Good for Israel

[chuteless 1]

The World Court, and Kofi Annan and the UN have all said that Israel should tear down their illegal wall that keeps the Palestinian murderers out of Israel.

Prime Minister Sharon has told them all the wall stays righty where it is,

It is said that the suicide bombings have been reduced up to 90 % in places where the wall is finished.

GOOD FOR ISRAEL
Bill Cole

[falxori 0]

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GOOD FOR ISRAEL

sadly no. not so good for israel.
yes, this court is a joke.
yes, it didn't even mention the reason for this fence (its only a wall where its near a major road), i.e terror.
yes, its decision was clear from the start and most of the western world said its a political issue rather than legal.
yes, it will be transferred to the UN where the arab world with its 52 votes will do whatever it want.
yes, its absurd when judges from egypt, jordan russia china, etc. judge others on humanitarian issues.

and yes to many other reasons because of which this court just lost its right of existance.

but no, i dont see it as a good thing. not to israel and no to the world.
mainly because there is one justice for strong countries and another for weaker.

and to all of you who will jump and say: " and now the US will use its veto right to bail israel out" all i have to say is that this action is the only thing that leaves any shred of dignity in this institute...

peace to all...
O

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Kennedy 0]

So when is the US going to follow suit?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[tunaplanet 0]

That's a good start. Now you need one up north to prevent those fucking Cannucks from getting in. Then we'll be perfect.

Forty-two

[jimbarry 0]

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So when is the US going to follow suit?

From SNL several years back. Norm Macdonald reading the "news":

"Last week in Arizona, Marine Corps Engineers extended a steel barrier between the United States and Mexico by two and a half miles. It's all part of a plan to make illegal aliens...

...walk an extra two and a half miles."

[rushmc 23]

Quote

The World Court, and Kofi Annan and the UN have all said that Israel should tear down their illegal wall that keeps the Palestinian murderers out of Israel.

Prime Minister Sharon has told them all the wall stays righty where it is,

It is said that the suicide bombings have been reduced up to 90 % in places where the wall is finished.

GOOD FOR ISRAEL
Bill Cole

Pay him,Kofi Annan, enough money, (Like the great president of Iraq did) and he will say or do what ever you want him too.

I wonder who payed him to take this position??

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[chuteless 1]

There is no need to keep the Canucks out....just stop Canada from exporting terrorists.

Bill Cole

[billvon 3,065]

>So when is the US going to follow suit?

When we'd land out in Mexico, the smart bet was always to find the ten year old kids. They knew where all the holes in the fence were. (Note that there _is_ a wall between US and Mexico near the San Diego/Tijuana border.) The advantages of a wall would be:

-employment for US contractors
-a shady spot for border jumpers to rest
-a political "victory" to prattle on about

It woudn't do a damn thing in terms of slowing down illegal immigration, though, even if we extended the existing walls (complete with lights at night and helicopter patrols) that we have in San Diego.

[Kennedy 0]

Right now I'd be happy if the fucknuts in DC would just give the Border Patrol anything more than lip service. Those guys need cash and support, not a blind eye.

Hell, I'd be happy if those dipshits would at least say something when the Mexican Army is shooting at US Federal employees on US soil (both the target and the shooter are on US soil as often as not).

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[billvon 3,065]

>Hell, I'd be happy if those dipshits would at least say something
> when the Mexican Army is shooting at US Federal employees on US
> soil . . .

At one point the Border Patrol was on the Mexican side of the fence with guns drawn, pointing at the Federales who were running after us; it (fortunately) got smoothed over, but that was the end of landing in Mexico and getting away with it. In another instance BP pursued a suspected coyote into Mexico, got him, then hauled butt out of there. (US agents kidnapping a Mexican citizen in Mexico??) Such things happen on occasion, and I think they are more due to misunderstanding where the border is and who's supposed to be where, rather than any malice on the part of either country.

But I agree that the BP needs better funding. They're stretched pretty thin even near the very populous areas around Tijuana; out by Ocotillo there is a pretty small chance a border jumper will be caught.

[falxori 0]

and that is when the problem is people crossing the border looking for a new, better life.

i wonder how the border would look like if it were mexicans armed with explosives on their ways to blow up buses in L.A...
and i wonder what would happen when the french would tell you that you can not protect yourselves.

(just as an example, not implying anything about mexicans )

O

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[metalslug 36]

A few things about this wall are puzzling to me.

(1) In the one picture I've seen, the wall appears to be no more than about 3-4 inches of concrete, not excessively high and no apparent wire or other deterrent on top of the wall.
Surely a determined bomber could find a way over, under or through the wall without too much trouble ?

(2) The World Court seemed to have an issue with the location of the wall, that the land it was placed on was currently 'disputed' land and therefore Israel did not have clear property rights to build there.
If it is "disputed land", would the Palestinians therefore be within their legal rights to destroy parts of the wall ?

(3) The World Court voted 14:1 on their judgement, the opposing vote was an American judge.
This seems to be in keeping with US policy on this issue, which makes me wonder if the US judge was merely towing the party line or whether he was truly acting in an impartial, judicial capacity.
I am not suggesting his judgement was bad or wrong, I'm just noting a pattern and asking a question.

[Botellines 0]

As far as i know, the only issue with the wall is where it is buing build, not the wall per se. It is like if mexico wanted to buil a wall taking inside their borders half of new mexico. I bet you wouldn´t be too happy about it.

[metalslug 36]

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As far as i know, the only issue with the wall is where it is buing build, not the wall per se. It is like if mexico wanted to buil a wall taking inside their borders half of new mexico. I bet you wouldn´t be too happy about it.

I'd only be unhappy if it interrupted exports of tequila.
I'm in Africa.

[falxori 0]

(1) most of the "wall" is a fence, no concrete at all.
its only concrete where there is a risk of a direct line of fire (near a major road or town)
would it stop an individual terrorist? maybe not. but it has reduced by almost 90% their ability to carry out attacks where it is built.

(2) the "world court" as you called it had a problem with the barrier itself and refused to acknowledge israel's right to defend itself with such a barrier.
not to mention that it had ignored the reasons for this barrier all together as if israel woke up one clear morning and thought "hey, wouldnt it be cool to build a barrier here...".
the isreali supreme court ruled against the route in some places and work was stopped until a different route is found.
i agree that in some places a different route should have been taken even if its not the best for security considerations.

(3)
and you think the egyptian or jordanian judges are any different?
and you can say the same for the russian chinese or any of the rest.
anyway, do you think a country who has no understanding on what it is like to live under a constant threat of terror has a right or a way to judge a country that is trying to defend itself ?(and whether you like it or not, the barrier is helping)

O

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[skydiver30960 0]

WARNING: overly optimistic, rose-colored opinion to follow:

This whole thing smacks of the Berlin Wall: a relatively small construction that became the centerpiece for fifty years of Cold War.

Barriers are not the answer (here's the overly optimistic part). If Jews and Palestinians want their own "space" that's fine, and they don't need to be best of friends either politically or socially, but they need to be able to act with enough civility to be able to mingle in the streets without kicking the shit out of each other. Putting up any kind of barrier will only increase the gap between the two cultures (through lack of interaction) and lead to future problems...

Elvisio "I did stay at a holiday inn express last night" rodriguez

[TheAnvil 0]

I agree Bill. They should keep up their construction efforts. The main reason many are opposed to this wall is its success in reducing terrorist infiltrations.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[jumpy 0]

Quote

The World Court, and Kofi Annan and the UN have all said that Israel should tear down their illegal wall that keeps the Palestinian murderers out of Israel.

Prime Minister Sharon has told them all the wall stays righty where it is,

It is said that the suicide bombings have been reduced up to 90 % in places where the wall is finished.

GOOD FOR ISRAEL
Bill Cole

No offense to you or your opinion intended but I don't think this wall is any kind of answer at all.
I think BOTH sides are just as bad as each other! Its just that Israel is the much more powerful of the two.
In my view (which is granted not highly informed on the issue) I can't see why the Palestinian's don't have right to their own country. It seems as though both sides want to beat the other.. rather then achieve peace...

[falxori 0]

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Barriers are not the answer

no one says its the answer.
its a temporary measure to stop terror attacks, just like TSA checks in US airports.

if there was no terror, there wouldn't have been a security fence. and when there will be no terror and normal peace talks could continue, there will be no need for it.
its not a political line, its a security one and i still want to believe there will be 2 states with open borders (when only peaceful people want to come here...).

O

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Steel 0]

Quote

WARNING: overly optimistic, rose-colored opinion to follow:

This whole thing smacks of the Berlin Wall: a relatively small construction that became the centerpiece for fifty years of Cold War.

Barriers are not the answer (here's the overly optimistic part). If Jews and Palestinians want their own "space" that's fine, and they don't need to be best of friends either politically or socially, but they need to be able to act with enough civility to be able to mingle in the streets without kicking the shit out of each other. Putting up any kind of barrier will only increase the gap between the two cultures (through lack of interaction) and lead to future problems...

Elvisio "I did stay at a holiday inn express last night" rodriguez

Those are two walls that were built for opposite reasons. Its almost funny that you would even mention it. The Berlin wall was built by the left (socialists) to keep their OWN people from escaping to a better system {you know more capitalist, right wing oriented}. This wall they are referring to here is a wall to keep the enemy out, to keep terrorist from causing havoc.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[PhillyKev 0]

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I agree Bill. They should keep up their construction efforts. The main reason many are opposed to this wall is its success in reducing terrorist infiltrations.

Yes, everyone is upset that it is reducing terrorist attacks. Where do you get these thoughts from?

[chuteless 1]

Well, Phillykev, I imagine the Palestinian murderers are upset because of the reduction in their atrocities.

If they cant send suicide bombers in to kill and maim innocent womwen and children, it must be terribly frustrating.

Bill Cole

[TheAnvil 0]

Many equals everyone? Odd sort of logic.

Ahh well.

Many Palestinians are upset for exactly the reason I alluded to earlier. I hope they continue to be upset. I hope even more that they cease to have reason to be, because they've chosen the path of peace over the one they're currently on.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

No offense to you or your opinion intended but I don't think this wall is any kind of answer at all.
I think BOTH sides are just as bad as each other! Its just that Israel is the much more powerful of the two.
In my view (which is granted not highly informed on the issue) I can't see why the Palestinian's don't have right to their own country. It seems as though both sides want to beat the other.. rather then achieve peace...

Israel's position is simple - they're surrounded by countries who don't acknowledge their right to exist and have invaded on numerous occasions. While full scale nation wars have ended since the Israeli nuclear arsenal came along, it has continued in a guerilla form. While the UN has been happy to decry any steps taken, they've been a bit less than helpful on stopping the aggression, so it can go fuck itself.

I have a hard time criticizing this stance. Their methods can range towards the brutal, but they're not presented with great alternatives. Concessions only work if the other side wants to compromise. We got hit with one severe attack and a few smaller ones and we tuned out the UN. It appears more like proof of tyranny of the masses than effective leadership.

[falxori 0]

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Israel's position is simple - they're surrounded by countries who don't acknowledge their right to exist and have invaded on numerous occasions. While full scale nation wars have ended since the Israeli nuclear arsenal came along, it has continued in a guerilla form.

yes and no.
israel is believed to have had nukes since the early 60s and there were several wars after that. ofcourse, israel having nukes doesnt mean israel is using nukes (cant be sure of that about other countries though...)

israel has signed a peace treaty with 2 of its neighbours and once iraq is not an issue, the only threat is Iran.
but you're right, full scale nation war is not the issue now . sadly the "rules of war" by which the UN is trying to judge israel are not applicaple for guerilla warfare and terror where the enemy has no army with distinct uniform and when it is acting from within civilian population.
not to mention the UN is hardly a balanced or fair organization...

O

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."