PhillyKev 0 #176 December 21, 2004 QuoteNo, they wanted to keep the Emperor in power. We wanted UNCONDITIONAL and we only got that after the Emperor asked the Japanese congress to grant it, and he only did that after we dropped the second bomb...And even then it was with great reluctance and one member comited Hari Kari (Ritual Suicide) in disgrace. Don't you think it a little suspect that they said, we'll surrender if the emperor retains power. We said no and dropped a couple nukes. Then they surrender and we let the emperor retatin power. What was the reason for the nukes? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #177 December 21, 2004 QuoteI don't.... Why would you assume that american history books are anymore biased than say Swiss books or German books or English books???? Because America is soooo Bad? Switzerland remained neutral during WWII. They have a better education system than we do. It stands to reason that I would be more likely to find an honest, unbiased account in one of their books, as opposed to a history book from America, Japan, or Germany, who were all involved in the war, and thus are likely to have added a propaganda spin to their history books.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #178 December 21, 2004 QuoteSwitzerland remained neutral during WWII. On paper they did, though their banking system made an absolute fortune doing business with them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunaplanet 0 #179 December 21, 2004 Well the good news about this thread is you really get to see which American posters hate America and all it stands for. Forty-two Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #180 December 21, 2004 . QuoteThat's not even my quote - what a dirty trick regardless of whether or not I agree with the statement. Here is your quote, unless someone is posting on your identity: "Much like saying you shouldn't be proud of your child because they occasionally make mistakes even though overall they turned out ok. Tell that to a parent. I think you guys are taking the word 'pride' to something unhealthy and wierd' I don't think it was a low or dirty trick at all. As for being an angry person, well, I'll just dismiss that as a reckless personal attack. You obviously do not know me or you would know how comical your statement isMath tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #181 December 21, 2004 QuoteOn paper they did, though their banking system made an absolute fortune doing business with them. Prescott Bush comes to mind, as does Henry Ford. You should be careful who you accuse of war profiteering.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #182 December 21, 2004 QuoteWell the good news about this thread is you really get to see which American posters hate America and all it stands for. And we can tell from many threads who hates American values of freedom, justice and democracy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #183 December 21, 2004 Quote Well the good news about this thread is you really get to see which American posters hate America and all it stands for. I you would cease with your overgeneralizations, you might realize that no one has claimed to hate everything America stands for. Some people simply refuse to be blindly patriotic when they understand that their government is not operating justly. That is in no way hatred of country.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #184 December 21, 2004 QuotePrescott Bush comes to mind, as does Henry Ford. You should be careful who you accuse of war profiteering. Not careful at all. I have indicated that before. Many here have no problem with the President's family wealth coming from Nazies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunaplanet 0 #185 December 21, 2004 QuoteAnd we can tell from many threads who hates American values of freedom, justice and democracy. Yes, we certainly can. Pretty much the same sort of people I mentioned earlier. Forty-two Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #186 December 21, 2004 No, I was referring to people who advociate beating women for speaking their mind, like Linda Ronstadt. Or torturing prisoners because they might have information. Or ridiculing others for having a differing opinion. You know the type. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikkey 0 #187 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuote I feel exactly the opposite. Me, too. I just happened to be born in America, and my family just happens to live here. If I was born in Ireland, I would be any less fortunate to the country that I lived in. They have certain advantages over America. If someone gets killed in America or anywhere else, it makes me equally sad. No, I really don't understand why people are "proud" to be Americans. Other countries have freedoms we don't have and vice versa. America just happens to be the place where I grew up. Many of the things that my parents' taxes paid for while growing up I could've received elsewhere. It may be a great country, but there are others. It's not the best country in the world. It has advantages over other countries, but they have advantages over us. Finally a voice of reason. Very good post. I was born in one country with the citizenship of a second, grew up in a third country , moved to the country of my family, then to a fourth and now have been permanently settled in a fifth country far away. I have worked in many other countries and worked with people of 20-30 different nationalities. What I have learned is to understand and respect that people are different and that all countries and cultures have something good (and bad) to offer. I am still very fond of the country of my forefathers and what it stands for, but I do not engage in blind patriotism which unfortunately is quite common – especially among posters in this forum. Getting back to the title of this thread: I think the problem many people have with Americans is the attitude that the “American way” is the only way. I have said it before but Baghdad is not Atlanta. I recently had a chat with an Australian soldier who just returned from Baghdad and he told me that it was this “my way or the highway” attitude of the Americans that was upsetting a lot of Iraqis. He also said that the relationship between other coalition troops and the populous was far better due the difference in attitude.--------------------------------------------------------- When people look like ants - pull. When ants look like people - pray. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #188 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuoteSo get up from your computers and do something...I did.. Todays world of broadband and Google are what make it poosible for individuals to stay informed and make a difference from their computers, if the so choose. ROFLAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!! I'm dying laughing...!!! I didn't think it was possible for someone to completely miss the point of a post or to completely skip over all the meaningful parts...BUT...WE have a winner...... I'm still laughing... ~R+R...I hope you find this post meaningless...and un"productive"......~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #189 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo get up from your computers and do something...I did.. Todays world of broadband and Google are what make it poosible for individuals to stay informed and make a difference from their computers, if the so choose. ROFLAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!! I'm dying laughing...!!! I didn't think it was possible for someone to completely miss the point of a post or to completely skip over all the meaningful parts...BUT...WE have a winner...... I'm still laughing... ~R+R...I hope you find this post meaningless...and un"productive"...... OMG Sounds to me like a nervous breakdown. Or just a little overreaction? dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #190 December 21, 2004 Quote In Reply To In Reply To So get up from your computers and do something...I did.. Todays world of broadband and Google are what make it poosible for individuals to stay informed and make a difference from their computers, if the so choose. ROFLAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LaughLaughLaugh OMG!!! I'm dying laughing...!!!LaughLaughLaugh I didn't think it was possible for someone to completely miss the point of a post or to completely skip over all the meaningful parts...BUT...WE have a winner...LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh... I'm still laughing... ~R+RAngelic...I hope you find this post meaningless...and un"productive"... Minds are like parachutes. They only function when open. Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #191 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteSo get up from your computers and do something...I did.. Todays world of broadband and Google are what make it poosible for individuals to stay informed and make a difference from their computers, if the so choose. ROFLAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!! I'm dying laughing...!!! I didn't think it was possible for someone to completely miss the point of a post or to completely skip over all the meaningful parts...BUT...WE have a winner...... I'm still laughing... ~R+R...I hope you find this post meaningless...and un"productive"...... OMG Sounds to me like a nervous breakdown. Or just a little overreaction? That's coming from a European standpoint...so...I'll just ignore it...but thanks for your input...... ~R+R...You guys are a riot! Absolute riot......~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #192 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuote In Reply To In Reply To So get up from your computers and do something...I did.. Todays world of broadband and Google are what make it poosible for individuals to stay informed and make a difference from their computers, if the so choose. ROFLAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LaughLaughLaugh OMG!!! I'm dying laughing...!!!LaughLaughLaugh I didn't think it was possible for someone to completely miss the point of a post or to completely skip over all the meaningful parts...BUT...WE have a winner...LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh... I'm still laughing... ~R+RAngelic...I hope you find this post meaningless...and un"productive"... Minds are like parachutes. They only function when open. So when do you plan on opening your parachute? ~R+R...Still sooooo funny......~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #193 December 21, 2004 Quote So when do you plan on opening your parachute? I lost this low pull contest long ago! You can impact if you want to!Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #194 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuote So when do you plan on opening your parachute? I lost this low pull contest long ago! You can impact if you want to! Oooooh...I'm scared...and I'm done... ~R+R...Still laughing......~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #195 December 21, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuote So when do you plan on opening your parachute? I lost this low pull contest long ago! You can impact if you want to! Oooooh...I'm scared...and I'm done... ~R+R...Still laughing...... Horrible. That's what I suspected since a while. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #196 December 22, 2004 QuoteI've been wanting to post these 2 question to all of the Americans in here for a while, but for some reason I haven't untill now, so here goes... How do you guys think that Europeans feel about the USA as it is today? How do you think Europeans react to the re-election of your president? Just curious I guess. I'm European, does my opinion count? I hold America in very high esteem. The fact is that opinion in Europe is heterogeneous. There are many opinions both at the individual level and at the national level. Those who pretend that their one opinion reflects all of Europe are just drunk on their own cool-aid. The views expressed in European media further obscure the facts on individual opinion and reinforce a self perception of this monoculture of America bashing. I'm ashamed of some of my European brethren. The complete lack of any sense of history and the cultural snobbery and elitism of the profoundly ignorant is not something to be proud of. Just because a European grows up in a town with a sandstone building or two doesn't make them culturally superior. European amnesia on recent history and America's largesse is disturbing and entirely their fault. As Europeans visit memorials to the massacre of millions of innocents and the loss of millions more on the battlefields of Europe they tend to lament the whole sorry matter as if some kind of madness that overtook humanity when the truth is far more instructive. Wars are not merely moments of passing insanity in the feckless actions of mankind. Sometimes going to war is the lesser of two evils and it's Europe that should be ashamed of turning its back on America as America once again shoulders most of the burden of doing Europe's dirty work for it. 400,000 dead Americans in in WW1 and II and some European elitist has the temerity to point the finger at the US when the survivors and the families of the fallen aren't even in their graves to spin at the outrage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #197 December 22, 2004 QuoteSometimes going to war is the lesser of two evils and it's Europe that should be ashamed of turning its back on America as America once again shoulders most of the burden of doing Europe's dirty work for it. 400,000 dead Americans in in WW1 and II and some European elitist has the temerity to point the finger at the US when the survivors and the families of the fallen aren't even in their graves to spin at the outrage. Or, another way of looking at it would be that America sat back and watched, and at times profited from, the rise of the Third Reich, until additional intervention was necessary to save our own skin. We were reluctant teammates at best, from a strictly political standpoint.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #198 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote So when do you plan on opening your parachute? I lost this low pull contest long ago! You can impact if you want to! Oooooh...I'm scared...and I'm done... ~R+R...Still laughing...... Horrible. That's what I suspected since a while. Wait a moment...did you call me horrible? ~R+R...Good thing I dun't take what you say for while......~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #199 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteI've been wanting to post these 2 question to all of the Americans in here for a while, but for some reason I haven't untill now, so here goes... How do you guys think that Europeans feel about the USA as it is today? How do you think Europeans react to the re-election of your president? Just curious I guess. I'm European, does my opinion count? I hold America in very high esteem. The fact is that opinion in Europe is heterogeneous. There are many opinions both at the individual level and at the national level. Those who pretend that their one opinion reflects all of Europe are just drunk on their own cool-aid. The views expressed in European media further obscure the facts on individual opinion and reinforce a self perception of this monoculture of America bashing. I'm ashamed of some of my European brethren. The complete lack of any sense of history and the cultural snobbery and elitism of the profoundly ignorant is not something to be proud of. Just because a European grows up in a town with a sandstone building or two doesn't make them culturally superior. European amnesia on recent history and America's largesse is disturbing and entirely their fault. As Europeans visit memorials to the massacre of millions of innocents and the loss of millions more on the battlefields of Europe they tend to lament the whole sorry matter as if some kind of madness that overtook humanity when the truth is far more instructive. Wars are not merely moments of passing insanity in the feckless actions of mankind. Sometimes going to war is the lesser of two evils and it's Europe that should be ashamed of turning its back on America as America once again shoulders most of the burden of doing Europe's dirty work for it. 400,000 dead Americans in in WW1 and II and some European elitist has the temerity to point the finger at the US when the survivors and the families of the fallen aren't even in their graves to spin at the outrage. Can I say that your post was not only poignant but well written and thought out...thank you for your opinion and for voicing it so eloquently...... ~R+R~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #200 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteSometimes going to war is the lesser of two evils and it's Europe that should be ashamed of turning its back on America as America once again shoulders most of the burden of doing Europe's dirty work for it. 400,000 dead Americans in in WW1 and II and some European elitist has the temerity to point the finger at the US when the survivors and the families of the fallen aren't even in their graves to spin at the outrage. Or, another way of looking at it would be that America sat back and watched, and at times profited from, the rise of the Third Reich, until additional intervention was necessary to save our own skin. We were reluctant teammates at best, from a strictly political standpoint. It would be if you were clueless about history. Japan bombed Pearl Harbour for a reason, and the only reason Britain survived the Battle of Britain and avoided Operation Sealion was American supplies and cooperation during her worst hours, something that infuriated the Germans during both wars. Meanwhile America tooled up and instigated the Manhattan Project and many others. Some Americans were certainly isolationist, not surprising after Europe screwed up the peace over America's objections at Versailles, still others were flat out German supporters like Lindbergh, but the leadership and planning was there. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
