dbattman 0 #26 June 22, 2004 Has he said why he will veto such a bill? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #27 June 22, 2004 QuoteHas he said why he will veto such a bill? Because he believes that it will drive up insurance premiums. Of course he only believes that because the insurance company lobyists told him that and didn't have any kind of independent study done, but he's always right and god is on his side, so, case closed. His exact quote is, "I could not in good conscience sign this bill because it puts the interests of trial lawyers before the interest of patients." Apparently it goes, interests of insurance companies, than patients, than trial lawyers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newsstand 0 #28 June 23, 2004 http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=150-06222004 http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=141-06222004 http://www.kvue.com/news/local/stories/062204kvueBush-eh.2896a8e4f.html Edited to make them clicky "Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening." -- Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #29 June 23, 2004 QuoteSo the supreme court is now GWB's administration? Don't they stay on until they retire? Sometimes I forget that GWB is the omnipresent invisible hand that controls all things that YOU don't like. The Bush administration's Solicitor General argued before the Supreme Court against the plaintiff (and hence against the Bill that Bush supported and signed when Governor of Texas and claimed credit for during hte 2000 election campaign). Is that clear enough for you? Flip -- Flop, again.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #30 June 23, 2004 QuoteY'know, that's not much of a flip-flop. Bush has _much_ better flip-flops than that. Heck, he's changed his mind on whether there's any Al Qaeda/Hussein connection twice so far. And remember when he wanted to leave the issue of gay marriage up to the states, and he didn't think US troops should be used for nation building? I've already written about those. Just establishing a pattern of behavior here. Say one thing, do the opposite.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #31 June 23, 2004 Kallend says: QuoteThe Bush administration's Solicitor General argued before the Supreme Court against the plaintiff (and hence against the Bill that Bush supported and signed when Governor of Texas and claimed credit for during hte 2000 election campaign). Is that clear enough for you? Flip -- Flop, again. From the first article posted by newsstand: Quote1) Bush Vetoed and Then Refused to Sign Patients Rights Bill in Texas. In 1995, Bush vetoed patients' bill of rights legislation that allowed Texans to sue their HMOs for medical malpractice. In 1997, the bill became law without Bush's signature. "I am concerned that this legislation has the potential to drive up health care costs and increase the number of lawsuits," Bush said. In the four years since the Texas patient protection bill became law, roughly 20 lawsuits have been filed out of 4 million Texans in HMO's (Houston Chronicle, 5/23/97; Medical Economics, 12/22/97; Editorial, USA Today, 2/19/01; Testimony before the House Ways and Means Committee, 4/24/01) No signature on that bill from GWB. Oops, guess there wasn't a flip flop there, at least not from as far back as 1995. But there's no way you're wrong, right?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #32 June 23, 2004 QuoteNo signature on that bill from GWB. Oops, guess there wasn't a flip flop there, at least not from as far back as 1995. But there's no way you're wrong, right? And I guess he didn't put out about 10 billion commercials during his campaign talking about how Texas passed the patient bill of rights while he was governor. Ok, maybe he didn't flip flop on this issue. He just manipulated the truth and capitalized on circumstances for his own selfish benefit. That's another pattern of behavior of his. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #33 June 23, 2004 QuoteNice, now we're getting somewhere. I'll look into where he may have said that... but as is... the Supreme Court went ahead and took that issue off his hands. WITHOUT him swaying them one way or another. I'll read the complete ruling when I have more time. So we're no longer blaming Bush or his administration for the ruling, correct? Your just saying that he changed his stance on the issue. Thanks for the correction, that makes it a double flip. First he opposes the bill, then he runs ads taking credit for it when he needs votes, then he opposes it again when it disadvantages his big business cronies.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #34 June 23, 2004 Well at least you have the facts now. I won't disagree that him taking credit for it is no good. BUT, if you read his statements, it seems that he only felt that these cases should be heard in federal courts, and have limited punitive damages. I hate insurance companies as much as the next guy, but 2 million bucks for not paying for a prescription? Come on. I read through the actual ruling too, it just says that (in a large nutshell) that federal law supercedes any state law pertaining to HMO lawsuits and those cases should be heard in federal court. Technically it wouldn't be a double flip anyway: I beleive A (flip) I beleive B (flop) I beleive A So YOU (all you guys) are saying that Kerry didn't flip flop really because there were mitigating circumstances, but Bush did. Do more reading on the Texas HMO deal and you'll realize that at best, it's taking credit for something you didn't do... kinda like the Al Gore Internet. (not saying that it justifies anything) For the record, I do not agree with the ruling.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #35 June 23, 2004 QuoteI hate insurance companies as much as the next guy, but 2 million bucks for not paying for a prescription? Come on. I guess you didn't read any articles about why the suit was brought in the first place. A man was discharged prematurely from the hospital, against doctor's orders, resulting in him having to be rushed to the emergency room a couple days later. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #36 June 23, 2004 No I read that one too... the other part of the suit involves being denied pay for prescriptions. Read the ruling. And yes, that case where a patient was seriously jeopardized by the HMO's refusal to keep him hospitalized is a travesty and he deserves compensation so that it won't happen again. But we do not need multi-million dollar suits for smaller stuff.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #37 June 23, 2004 QuoteNo I read that one too... the other part of the suit involves being denied pay for prescriptions. Read the ruling. And yes, that case where a patient was seriously jeopardized by the HMO's refusal to keep him hospitalized is a travesty and he deserves compensation so that it won't happen again. But we do not need multi-million dollar suits for smaller stuff. I don't disagree with that. I disagree that certain industries should be singled out for special protection, though. If a surgeon fucks up he can be sued for millions, but not, apparently, an HMO that makes a mistake. Where's ther logic in that? My health insurer makes mistakes in about 50% of the billings. And you know what, the mistake is ALWAYS in their favor. How's that for coincidence?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeyRamone 0 #38 June 25, 2004 Trent, Great job on keeping the facts in line....Cheers, Tim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
