Arguments for (or against) the existence of God

[billvon 3,058]

>Can you explain why the four questions I asked you are contradicting
>since you are so well versed with your 4 years of catholic school? I'll wait
>for your answer.

I did, but you wanted one word answers, so you ignored my explanations.

[pajarito 0]

I’m not so sure. Maybe you would (I would hope so) but I doubt it would be much different with everyone else. How much more is the faith of someone who has not seen or touched but still believes? It’s easy and almost not worth as much, in my opinion, when something is handed to you on a silver platter.

Jesus appears to Thomas

Now Thomas (called Didymus), one of the Twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came. So the other disciples told him, “We have seen the Lord!” But he said to them, “Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it.” A week later his disciples were in the house again and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.” Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!” Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet believed.”
John 20:24-29

[tunaplanet 0]

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I did

No, you didn't.

Can you explain why each of those four questions are contradicting according to Genesis?

Forty-two

[billvon 3,058]

>Can you explain why each of those four questions are contradicting
>according to Genesis?

I will, and you'll say "that's not what Genesis says." And I'll explain what happened to the original creation myth and how it was changed by early writers of the bible. And you'll say "so I have proven that the bible is all wrong." And I'll say you're missing the point again. And we'll be back where we started.

Believe whatever you want, in terms as simplistic as you choose. It's your life.

[brits17 0]

You are quite steadfast in your allegations that there is no 'proof.' I will reiterate what Pajarito asked, "what's your standard of proof?"

_______________________
aerialkinetics.com

[pajarito 0]

One at a time:

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1. Did God bring forth every living creature including all the fowls from dry ground or from the waters?

My answer: Both

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That would be correct in 1:20 & 21 which states, "every living creature is brought forth from the waters, including every winged fowl."

But in 2:19 it says, "God brings forth every beast of the field and every fowl of the air from dry ground."

I don’t see it that way. Genesis 1:20-21 talks about creatures of the sea and birds. It doesn’t say that birds come from the ocean. Also, if you read further in Genesis 1:24-25, it talks about land creatures. Let’s compare the two verses you quoted.

And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky.” So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1:20-21

Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground all of the beasts of the field and all the birds of the air. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name.
Genesis 2:19

I don’t see contradiction here.

[kelpdiver 2]

Are you guys citing from different translations? His quoted phrases don't match your quoted versus.

Which leads to a conclusion - if you're reading a translation literally for proof, you're in trouble.

[tunaplanet 0]

1:20 & 21 states, "every living creature is brought forth from the waters, including every winged fowl."

2:19 it states, "God brings forth every beast of the field and every fowl of the air from dry ground."



Can't see the contradiction there, huh? Wow. Simply amazing.

I guess there's a reason why people refer to it as "blind faith".

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

What are you quoting from?

[tunaplanet 0]

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What are you quoting from?

The bible.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

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What are you quoting from?

The bible.

Seriously Tuna. I realize this might have gotten a little heated for you but I'm not trying to be confrontational. I'm also trying to be very specific. I stated my version. What's yours so we can compare.

Edit to add: Sorry...maybe I didn't. My quotes came from the New International Version.

[tunaplanet 0]

I stated my quotes directly from the bible.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

So did I...

Translation? NIV, KJV, ASV, etc.

[pajarito 0]

This is like Fox News. I’ll put out the information. You decide.
Here are a few different translations. They’re worded somewhat differently but say about the same thing.

New International Version (NIV)
And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky.” So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1:20-21

King James Version (KJV)
And God said, "Let the waters bring forth swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the firmament of the heavens." So God created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarm, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind.
Genesis 1:20-21

New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Then God said, "Let the waters teem with swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth in the open expanse of the heavens." God created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarmed after their kind and every winged bird after its kind; and God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1:20-21

Or...if you're Catholic:

New American Bible (U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops)
Then God said, "Let the water teem with an abundance of living creatures, and on the earth let birds fly beneath the dome of the sky." And so it happened: God created the great sea monsters and all kinds of swimming creatures with which the water teems, and all kinds of winged birds. God saw how good it was, Genesis 1:20-21

I haven’t seen a version yet that says that all creatures came from the ocean.

[tunaplanet 0]

1:20 & 21 states, "every living creature is brought forth from the waters, including every winged fowl."

2:19 it states, "God brings forth every beast of the field and every fowl of the air from dry ground."


Just in case you missed that the first time. Quoting directly from KJ.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

I didn’t miss what you posted the first time. You must not be quoting directly.
I’m looking at many translations. You mentioned King James. Below are the translations for versus 20-21 in both NKJV and KJV. They don’t match up with what you’re saying.

New King James Version (NKJV)
Then God said, "Let the waters abound with an abundance of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the face of the firmament of the heavens." So God created great sea creatures and every living thing that moves, with which the waters abounded, according to their kind, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1:20-21

King James Version (KJV)
And God said, "Let the waters bring forth swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the firmament of the heavens." So God created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarm, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind.
Genesis 1:20-21

[tunaplanet 0]

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They don’t match up with what you’re saying.

Yours don't match up with what mine say.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

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They don’t match up with what you’re saying.

Yours don't match up with what mine say.

O...K....
Well, we've got to be on the same sheet of music before we can discuss your accusation of contradiction. Just because you say that's what it says doesn't make it so. I can't believe that your KJV is different from the one I'm looking at unless you're looking at some unauthorized cult version written by somebody in Utah. I've quoted from many different translations including the Catholic bible. I think the preponderance of the evidence is on my side. I challenge anyone out there to correct the versions that I’ve posted. If they are in error, I completely apologize. It was not intentional and I’ve tried to be as exact as possible.

[tunaplanet 0]

I can't help it your bible is full of contradictions. Don't get mad at me because your book is full of lies. Get mad at God, Jesus, the Holy Ghost, the Easter Bunny, Santa Clause or whatever other fictional characters are in the bible.

There's a reason it's called, "The greatest story ever told."

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

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I can't help it your bible is full of contradictions. Don't get mad at me because your book is full of lies. Get mad at God, Jesus, the Holy Ghost, the Easter Bunny, Santa Clause or whatever other fictional characters are in the bible.

There's a reason it's called, "The greatest story ever told."

Look, you can believe whatever you want to believe. All I'm really concerned with are the false accusations based on misquoted text. If you're going to make the claim, be prepared to "accurately" back it up. Again, no offense meant. I just can't let stuff like that slide. Most Americans don't believe that it's a book of lies.

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[tunaplanet 0]

The funny thing is the versions you state say the same contradictions.

See, you can spew any version you wish but it doesn't change the fact that it's a contradiction any way you slice it.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

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The funny thing is the versions you state say the same contradictions.

See, you can spew any version you wish but it doesn't change the fact that it's a contradiction any way you slice it.

Ellaborate on the contradictions within my posted versions.

[tunaplanet 0]

If you can't read your own version and see the contradictions you will never see them. Give me a sec. I have some more contradictions coming.

Forty-two

[pajarito 0]

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If you can't read your own version and see the contradictions you will never see them. Give me a sec. I have some more contradictions coming.

Be specific. I'm not going to argue a laundry list of stuff you pull from a Google search. Like I said before, let's take this one problem at at time. This one is obviously not resolved.

[tunaplanet 0]

We'll play some more. See if you can do better than Billvon.

Answer either of these for me.

1. What hour was Jesus crucified?

2. How did Judas die?

Forty-two