suicidal parachutists?

[ying 0]

In the place I'm writting from autumn and winter are a melancholic, thought provoking time. Recent (maybe not the newest but still fresh in our memory) event - death of one well-known and quite experienced skydiver in a simple main canopy malfunction situation - is an additional inspiration for pondering on certain matters. What's my point; Christianity is a religious system very popular in the world; have you ever considered parachuting in the context of Christian faith? I have. And you'd never guess what was the logical conclusion.... well, it seems that death during a parachute jump should be regarded as a.... suicide. How is that? It's very simple. No one forces anybody to become a pachachute jumper. One does it from his or her own free will and, what's more, purely for his or her own egoistic pleasure. Because, as we all well know, parachuting is highly pleasant, euphoricly adrenalinal, and generally mind-blowing. Nobody becomes a jumper because he or she has been forced to become one, or because of an inner need to help others, and everybody is perfectly aware of the fact that this particular sport can result in death or serious injury. How such unnecessary and advanced riskyness can be classified? How can we call our favourite leaving a well-funcioning plain, helicopter, glider, cliff or whatever one wishes to jump from? At best we can call it stupidity. At worst an indication of a self-destructive drive. And life according to Christians is a gift from God Himself, a gift which should be respected and which cannot be rejected. Anyone who dares to do it, will be cast into hell where he or she will suffer the eternal condemnation....
Whole this analysis leads to only one conclusion; people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries.
What do you think?

[DZJ 0]

What do I think? I think this post is offensive. Fatal skydiving accidents are not acts of suicide, especially when bodies are found with canopies out, handles pulled, and AAD's fired if fitted.

You might want to reconsider branding a global community of sportsmen and women suicidal, stupid, and self-destructive, and condemning them all to hell.

[Tink1717 2]

If we were suicidal, we wouldn't wear parachutes.

Skydivers don't knock on Death's door. They ring the bell and runaway... It really pisses him off.
-The World Famous Tink. (I never heard of you either!!)
AA #2069 ASA#33 POPS#8808 Swooo 1717

[Belgian_Skygirl 0]

Well,

You only see things from 1 perspective... I have severe problems with my health and parachute jumping helps me to put things in the right perspective. It is a dangerous sport, but it makes me realize ow precious life is, how beautiful our world is... you are speaking about "christian values" and suicide. I am not going to talk about religion, but is is better to be good at heart and do dangerous things than behaving as a asshole in daily life. When I see a beggar, I give hime some money or something to eat... I go to a shop and buy something. But according to you I am egoïstic.. let's put it that way... the beggar would probably prefer to bump into a person like me... a suicidal, egocentric skydiver, that really cares about other people, than a christian maniac that lives in a christian town with christian values, with no beggars and people that go to church every Sunday to talk about christian values... I don't care!!!!!! If you consider us, Skydivers as egocentric, maybe you should take a look at yourself and... you shouldn't forget that not everybody is a christian and that every person lives by means of his own values.

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No dive, like skydive... wanna bet on it?

[op5e 0]

ying, i think it would be polite if you filled in your profile and posted in the introduction forum prior to baiting.

I think skydiving is far from suicide. As I jump from the big blue to live not to die. Suicide is the intentional act of killing oneself, and that is more like being grounded and becoming boring rather than flying and living.

[tdog 0]

Quote

well, it seems that death during a parachute jump should be regarded as a.... suicide.

Ying, who might you be? One post? Just registered on this site in time to make that one post? Are you a normal visitor with a second personality, or just someone from the outside world thinking you might wanta look in. Wanna see a good fight?

By your logic process, God would see driving a car as suicide too... Of all many friends who are dead now, they all died behind the wheel. Five of them were killed by repeat offender drunks. How come your God does not protect my friends? And, my doctor who died while skiing at Vail... His weekend job of ski patrol saving lives, which brought him fatally in touch with a tree, was suicide too?

However, I do agree, naked skydiving should be prohibited… After all, if God wanted us to be naked, we would have been born that way.

Is that the fight you are wanting? I gave it to you so others might be able to post only positive things about how wonderful our world is.

The truth is, I have found skydivers to be obsessed with living, not dieing... I think we respect our lives more than the average folk, and we live it to the fullest. I rather live a real long and real full life. But if I could only do one, I know which one I would take. I hope your God respects me for that.

Sorry guys, this makes my first angry post. I owe you all some beer. Lottza beer it seems.

T.

[Belgian_Skygirl 0]

As long as the beer is good ...

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No dive, like skydive... wanna bet on it?

[Salsa_John 0]

Ying,

You obviously don't jump. My personal experience in skydiving is that at 40 I chose to start living my life and to break out of the box I had allowed myself to be put in. It is the best thing I could have done. Everytime I jump I am choosing to live my life and I am saying I trust my training and myself. It is a great confidence booster and gives me a great sense of accomplishment because I am overcoming a deathly fear of heights.

Jumping is not commiting suicide, it is commiting Life!

AND as a community, we watch out for each other regardless of who they are or how many jumps they have or what discipline they choose. (gear checks) Also, as a newbie I camped (1st time) at my DZ over Christmas. Someone put a card (addressed to me), a bag of candy, a candle, and a flashlight at my tent Christmas morning. As skydivers,we live and care.

"You did what?!?!"

MUFF #3722, TDSM #72, Orfun #26, Nachos Rodriguez

[ChrisL 2]

Your post is thought provoking and after careful consideration I believe that your conclusions are generally very silly.

Suicide is a clear, calculated attempt to end ones own life by various means. Its all about your intent.
Suicide is the performing of an action with the intent of causing your own death.

Skydiving is nothing of the sort.

Matter of fact, I have a prayer that I say in the plane on each and every skydive for my own safety and the safety of all those on board.

I have NO desire to die. None. Therefore if I were to be killed skydiving, anyone calling it a suicide is just a fool.

__

My mighty steed

[slotperfect 7]

Suicide = the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally especially by a person of years of discretion and of sound mind (Merriam-Webster)

Your argument could result in an intellectual conversation, albeit inappropriate for this forum (it belongs in Speakers' Corner due to the religious theme).

However, your post will likely not receive serious consideration here, or result in serious, well thought out, objective replies (contributing to the intellectual conversation) unless you fill out your profile.

Troll = A person who makes posts (on newsgroups or other forums) that are solely intended to provoke responses from others, or to cause annoyance or offense.
A post that is intended to incite controversy or cause offense. (Wikipedia)

-You registered today
-You have no profile (so nobody knows you are)
-You have one post
-Your only post is highly controversial

Ying - I'm locking the thread for now. Fill out your profile and send me a Private Message (PM that you have done so. Then I will unlock the thread and move it to Speakers Corner where it belongs.

Arrive Safely

John

[slotperfect 7]

Quote

Ying - I'm locking the thread for now. Fill out your profile and send me a Private Message (PM that you have done so. Then I will unlock the thread and move it to Speakers Corner where it belongs.

PM received, profile completed (mostly), and thread unlocked and moved as promised.

Arrive Safely

John

[Rebecca 0]

Quote

Matter of fact, I have a prayer that I say in the plane on each and every skydive for my own safety and the safety of all those on board.

Hey, me too!

you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' -- well do you, punk?

[Fab 0]

"Whole this analysis leads to only one conclusion; people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries.
What do you think? "

I think you are nuts.

A parachute jump is considered suicide if you jump without a parachute..The rest is just nonsense. Nothing in life is 100% safe...driving to work/riding a motorcycle/walking on the street/ taking a vacation in Asia/whatever. Just because you choose to enjoy life doesn't mean you are considered to be suicidal.

"One does it from his or her own free will and, what's more, purely for his or her own egoistic pleasure.."

Of course...I'm not doing it to please my mother ..if you know what I mean.

Appearantly I'm not a true christian and deserves to go to hell.......fortunatly I'm not a religious person so I won't loose any sleep over it .

_______________________________________

[DrewEckhardt 0]

Skydiving is a calculated risk just like skiing, riding a bicycle, or crossing the street.

Your chances of dying during each are dramatically reduced by doing everything right (not crashing or crossing the street without looking both directions) and controlling the setting (not skiing out of bounds, not riding after dark in traffic, not crossing behind a blind curve, not jumping into tight landing areas) but you can still die when you do everything reasonably right (out-of control skiers kill people, old and drunkdrivers run people over, people speed through red lights with pedestrians in cross-walks, a few people have died from skydiving equipment failures).

If skydiving's suicide then anything but cloistered living is.

[Ron 10]

Quote

Matter of fact, I have a prayer that I say in the plane on each and every skydive for my own safety and the safety of all those on board.

Me too....

Oh Lord, please don't let me be the first to fuck this up....Amen.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Jskydiver22 0]

Im glad to see this thread is unlocked now....me and ying actually sent a few PM's back and forth about this subject. My opinion on this still is that if anyone went in with both handles pulled and did everything they could, that theres no way it could be considered suicide.

Anyone else?

--I don't even know enough to know that I dont know--

[masterrig 1]

I do the same thing! Got a few funny looks from others on the plane, till I explained why. After that... just smiles!

Chuck

[masterrig 1]

I agree!

Chuck

[Nightingale 0]

you take risks by getting out of bed in the morning and driving to work. You can't live life with a complete avoidance of risk.

[Scrumpot 1]

Where's Ron Schott when you REALLY need him (like here)?

Ying, I would hasten only to point out that there is a whole "sect" (is that a pallatable term?) with a sizeable membership of highly religious (at least from my point of view ...I am NOT a member)Christian Skydivers, quite "active" and organized called the Christian Skydivers Association.

You may want to check this link out:
http://hometown.aol.com/christskyd/

I would think that they would take serious issue to what you say here. As not even a member of that group, I know that I even do.

I have absolutely NO DEATH WISH, and my skydiving activities therefore by definition can in NO WAY that I see, be EVER deemed as suicide, or suicidal. I think you've got a pretty skewed point of view, for sure.

No one ever said that the human body should hurtle itself down a river in a white-water raft either for instance. So would you also be saying that anybody who just happened to perish doing that activity in turn also therefore just committed suicide?

-Grant

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[Jskydiver22 0]

Well Ying...where are you?

Oh and just to let everyone know...this is a person who tells me that he does a "cypress jump" where he lets the cypress pull. (Yes at 700')

--I don't even know enough to know that I dont know--

[Michele 1]

Ying, you have no idea what suicide is and isn't. I think that believing that suicides should be buried off hallowed ground is the most ridiculous concept (and yes, I know it's done) and the most amazingly horrific tradition which should be stopped.

Skydiving is not suicidal.

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[monte 0]

Quote

Well Ying...where are you?

Oh and just to let everyone know...this is a person who tells me that he does a "cypress jump" where he lets the cypress pull. (Yes at 700')

But does he do it naked?

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The less a man makes declarative statements, the less apt he is to look foolish in retrospect

[DBCOOPER 5]

I think you should go find your yang.

Replying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon

If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea.

[skybill 22]

Hey Yang-o-buddy,
When whuffo's (like yourself) find out that I'm a Skydiver, they usually fall into this diatribe about,"That's dangerous, you can get hurt, you can get killed doing that, 'How long have you been jumping??' " I answer,"40 years." Then they just stand there looking stupid as their jaw works up and down and they don't know what to say!!

If it's that damned dangerous, how the hell am I still alive sitting here writing this after jumping out of airplanes for 40 years?????????????????????

No, I'm not going to kill myself, skydiving or any other way (period!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

SCR-2034, SCS-680

III%,
Deli-out