It is tougher for the few 'evil masterminds' out there to motivate the masses if they are fat and comfortable!!
QuoteIs that a Royal Artillery team rig you've got?
Actually strangely enough it isn't - strange because that is my Regiment! I just fancied something red white and blue!
Not 100% sure what the team rigs DO look like now actually....
***************
Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus.
Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus.
Jimbo 0
QuoteName 20-30 countries in the world that do NOT poke around in foreign countries governments- Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Scotland, Finland, Poland, etc etc etc.
Norway, Denmark, and Poland all have troops in Iraq - at least they did at one time. Poland even headed up an entire division.
QuoteWe typically try to CONTROL everything in the world, power, business, economics and money, but mostly POWER.
One could argue that we do it to preserve the security of our country. Affecting the power of other nations is, at times, in our best interests. Sometimes history shows that it wasn't, but I doubt that we ever went in there thinking - "hey, this will fuck us good at home!". Business, economics, and money - if our economy collapsed it would be catastrophic. Yeah - sometimes we need the world to do things for our benefit. It might be ugly, but it's ultimately necessary. Do we always get it right? Nope. But we're doing what we think is necessary to preserve our way of life.
QuoteHow about we stop affecting foreign governments, close all the foreign bases, take care of the people at home and mind our own business.
Nice idea, but hardly practical. The people at home are affected by the people outside of our borders on a daily basis. It would not be in our best interests to simply close up shop.
-
Jim
"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
crozby 0
Do you really believe that the US has its fingers in so many pies around the world just to keep the folks at home safe and sound?
Isn't it more likely that the USA is behaving in the same way as all previous empires, i.e. spreading its influence and control way outside its own borders to achieve ever greater power and wealth throughout the world.
I'd put money on China taking over as number one in another 50 or so years.
Isn't it more likely that the USA is behaving in the same way as all previous empires, i.e. spreading its influence and control way outside its own borders to achieve ever greater power and wealth throughout the world.
I'd put money on China taking over as number one in another 50 or so years.
Al Qaeda (i.e. its Asian branch) had and probably still has a net of training camps in SEA - especially Indonesia. The countries are large and there are lots of remote areas where you can do these activities without being detected.
When people look like ants - pull. When ants look like people - pray.
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites