scratch69 0 #51 January 1, 2007 People, listen to yourselves. I am incredibly bored and I read every last long and drawn out post in this thread. A couple of my favorite key moments : Trivial Trekker and two40 sharing their unlimited and undoubtedly vast knowledge of skydiving with us whilst pushing higher regulations upon us because a handful of people burn in under perfectly good canopies. And then theres Peregrinrose and Kkeenan, whom I will affectionately refer to as mommy and daddy. Do the two of you truly believe that you are invincible?? Go back and read your posts. You are talking down at people who are exploring the limits of their abilities and telling them that its not right, you need to be more conservative like me, then you will never die in skydiving. People, PLEASE !!! Honestly. The noobies I can deal with because they are still dumbasses and very influenced by up-jumpers. But if you are in the sport for a couple years or more, (35 years especially) please spare us the speeches about what you have done to stay alive in the sport. This sport is about LUCK and nothing else. Now remember, luck is the by-product of preparation and opportunity, so I will never discount those two very important traits in this great sport. But lets all remember the true tragedies in the sport, where EVERYTHING was done right, and a fatality still occurs. NO ONE is invincible, the live ones are just lucky so far. As for bashing people for downsizing canopies, all I can say is mind your own damn business. This has nothing to do with you. NOTHING. People are downsizing aggressively and they are amazing canopy pilots because of it. The price to pay is a few lives here and there on the road to canpopy piloting greatness. Too bad, its called evolution and progression. The few that pay the price for the masses are mourned and remembered for the ultimate sacrifice they paid so their sport could continue to PROGRESS. I have some friends in Canada who are ridiculously good canopy pilots. For everyone's information, there are no canopy Nazi's up there and these kids are kicking everyone's asses at the world swooping comp's. Who can guess how many skydiving fatalities there are in Canada every year, or more specifically hook turn deaths?? ZERO ! Instead of ostrisizing these people, why don't we embrace them. This fairly new discipline called SWOOPING is not going anywhere folks, much to your dismay. In fact, the entire sport of skydiving is evolving that way, sorry old farts. Take these people and encourage them, don't squash them. Skydiving is not about Style and Accuracy any more, as is clearly evident at all major competitions these days. Of course MB38 is loading at 1.3/1.4 at only 100 jumps. His DZ staff and mentors have allowed him to progress at this level due to his abilities. And sorry Peregrinrose, but he is a much better canopy pilot than you were at 100 jumps, because you chose the conservative route. No one is a better or worse skydiver, but canopy piloting truly is its own discipline and you are only as good as you can push yourself to be. Damn thats a long post. I can't wait for the colorful rebuttals. - - i was sent here to disturb the peace - - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #52 January 1, 2007 Fair enough scratch, as you so stated, but now in my own words... well, borrowed from someone else on the board somewhere... "low pulls are a thing of the past, if you want to be "Cool & Dangerous" in skydiving, now you hook-it on a highly overloaded high-performance canopy"... but what say you to this??? Quote When will these alleged canopy pilots wake-up to the fact that 270s have no place in a traffic pattern with the majority of people doing conventional patterns? What are you going to do to not take me with you in the process of... "...The price to pay is a few lives here and there on the road to canpopy piloting greatness..."??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scratch69 0 #53 January 2, 2007 Zig - I respect you. I respect all jumpers, regardless of jump numbers and skill. Every jumper should do the same, RESPECT. This is not a matter of opinion, its a matter of logic. In a high traffic LZ, there is no place for swoop practice or show-boating. This goes without question. My argument is focused strictly on people shunning new jumpers who chose canopy piloting as their discipline. These people have every right to put their own life in danger to achieve their goals of becoming the best swoopers. There are sanctioned events for this type of thing and even dropzones that cater to swoopers. This is my exact point!!! Don't destroy these jumpers for wanting to be aggressive canopy pilots, its their GOD-GIVEN-AMERICAN right to do so. Instead, NURTURE them, and GUIDE them and maybe setup an outlet for new swoopers at your DZ. Don't just discount every swooper as a loaded weapon looking to kill someone. That's a similar mentality that WHUFFO's have about skydivers in general and we all know how we as skydivers feel about that. Anyone can be a whuffo, including experienced skydivers who don't understand why someone would actually be crazy enough to hook a highly loaded canopy towards the ground at 80mph !!!! "Whuffo you do that???" Because I can and its DAMN fun and its DAMN rewarding. The same DAMN reason just about everyone here started skydiving, LEST WE FORGET. - - i was sent here to disturb the peace - - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,989 #54 January 2, 2007 > As for bashing people for downsizing canopies, all I can say is mind >your own damn business. This has nothing to do with you. NOTHING. If you take the view that skydiving is like any other business, then that might make sense. But if you take the view that skydiving is a community, it really doesn't. Skydiving deaths do affect other jumpers, and so we try to minimize them. I'll take a quote from an old friend of mine (paraphrased): "You know, back when I was jumping that stiletto, you guys were telling me I was going to hurt myself, and I just never listened. I just wanted the faster canopy, the new canopy. I didn't know how to land the thing very well. When I broke my femur it really woke me up. I got back into jumping, took a canopy control class, and actually upsized - and I was getting better swoops! I wish I could have listened back then." He's now one of the world's best swoopers. I don't have any real moral problem with someone who knows exactly what they are risking, and who pushes the limits and dies. I do have a problem with jumpers who don't even know enough to know what they don't know. Deaths due to risk-taking are OK to me - but deaths due to ignorance really aren't. So often, I try to find ways to "wake people up" so they don't need to break their femurs (or worse) to learn that lesson. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scratch69 0 #55 January 2, 2007 Good point Bill, and it stems down to basic logic again. I am all for the community mentality and caring for our fellow jumpers. That is why I recommend that every DZ takes a long hard look at their resident "swoopers", and meet with them regularily to setup an understanding that everyone will agree on to keep people alive in the LZ. - - i was sent here to disturb the peace - - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yardhippie 0 #56 January 2, 2007 Ive told the "I was that guy and shattered my left ankle" story so many time, some folks could probably recite it. Some have listened. Some havent. I learned the hard way to listen to my peers, and more advanced pilots. I often regurgitate the advice I have been given. Please folks, listen to what others are tellin you. Educate yourselves. Learn your canopies for ALL modes of flight.Goddam dirty hippies piss me off! ~GFD "What do I get for closing your rig?" ~ me "Anything you want." ~ female skydiver Mohoso Rodriguez #865 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
