TheAnvil 0 #1 September 7, 2004 Clicky Given the proclivity of these folks to protest, one wonders why no (or few) mass protests have been held protesting the profaning of their religion by such evil acts as those committed in Russia recently, 9/11, homicide bombers, etc. One can form a very tenable argument that silence indicates consent. Yet I know a Muslim or two and they don't approve of such acts at all. Thoughts anyone?Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #2 September 7, 2004 Well, how dare we think these extremist are not just garbage..... No, they deserve the benefit of the doubt. If you are hating someone, hate Bush, then all will be happy."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 220 #3 September 7, 2004 What is so sad Vinnie, is that before this thread is over, it will be misguided and turned to equal Bush's religious beliefs. Sad really that we are becoming desensitised to this sort of thing.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #4 September 7, 2004 QuoteWhat is so sad Vinnie, is that before this thread is over, it will be misguided and turned to equal Bush's religious beliefs. Well, the lefties can try, but if they are approached, fact by fact one can minimize the stupidity. QuoteSad really that we are becoming desensitised to this sort of thing. Are you kidding? I have a group of Russian/Ukrainian friends who want to kick ass right now! No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #5 September 7, 2004 There are plenty falks here getting ready to do that, if not doing it already.."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #6 September 7, 2004 From the article: QuoteSecond, the laudable condemnations of Islamic terror made by the Islamic Center notwithstanding, why are there virtually no public demonstrations of Muslims against the unspeakable evils committed by its adherents? I've been asking this question since September 11th, 2001. To date, no one has given me any viable answer. Oh, some people pointed at some minute articles, that received no publicity, about some group or leader here and there making a token "terrorism is bad" effort. But no widespread denunciation has occurred... and if it has... why haven't we seen it on a large public scale?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 220 #7 September 7, 2004 yes - but the number of those that scream bloody murder is dropping. For instance - Where are the liberals and their human rights activists - what is being done by them about this? What the desensitisation is is politics. All those, that would let their beliefs known, fall silent if their political leaning isn't benifited. In other words, Bush is, we all are, fighting a war on terrorism. If the liberals voiced it too much - it would support Bush in his (our) fight against evils, such as this. They simply cannot stand that idea, so they shut their mouths and calm their voices, and hope it will fade into the background while we all fight their battle for them.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #8 September 7, 2004 From the article: QuoteIt is, of course, only a minority of Muslims that engages in such horrors, but it is only Muslims who are doing all these things. Christians aren't -- even among Palestinians, there are no Christian terrorists. Jews aren't -- and when one Jew did deliberately kill innocent Palestinians in 1994, the rest of the Jewish world was horrified and demonstrated its revulsion in word and deed. Buddhists aren't -- despite the destruction of Tibet by the Chinese Communists, no Buddhists have murdered innocent Chinese, let alone non-Chinese who deal with China. Well off the top of my head: the IRA are christians. ETA are christians. Also, Israel does targeted killings. Israel fires tank shells into demonstrating crowds. The US sexually abuses prisoners, invades nations 'by mistake' and thinks its ok to cause thousands of collateral damage deaths (how many of them were children?). and a soldier from the UK has just been arrested for murder in Iraq. Russia has been committing war crimes in Chechnya for centuries, they are predominately christians, jews and muslims. Chechnya is comprised of muslims and christians terrorising Russia in an attempt to gain independence yet again. And Rwanda is full of Catholics, although not as full as it used to be. QuoteMost Americans have no a priori view of Islam. As far as they are concerned, it is one more religion that its practitioners ought to be able to practice in peace just as the members of every other faith in America do. Can this possibly be true any more? Muslims have been totally demonised in recent years. The number of comments on this site referring to Glass Parking Lots is testament to that. This Author is a lie-peddling bigot. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jazzjumper 0 #9 September 7, 2004 QuoteThe US sexually abuses prisoners, invades nations 'by mistake' and thinks its ok to cause thousands of collateral damage deaths (how many of them were children?). and a soldier from the UK has just been arrested for murder in Iraq. You act as though the entire US supports the 6 Guardsmen who committed those crimes. Oh, and by the way, we didn't invade Iraq by mistake. We did it on purpose, and would do it again. The whole WMD thingy is a media frenzy...we didn't go in there for WMDs. The difference in the US and GB is that we police ourselves. The people responsible for these problems are being taken to court. As far as thousands of collateral damage deaths? You are off by an order of magnatude. But, yes, innocent people do get killed in wars. Thankfully we have the types of precision weapons that minimize that sort of thing. No matter how good she looks, someone, somewhere is sick of her shit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #10 September 7, 2004 the US Gov. spends billions of dollars developing precision weapons so that they can avoid collateral damage and destroy the enemy. I don't see how you can say that the US thinks it is ok to cause thousands of collateral damage deaths. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #11 September 7, 2004 The parallels you present are tenuous at best. Many Spaniards openly deplore the ETA. Many Catholics and Protestants worldwide condemn the violence in Northern Ireland as profaning Christianity. The entire world condemned the genocide in Rwanda. The same people that started a small war over the visit of a conservative Jewish cleric to a shrine in Jerusalem have no public outrage when their religion is profaned in such a manner as the Chechens did recently in Russia. It is indeed cause for concern and question. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #12 September 7, 2004 Where was the mass protests in the Vatican when the IRA was in full force? Mass public media coverage is only possible when it actually affects everyone. Locally most the mosques have had "anti-terrorism" type candle light vigils and other events but it barely makes the local nightly news and you expect to to be carried on the front page of the WSJ? If the Pope issues a command is it on the front page of the papers or is it buried in the middle to the back? And thats in the countries that are mostly christian and its targeted against. I've shown links to articles where top Islam leaders are condeming the actions and asking for no more terrorism to occur, but why would anything other then the targeted audience have that message broadcast to them? Journalism 101, identify your audience and only send the message to them. Do you think that Iraq is the lead story in Kenya everyday or is it more likely more local or news that affects the media's local audience more?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #13 September 7, 2004 QuoteYou act as though the entire US supports the 6 Guardsmen who committed those crimes. Not at all. I'm sure many people in the US were horrified. But given that 80% of US prisoners get abused its not really surprising that some Iraqis did too, is it? QuoteOh, and by the way, we didn't invade Iraq by mistake. We did it on purpose, and would do it again. The whole WMD thingy is a media frenzy...we didn't go in there for WMDs. You actually know the *real* reason for the invasion? You know more than your own President! QuoteAs far as thousands of collateral damage deaths? You are off by an order of magnatude. Got any evidence whatsoever to back up that claim? QuoteBut, yes, innocent people do get killed in wars. Thankfully we have the types of precision weapons that minimize that sort of thing. I'm sure the remaining Iraqis are very grateful for that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #14 September 7, 2004 Quotethe US Gov. spends billions of dollars developing precision weapons so that they can avoid collateral damage and destroy the enemy. I don't see how you can say that the US thinks it is ok to cause thousands of collateral damage deaths. Maybe 'ok' is the wrong word. How about 'acceptable'? The level of civilian casualties in Iraq is acceptable to the US government and the governments of the coallition of the willing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdhill 0 #15 September 7, 2004 QuoteGot any evidence whatsoever to back up that claim? Got any to back up your's? There are plenty of websites that count bodies from this war, most of them with an anti-war slant... pick any one of them, say IBC, and you will see that the majority of non-combatant deaths have been casued by either terrorists or insurgents. JAll that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #16 September 7, 2004 QuoteThe parallels you present are tenuous at best. Many Spaniards openly deplore the ETA. Many ... Re-read the article. It says christians, jews etc. don't do things like that. They do. Its funny isn't it how when someone is spouting rubbish one likes the sound of one can be very forgiving about the accuracy of the facts, but when its someone one doesn't like, lets say MM for example, one picks up on every little truth-twist and inaccuracy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdhill 0 #17 September 7, 2004 QuoteThe level of civilian casualties in Iraq is acceptable to the US government and the governments of the coallition of the willing. From a political point of view, yes. And they are still lower than those who died at the former Iraqi government's hands. JAll that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #18 September 7, 2004 Quote ...we didn't go in there for WMDs. How can you state something like that! ? GWB now will look like a liar, don't you know? Holy Moses! dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #19 September 7, 2004 QuoteQuoteThe US sexually abuses prisoners, invades nations 'by mistake' and thinks its ok to cause thousands of collateral damage deaths (how many of them were children?). and a soldier from the UK has just been arrested for murder in Iraq. You act as though the entire US supports the 6 Guardsmen who committed those crimes. Oh, and by the way, we didn't invade Iraq by mistake. We did it on purpose, and would do it again. The whole WMD thingy is a media frenzy...we didn't go in there for WMDs. . Methinks you should re-read Bush's State of the Union Address, January 2002, and Colin Powell's address to the UN Security Council, March 2002. Maybe they know better than you why we went in there, and they say pretty clearly that it was on account of WMDs.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #20 September 7, 2004 QuoteThere are plenty of websites that count bodies from this war, most of them with an anti-war slant... pick any one of them, say IBC, and you will see that the majority of non-combatant deaths have been casued by either terrorists or insurgents. Maybe you are right - I couldn't be arsed adding up the columns to work out whose killed the most. The figure that shocked me is "Over 18,000 medical evacuations have occurred, 11,700 of which have been considered wounded, according to Pentagon statistics" http://www.infoshout.com/wounded.htm That is a fuck of a lot of US injuries. Can that be right? Do you guys know how many wounded soldiers have been sent home from Iraq? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #21 September 7, 2004 We did this before... if the fact that heads of state are condemning the attacks makes MY nightly news... you'd think that heads of a religion condemning the attacks would too. In fact, I remember seeing statements from the Pope against terrorism. I remember seeing statements from the Pope against the war in Iraq. You'd think that if I saw all this in the news, any condemnation of any sincerity or weight would appear if it came from Muslim leaders who actually had any sort of power in that religion. The real problem is that you don't see any type of rallying against this type of behavior from islam, even IF it exists in any kind of majority. Call a spade a spade.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #22 September 8, 2004 A Christian or Jew has killed children screaming God be praised? Odd thing - I haven't seen that in the news. Or perhaps you were referring to the Christan or Jewish homicide bombers? Oh. Haven't seen that either. OH! It must be the Christians and Jews hijacking airplanes to which you are referring! Oh. Err...Uhhh....no. Not that either. So to what, exactly, are you referring? You claim Mr. Prager lies - fine. Point out his lies. As of yet, you haven't. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mfnren 2 #23 September 8, 2004 Minimize that sort of thing??? we went to war under the pretense of defending our nation against terrorists who take the lives of innocent people for their own gain. How can we say that the lives of the innocent people we kill, are acceptable casualties?? Those are innocent people just like those that died in 9/11. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,489 #24 September 8, 2004 QuoteOr perhaps you were referring to the Christan or Jewish homicide bombers? Something like this maybe? QuoteThe Omagh bombing was a car bomb attack carried out by the Real IRA on August 15, 1998, against civilians in Omagh, Northern Ireland. The Real IRA are a small splinter group of former Provisional Irish Republican Army members opposed to the peace process marked by the Good Friday Agreement. 29 people were killed in the attack, including one woman who was pregnant with twins. Roughly 220 people were injured.... ....On the day of the bombing, the Ulster Television newsroom in Belfast received false warnings as to the location of the bomb. As a result the Royal Ulster Constabulary directed civilians away from the named site towards the actual location of the bomb.... ......Many of the others were later sued in a civil action by the relatives of people killed in the bombing, including the families of James Barker, 12, Samantha McFarland, 17, Lorraine Wilson, 15, and 20-month-old Breda Devine. It's pretty famous, I'm sure you must have heard about it. Not the same scale maybe, but sick none the less.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #25 September 8, 2004 QuoteQuoteOr perhaps you were referring to the Christan or Jewish homicide bombers? Something like this maybe? QuoteThe Omagh bombing was a car bomb attack carried out by the Real IRA on August 15, 1998, against civilians in Omagh, Northern Ireland. The Real IRA are a small splinter group of former Provisional Irish Republican Army members opposed to the peace process marked by the Good Friday Agreement. 29 people were killed in the attack, including one woman who was pregnant with twins. Roughly 220 people were injured.... ....On the day of the bombing, the Ulster Television newsroom in Belfast received false warnings as to the location of the bomb. As a result the Royal Ulster Constabulary directed civilians away from the named site towards the actual location of the bomb.... ......Many of the others were later sued in a civil action by the relatives of people killed in the bombing, including the families of James Barker, 12, Samantha McFarland, 17, Lorraine Wilson, 15, and 20-month-old Breda Devine. It's pretty famous, I'm sure you must have heard about it. Not the same scale maybe, but sick none the less. Don't confuse him with facts, he's a Bush supporter.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
