Guest #1 November 2, 2004 A Dutch filmmaker has been murdered for making a short-subject film criticizing Islam's treatment of women. In the most liberal of states in the most liberal of continents, a filmmaker has been murdered simply for speaking his mind on film. As much as I despise Michael Moore, I don't object to his right to pump out propaganda and hypocrisy - let the marketplace of ideas decide what value it has (however, that's kinda tough when all the stores stock the same brand - heh). Guess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. Thoughtful, tolerant people would engage in a debate, or at least produce some kind of rebuttal, even if it's a lot of loud rhetoric. Where is Hollywood's outrage? Oh, guess they're too busy campaigning for Kerry to notice this one. mh . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 November 2, 2004 The story -did- just break today. If you're looking for outrage, you're going to have to at least wait until we wake up (figurative or literal -- you decide). As for the comment about this being election day and everyone's attention being focused on that -- well, you're right. That's simply the way it is and as sad as it is to say for the family of Van Gogh, the US election is more important than the murder of a single independant film maker. IF it is proven that he was killed for his views, then I'm sure there will be some press on this, but right now, I don't even see anything in the story that indicates he was killed for his views or films.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frenchy68 0 #3 November 2, 2004 QuoteWhere is Hollywood's outrage? Right here: I'm outraged! QuoteOh, guess they're too busy campaigning for Kerry to notice this one. It's very likely "they" knew about it before you even did. "They" just didn't post it on dz.com. QuoteThoughtful, tolerant people would engage in a debate, or at least produce some kind of rebuttal, even if it's a lot of loud rhetoric Agreed. There are assholes everywhere. Some gun down film makers, others gun down abortion clinic employees. Get rid of them all. "For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TypicalFish 0 #4 November 2, 2004 Actually, it should be "Religious Fanatics Kill Again"... I have no problem with your outrage (who would?), but your tone is borderline phobic. The Jews do it, the Christians do it, hell, even BUDDHISTS do it in the name of their "religion"..."I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #5 November 2, 2004 Quote Guess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. . Or it is and the vocal/aggressive minority make better news than those sitting at home and living good lives? Each religion has its own black sheep, and many religions have a violent history. However, those that are true to the words preached are often the real representation of that faith._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #6 November 2, 2004 QuoteQuote Guess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. . Or it is and the vocal/aggressive minority make better news than those sitting at home and living good lives? Each religion has its own black sheep, and many religions have a violent history. However, those that are true to the words preached are often the real representation of that faith. I rest my case. mh . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #7 November 2, 2004 pretty much every major religion has fanatics who kill in the name of their god. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #8 November 2, 2004 Quotepretty much every major religion has fanatics who kill in the name of their god. They've never been so highly organized on such a mass scale with technology before (Shinriku aside). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #9 November 2, 2004 Do I really need to bring up the Crusades. They were pretty damn well organized, and they had some pretty nifty technology for the times. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #10 November 3, 2004 QuoteDo I really need to bring up the Crusades. They were pretty damn well organized, and they had some pretty nifty technology for the times. No, there's no need, considering that this is the 21st Century, not the 11th. mh . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #11 November 3, 2004 The willingness to overlook the current atrocities officially condoned by Islam because of what happened centuries ago is not a defensible position, in my opinion. Christians that kill abortion doctors in the name of their religion are not sanctioned by mainstream churches, and are sought/prosecuted by authorities. Islam is the modern day religion of death/prejudice/intolerance etc. Republicans are hated if they oppose gay marriage. Where is the hate, or even condemnation for Arab cultures that do not support gay rights or women or religious rights etc.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #12 November 3, 2004 I believe that if Islam was truly a religion of peace, and its adherents truly were outraged at "radical Islamists" murdering innocent people by the thousands (as they do), it would be no big thing for the allegedly huge peaceful majority to FORCE TO FACE JUSTICE those among them who are the radical violent "minority." How hard would it be if you lived in an apartment building with 1000 other people, and just three of them were running a drug lab, to get them forced out, or to get attention brought upon them by the authorities? I don't see true cooperation from the Islamic world to get the terrorists among them exposed. I find it very hard to believe that no one -- no informant, no neighbor, no disenfranchised former member -- can come forward and tell us where the terrorists who keep kidnaping and beheading innocent people are hiding, or who they are. To me, that speaks of quiet complicity in these atrocities. -Jeffrey-Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #13 November 4, 2004 QuoteIslam is the modern day religion of death/prejudice/intolerance etc I dont think you can blame the religion of Islam for the poor implementation of a some followers. Most Islam people wont support murder of this kind. Christianity would not likely be considered a religion of death - but Christians still kill people just as muslims do. As for intolerance? Most mainstream religions arent... for example Catholocism isnt really tollerant of homosexuality, contraception, abortion The very nature of religion (guidance for what you should do / believe) goes against accepting the things you shouldnt do. I think its too easy to stereotype Islam and muslims in this way - but not at all right Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #14 November 4, 2004 QuoteGuess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. Christians under the orders of their Christian commander in chief, the neanderthal Mr. Bush, have murdered over 14,000 muslims in Iraq. Guess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PeteH 0 #15 November 4, 2004 Quote Guess it's not the "Religion of Peace" that it's made out to be. No. Christianity is the Religion of Peace. http://www.guardian.co.uk/bush/story/0,7369,465575,00.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #16 November 4, 2004 Sorry... youre close... Christianity is 'A' religion of peace... But it could also be said of most religions including Islam. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
harryskydives 0 #17 November 5, 2004 over 14,000 muslims in Iraq... So George Bush's Policy in Iraq does seem to be working, well. The Death Toll is down quite a bit from the 1,300,000+ murdered by Saddam. Christians under the orders of... the United States Military does not practice a religion, and many US soldiers practice no specific religion. Don't run out of altitude and experience at the same time... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #18 November 5, 2004 QuoteSorry... you're close... Christianity is 'A' religion of peace... But it could also be said of most religions including Islam. HAH. Christianity is a philosophy, not a religion, but I'm sure that's lost among atheists, or those who are values-neutral. Catholicism is a religion. Also, please make an effort to separate the messenger from the message. The message in Christianity is the words of Christ, the Earthly son of the Almighty, whereas the Koran is the bile from a prophet, of which the Old Testament has many too. Seems like there was a lot of that crap going around back then. Islam is also a little different, in that there is an outright advocacy of violence in the Koran. There is loads of similiar nonsense in the Old Testament, but NOT in the New Testament. And therein lies the difference. Offhand, I can only recall two instances in the New Testament in which Jesus made remarks about violence. One of those was in a general philosophical context (a warning about the separation of the righteous from the unrighteous, not the ususal Old Testament bloodiness, thank you very much), and the other was an admonition to the Apostles to prepare for His arrest. The major source of confusion among the peoples of Palestine was in tryng to understand that He was what the Father meant Him to be and not necessarily what the peoples in those (Roman-dominated) lands were expecting and hoping for. Whereas, the Koran is replete with direct orders to the faithful to brutalize and destroy those who do not "submit". Western Fundamentalist whackos quote the Old Testament quite often, but ignore the New. That is the flaw in some variants of Christianity (they also seem to think the KJV is the "Word of God" [TM] for some strange reason. I say to them - "Yo! Wanna get the WORD? Then learn GREEK or ARAMAIC, fer cryin' out loud!"). OTOH, the towel-wrappers have only one book to draw their hate-filled marching orders from. Interesting, isn't it? "May you always live in interesting times." - alleged Chinese curse Respectfully, mh . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frenchy68 0 #19 November 5, 2004 QuoteChristianity is a philosophy, not a religion How so? How do you define either one? QuoteIslam is also a little different, in that there is an outright advocacy of violence in the Koran. Develop...? I am an expert in neither the Koran, nor the old and new testament. I'd love to have you elaborate on them though. "For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #20 November 5, 2004 QuoteSo George Bush's Policy in Iraq does seem to be working, well. The Death Toll is down quite a bit from the 1,300,000+ murdered by Saddam. I heard that Iraqis are dying at a higher rate now than under SH. Give Bush some credit, he's only just got started with this war. He's managed over 10% of that in such a short time. How long did SH take to do his? Its kind of enlightening that you measure success in terms of slaughtering fewer people than SH did. Thats nice. Quotethe United States Military does not practice a religion, and many US soldiers practice no specific religion. Likewise with Iraqis. You can split hairs if you want to, but however you stack it your CIC is a Christian, America is a Christian nation and Christian US troops have killed thousands of Muslims. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #21 November 5, 2004 I just posted this in the thread started up about a terrorist attack on the houses of parliament (400 years ago - "bonfire night"). Thought it was equally relevant here. Quote "Bonfire Night" is reference to the capture of a Catholic suicide bomber from 400 years ago. He was carrying out the mandate of the Pope who had excommunicated the King thus ensuring reverence for whoever killed him... hmmm... does that not sound a little like a Fatwa urging Jehad? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #22 November 5, 2004 Thats just getting lazy Matt, using the same material for different topics and cutting out typing an brain power! Good for you Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #23 November 5, 2004 well it is a friday after all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
