jazzjumper 0 #1 September 2, 2004 Woah! Now the source here is definitely right wing. However, things couldn't look worse for Kerry! I guess he shouldn't have led with his Vietnam service at every opportunity. Kerry Medals Still think it's a bunch of lying Swift Boat vets against Kerry and his (what is it now, 3?) band of brothers? No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frenchy68 0 #2 September 2, 2004 Do you have a link to the Chicago Sun Times article? I can't find it online, but am not that familiar with its website. Can't find the columnist listed as well (but maybe he's not a regular columnist). "For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #3 September 2, 2004 I think the NewMax article is taking a couple of things out of context and are trying to mislead the reader with the last paragraph. For instance, they make it appear as if General Thomas Wilkerson is a US Navy spokesman when in fact he is the president of the U.S. Naval Institute, which is a non-profit, non-governmental organization that virtually anyone with $39 can join.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #4 September 2, 2004 The NewsMax article doesn't refer to a Sun-Times article, just that the author works for the Sun-Times. I'm search the Navy PA sites to see if I can find out more info. I did preface my comments with NewsMax's particular political slant. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frenchy68 0 #5 September 2, 2004 I did preface my comments with NewsMax's particular political slan*** I got that I am not trolling, but sincerely interested to find out whether their statement is corroborated by any one, which would indeed make quite a splash. "For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #6 September 2, 2004 Me too, I'm searching the Navy PR stuff, and I have a call in to a Navy friend of mine inside the beltway to see if he can get confirmation. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #7 September 2, 2004 QuoteQuoteI think the NewMax article is taking a couple of things out of context and are trying to mislead the reader with the last paragraph. For instance, they make it appear as if General Thomas Wilkerson is a US Navy spokesman when in fact he is the president of the U.S. Naval Institute, which is a non-profit, non-governmental organization that virtually anyone with $39 can join. I don't, they mention Navy Spokesman in the 2nd para, but directly ID Gen Wilkerson in the final as a member of the US Navan Inst. I think you are reading in to it, but that is your option as the reader. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #8 September 2, 2004 QuoteFor instance, they make it appear as if General Thomas Wilkerson is a US Navy spokesman when in fact he is the president of the U.S. Naval Institute Perhaps, but in the rest of the article, the writer makes it fairly plain that the US NAVY, not the Institute, is conducting the investigation. The quote by Wilkerson is a comment on the appropriateness of having records in order, and not about the investigation. Regardless of that, if this is true (and one source just isn't good enough for me), then there is a real problem within Kerry's campaign, not to mention the man's integrity. Should be interesting to see how this pans out... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #9 September 2, 2004 But that's my point! They -don't- ID the spokesman then they leave the reader to assume that the spokesman is the General in the last paragraph. It's either very sloppy journalism they should have learned about in Journo 101 or it's an intentional effort to mislead.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #10 September 2, 2004 QuoteThey -don't- ID the spokesman then they leave the reader to assume that the spokesman is the General in the last paragraph. I see your point...interpretive reading and all that. But I also think that the difference was made clear... "It is to your best interest to have your record in good order," Gen. Thomas Wilkerson, the president of the U.S. Naval Institute, told Lipscomb. "If it is wrong, you are accountable. And if you use it to advance your career, it is even more important.” (emphasis mine). To me, that indicates another organization...and again, does not claim to be the one investigating the issue, just providing a comment on accountability and records. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #11 September 2, 2004 QuoteBut that's my point! They -don't- ID the spokesman then they leave the reader to assume that the spokesman is the General in the last paragraph. It's either very sloppy journalism they should have learned about in Journo 101 or it's an intentional effort to mislead. Funny how it's no problem for the left to cite a high ranking but unnamed source as gospel. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #12 September 2, 2004 QuoteQuoteBut that's my point! They -don't- ID the spokesman then they leave the reader to assume that the spokesman is the General in the last paragraph. It's either very sloppy journalism they should have learned about in Journo 101 or it's an intentional effort to mislead. So we just disregard the premise that the Navy is questioning Kerry's medals? No, I don't buy it. I think the story is interesting because of the way Kerry has proclaimed his service. It remains to be seen whether this story is corroberated. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #13 September 2, 2004 So is Judicial Watch http://www.judicialwatch.org/3794.shtml -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #14 September 2, 2004 QuotePerhaps, but in the rest of the article, the writer makes it fairly plain that the US NAVY, not the Institute, is conducting the investigation. Glad that's cleared up. I feel much better that the military is getting involved in political issues and campaign smear tactics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nanook 1 #15 September 2, 2004 What got my suspicion was the source identified as a "Navy Spokesman", not a spokesman from the Department of Veterans Affairs or Bureau of Naval Personnel or some other naval department that would really look into this._____________________________ "The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #16 September 2, 2004 QuoteDo you have a link to the Chicago Sun Times article? I can't find it online, but am not that familiar with its website. Can't find the columnist listed as well (but maybe he's not a regular columnist). This may be it: http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect/cst-nws-lips28.html -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #17 September 2, 2004 Something's weird here. The Newsmax article is premised on no Combat V being issued in connection with a Silver Star, which I believe is correct. But, I don't think Kerry ever claimed to have a Silver Star with Combat V. He claimed to have a Bronze Star with Combat V. Big difference. I'm pretty sure the Navy handed out those. Kerry & his campaign staff are idiots. He's getting creamed on this. The guy gets shot at in Vietnam while Bush was chasing p**** at home and he's on the defensive for his military service. As much as I dislike Kerry and think he would be a lousy President, he did serve in combat. Voluntarily. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #18 September 2, 2004 Well, you and Bill have been saying that anyone with evidence should report it to the proper authorities. Apparently, that is starting to happen. Still going to keep with the condescending attitude? (question to Bill, not Paul) QuoteJudicial Watch Calls For Investigation Into Kerry’s Medals, Anti-War Actions Formal Complaint Filed Over Senator’s Vietnam Awards, Post-Service Activities (Washington, D.C.) – Judicial Watch, the public interest group that investigates and prosecutes government corruption, today filed a request with the U.S. Navy and the Defense Department for an investigation into the awards granted to Sen. John Kerry during his service with the U.S. Navy in Vietnam. Judicial Watch also requested that military authorities investigate Kerry’s anti-war activities, including his meeting with North Vietnamese and Viet Cong delegations in Paris, while a member of the Naval Reserve. Basing its requests on a recently published book, Unfit for Command, by former Navy officer John E. O’Neill and Jerome R. Corsi, Ph.D, and on news media interviews of other officers and sailors who served with Kerry, Judicial Watch notes that unresolved allegations against Kerry include: false official reports and statements; dishonorable conduct; aiding the enemy; dereliction of duty; misuse and abuse of U.S. government equipment and property; war crimes; and multiple violations of U.S. Navy regulations and directives, the Uniform Code of Military Justice and the U.S. Code. Kerry was awarded three Purple Hearts, a Silver Star and a Bronze Star for “wounds” received and actions in Vietnam, but eyewitnesses refute his version of a number of the events that were the basis for receiving the commendations. Judicial Watch is asking the Department of Defense and the U.S. Navy, including its Department Board of Decorations and Medals, to look into the circumstances surrounding Kerry’s awards. Judicial Watch also is requesting an investigation of Kerry’s anti-war activities. After he was released from active duty but while he was a commissioned officer in the inactive Naval Reserve, Kerry joined the anti-war group Vietnam Veterans Against the War and traveled to Paris to meet with delegations from North Vietnam and the Communist Viet Cong. He held a press conference in Washington, D.C., following the meeting and advocated the “peace proposal,” which included war damage reparations, put forth by the North Vietnamese and Viet Cong. “The allegations concerning Kerry’s conduct during the Vietnam War are credible, serious and shocking,” said Judicial Watch President Tom Fitton. “The sooner an investigation begins, the better.” See complaint here.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #19 September 2, 2004 QuoteGlad that's cleared up. I feel much better that the military is getting involved in political issues and campaign smear tactics. The Navy is involved because Kerry has posted what appear to be fraudulent citations (and the Navy would know this since they should have copies of the originals.) They certainly know how they approve medals and that they don't approve valor devices for Silver Stars. Kerry led with this, people are just questioning the verasity of his claims. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #20 September 2, 2004 If true that Kerry is lying about that, is he the first? Are you telling me he's the only person who ever lied about getting medals in war? If not, then why do you suppose they would investigate him? Do you honestly believe it has nothing to do with politics? Do you think the military should take sides in elections? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #21 September 2, 2004 I just went to Kerry's website and he's posted PDF copies of his citations. He doesn't claim to have the SS w/V, but instead claims to have the BS w/ V. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 220 #22 September 2, 2004 QuoteQuotePerhaps, but in the rest of the article, the writer makes it fairly plain that the US NAVY, not the Institute, is conducting the investigation. Glad that's cleared up. I feel much better that the military is getting involved in political issues and campaign smear tactics. It would seem to me that if there are allegations of wrong doing that one would want to clear himself, if, in fact, the wrong doings are false accusations - wouldn't you, PK? If he did no wrong, what does he have to worry about?I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #23 September 2, 2004 QuoteDo you think the military should take sides in elections? Is conducting an investigation into allegations of FRAUD taking sides because it came to light because of the publicity of the accused? -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #24 September 2, 2004 QuoteIs conducting an investigation into allegations of FRAUD taking sides because it came to light because of the publicity of the accused? If they don't regularly conduct such investigations, than I would say it's definitely politically motivated. I don't know if they do or not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #25 September 2, 2004 QuoteIf true that Kerry is lying about that, is he the first? No, but he is touting his service and his record as credentials to be President. QuoteAre you telling me he's the only person who ever lied about getting medals in war? No, did I say that? No. QuoteIf not, then why do you suppose they would investigate him? They who? You mean the Navy? Probably because the then Secretary of the Navy stated he never signed a Silver Star for Kerry. Kerry posted his medals, and people complained, so they investigated it. QuoteDo you honestly believe it has nothing to do with politics? I could care less! Kerry brought this on himself. QuoteDo you think the military should take sides in elections? Nope, not institutionally. But we do vote. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
