AggieDave 6 #51 March 27, 2005 Quote$21,000. Harley Davidson? $21K? You must have gotten a good deal on yours or its completely bone stock. How many HD riders do you know that have a bone stock ride? Ok, the $350K number is getting tossed around a lot...if someone gets the rubber side up/shiney side down and its bad enough to get $350K in head injuries, they're much much MUCH more fucked up then that and have to worry about putting the rest of their body back together too. Oh, I know, riders should have to wear full leathers and fullface helmets and only ride in controlled environments...you know sunny perfect weather days at the track and only one at a time and only at 40mph on the straight aways and 20mph on the curves.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #52 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuote$21,000. Harley Davidson? $21K? You must have gotten a good deal on yours or its completely bone stock. How many HD riders do you know that have a bone stock ride? You know Dave if I had said $30K, someone would have chimed in with MSRP prices on stock Harleys and started an argument about it. I bought my Fat Boy for $18,500 out the door without any doodads. I've put about $5k into it since then and will probably drop another 5k into it this year with a custom paint job. QuoteOk, the $350K number is getting tossed around a lot...if someone gets the rubber side up/shiney side down and its bad enough to get $350K in head injuries, they're much much MUCH more fucked up then that and have to worry about putting the rest of their body back together too. Oh, I know, riders should have to wear full leathers and fullface helmets and only ride in controlled environments...you know sunny perfect weather days at the track and only one at a time and only at 40mph on the straight aways and 20mph on the curves. I usually wear a helmet, but can't understand how people can be so hipocritical in their thinking. How can someone be Pro-choice on abortion, right to die etc and anti-choice on helmet laws? Many of the same people who are anti-choice on helmet laws are the same ones who whine when the govt. takes away their rights on something important to them. It isn't about the wisdom of wearing a helmet or not, it's about the right to be dumb without being dictated to and protected by the Govt. (I know you understand this so this isn't a rant directed at you). Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #53 March 27, 2005 QuoteIt's not the job of the government to protect individuals from themselves. To protect individuals from others, yes, but not from themselves. People need to be responsible for the consequences of their own actions. The government needs to be a government, not a parent. Certainly. Then let those people who look to the government to pay for their injuries stop doing that too. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #54 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteIt's not the job of the government to protect individuals from themselves. To protect individuals from others, yes, but not from themselves. People need to be responsible for the consequences of their own actions. The government needs to be a government, not a parent. Certainly. Then let those people who look to the government to pay for their injuries stop doing that too. ltdiver Fair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? So no skydiver can get on a plane unless he provides the insurance information when he fills out the waiver? How about requiring an AMD for anyone involved in any risky activity? While we're at it, why not require organ donation requirements for bikers, skydivers etc? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #55 March 27, 2005 QuoteFair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? Most, if not all, insurance companies -require- that you protect yourself to the letter of the law. For instance, for motorcycles and equestrian riders they require that you wear a helmet to be covered. As for skydiving...we all know that helmets are only worn to keep your dytter in place and keep your ears warm. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #56 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteFair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? Most, if not all, insurance companies -require- that you protect yourself to the letter of the law. For instance, for motorcycles and equestrian riders they require that you wear a helmet to be covered. As for skydiving...we all know that helmets are only worn to keep your dytter in place and keep your ears warm. ltdiver Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #57 March 27, 2005 Quote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #58 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #59 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RoadRash 0 #60 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? You seem to cut down everyone else...but what is your suggestion for payment of medical bills after someone turns their head into mush? ~R+R...~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #61 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? But that's not what you originally said. QuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime, Insinuating that a lot aren't economically viable. Did you know the median income for all bikers is $77,700? If you now want to backpeddle on your original statement, go ahead. Just don't make wide incorrect generalizations. Quote especially after head injuries, so garnishing wages like you suggest is impossible. I agree. That's why everyone should have proper insurance and an AMD. With those 2 in place, why would anybody have a problem with someone riding without a helmet? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jib 0 #62 March 27, 2005 QuoteWe're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? We're talking about people who can't even care for themselves; they'll have zero income and $350k won't begin to cover the cost on caring for them. Try adding a zero or and maybe two. Yes, they could cost the person that caused an accident $35,000,000.00 or more. Since virtually no one aside from a large corporation carries that kind of insurance, the taxpayers will pay through Medicaid at a substantially reduced rate. I hate agreeing with Kallend. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #63 March 27, 2005 QuoteI hate agreeing with Kallend. Then go read my post about the realities of motorcycle accidents. EDIT: I hate it when I'm distracted and I type what I hear on TV instead of what I'm thinking about.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #64 March 27, 2005 QuoteMaybe ltdiver can give us some info on the employment prospects of the head injury victims she works with, and the likelihood that they'll be making above median income. Head injured? The lucky get back to a low stress, low mobile job (I've only known 2 of these in the 2 1/2 years I've worked at our rehabilitation hospital). One was a pilot, the other was an architect. Both were earning upwards of over 100k/year. Now, with their downgraded jobs, I don't know. The others, bless their souls, are completely dependent on family. And that number of victims have become too many to number. Again, that's only in 2 1/2 years there. It'd say 95% of the casualties are completely, and totally dependent, without any hope of gainful employment again. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #65 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #66 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Not saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 3 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
ltdiver 3 #53 March 27, 2005 QuoteIt's not the job of the government to protect individuals from themselves. To protect individuals from others, yes, but not from themselves. People need to be responsible for the consequences of their own actions. The government needs to be a government, not a parent. Certainly. Then let those people who look to the government to pay for their injuries stop doing that too. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #54 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteIt's not the job of the government to protect individuals from themselves. To protect individuals from others, yes, but not from themselves. People need to be responsible for the consequences of their own actions. The government needs to be a government, not a parent. Certainly. Then let those people who look to the government to pay for their injuries stop doing that too. ltdiver Fair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? So no skydiver can get on a plane unless he provides the insurance information when he fills out the waiver? How about requiring an AMD for anyone involved in any risky activity? While we're at it, why not require organ donation requirements for bikers, skydivers etc? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #55 March 27, 2005 QuoteFair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? Most, if not all, insurance companies -require- that you protect yourself to the letter of the law. For instance, for motorcycles and equestrian riders they require that you wear a helmet to be covered. As for skydiving...we all know that helmets are only worn to keep your dytter in place and keep your ears warm. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #56 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteFair enough. I'm sure you will agree that if motorcyclists were all required to have Catostrophic Insurance coverage, then we should be able to ride without a helmet, right? And you would have no problem then with this same requirement for skydivers, rock climbers, Equestrians etc? Most, if not all, insurance companies -require- that you protect yourself to the letter of the law. For instance, for motorcycles and equestrian riders they require that you wear a helmet to be covered. As for skydiving...we all know that helmets are only worn to keep your dytter in place and keep your ears warm. ltdiver Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #57 March 27, 2005 Quote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #58 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #59 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RoadRash 0 #60 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? You seem to cut down everyone else...but what is your suggestion for payment of medical bills after someone turns their head into mush? ~R+R...~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #61 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? But that's not what you originally said. QuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime, Insinuating that a lot aren't economically viable. Did you know the median income for all bikers is $77,700? If you now want to backpeddle on your original statement, go ahead. Just don't make wide incorrect generalizations. Quote especially after head injuries, so garnishing wages like you suggest is impossible. I agree. That's why everyone should have proper insurance and an AMD. With those 2 in place, why would anybody have a problem with someone riding without a helmet? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jib 0 #62 March 27, 2005 QuoteWe're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? We're talking about people who can't even care for themselves; they'll have zero income and $350k won't begin to cover the cost on caring for them. Try adding a zero or and maybe two. Yes, they could cost the person that caused an accident $35,000,000.00 or more. Since virtually no one aside from a large corporation carries that kind of insurance, the taxpayers will pay through Medicaid at a substantially reduced rate. I hate agreeing with Kallend. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #63 March 27, 2005 QuoteI hate agreeing with Kallend. Then go read my post about the realities of motorcycle accidents. EDIT: I hate it when I'm distracted and I type what I hear on TV instead of what I'm thinking about.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #64 March 27, 2005 QuoteMaybe ltdiver can give us some info on the employment prospects of the head injury victims she works with, and the likelihood that they'll be making above median income. Head injured? The lucky get back to a low stress, low mobile job (I've only known 2 of these in the 2 1/2 years I've worked at our rehabilitation hospital). One was a pilot, the other was an architect. Both were earning upwards of over 100k/year. Now, with their downgraded jobs, I don't know. The others, bless their souls, are completely dependent on family. And that number of victims have become too many to number. Again, that's only in 2 1/2 years there. It'd say 95% of the casualties are completely, and totally dependent, without any hope of gainful employment again. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #65 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #66 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Not saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 3 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
RoadRash 0 #60 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? You seem to cut down everyone else...but what is your suggestion for payment of medical bills after someone turns their head into mush? ~R+R...~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #61 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? But that's not what you originally said. QuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime, Insinuating that a lot aren't economically viable. Did you know the median income for all bikers is $77,700? If you now want to backpeddle on your original statement, go ahead. Just don't make wide incorrect generalizations. Quote especially after head injuries, so garnishing wages like you suggest is impossible. I agree. That's why everyone should have proper insurance and an AMD. With those 2 in place, why would anybody have a problem with someone riding without a helmet? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jib 0 #62 March 27, 2005 QuoteWe're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? We're talking about people who can't even care for themselves; they'll have zero income and $350k won't begin to cover the cost on caring for them. Try adding a zero or and maybe two. Yes, they could cost the person that caused an accident $35,000,000.00 or more. Since virtually no one aside from a large corporation carries that kind of insurance, the taxpayers will pay through Medicaid at a substantially reduced rate. I hate agreeing with Kallend. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #63 March 27, 2005 QuoteI hate agreeing with Kallend. Then go read my post about the realities of motorcycle accidents. EDIT: I hate it when I'm distracted and I type what I hear on TV instead of what I'm thinking about.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #64 March 27, 2005 QuoteMaybe ltdiver can give us some info on the employment prospects of the head injury victims she works with, and the likelihood that they'll be making above median income. Head injured? The lucky get back to a low stress, low mobile job (I've only known 2 of these in the 2 1/2 years I've worked at our rehabilitation hospital). One was a pilot, the other was an architect. Both were earning upwards of over 100k/year. Now, with their downgraded jobs, I don't know. The others, bless their souls, are completely dependent on family. And that number of victims have become too many to number. Again, that's only in 2 1/2 years there. It'd say 95% of the casualties are completely, and totally dependent, without any hope of gainful employment again. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #65 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #66 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Not saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 3 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
Gravitymaster 0 #61 March 27, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime It's pretty obvious you know very little about motorcyclists. Seen too many 60's Hells Angels movies? How many low income people do you think can afford a brand new $21,000. Harley Davidson? I'd guess a lot fewer than can afford $5000. for skydiving gear. So does your pompous statement also apply to skydivers? Most of the folks I ride with a high income professionals. In fact I'd be more than happy to compare my annual income with yours Professor. We're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? But that's not what you originally said. QuoteNo, it wouldn't be easier because a lot of bikers don't have the capacity to produce $350k in their lifetime, Insinuating that a lot aren't economically viable. Did you know the median income for all bikers is $77,700? If you now want to backpeddle on your original statement, go ahead. Just don't make wide incorrect generalizations. Quote especially after head injuries, so garnishing wages like you suggest is impossible. I agree. That's why everyone should have proper insurance and an AMD. With those 2 in place, why would anybody have a problem with someone riding without a helmet? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #62 March 27, 2005 QuoteWe're talking about ability to pay $350k medical bills AFTER the brain injury. How's the earning power of an ex-biker with brain damage? We're talking about people who can't even care for themselves; they'll have zero income and $350k won't begin to cover the cost on caring for them. Try adding a zero or and maybe two. Yes, they could cost the person that caused an accident $35,000,000.00 or more. Since virtually no one aside from a large corporation carries that kind of insurance, the taxpayers will pay through Medicaid at a substantially reduced rate. I hate agreeing with Kallend. -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #63 March 27, 2005 QuoteI hate agreeing with Kallend. Then go read my post about the realities of motorcycle accidents. EDIT: I hate it when I'm distracted and I type what I hear on TV instead of what I'm thinking about.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #64 March 27, 2005 QuoteMaybe ltdiver can give us some info on the employment prospects of the head injury victims she works with, and the likelihood that they'll be making above median income. Head injured? The lucky get back to a low stress, low mobile job (I've only known 2 of these in the 2 1/2 years I've worked at our rehabilitation hospital). One was a pilot, the other was an architect. Both were earning upwards of over 100k/year. Now, with their downgraded jobs, I don't know. The others, bless their souls, are completely dependent on family. And that number of victims have become too many to number. Again, that's only in 2 1/2 years there. It'd say 95% of the casualties are completely, and totally dependent, without any hope of gainful employment again. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #65 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #66 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Not saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 3 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
ltdiver 3 #66 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Edited to add: BTW, the average motorcyclist is 42 years old and has an income of $56,000 per year. http://www.motorcycle.com/staff/mediakit/about.motml How many years of wage garnishment will be needed to pay that $350k medical bill at that rate of income, assuming (BIG assumption) it is maintained after the head injury? Since close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. Not saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 3 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Gravitymaster 0 #67 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteSince close to 80% of all motorcycle accidents are the fault of the driver of a car, I'd suggest cage drivers increase your automobile insurance because you are going to be broke when my attorney gets done taking your house, everything you own and downgrading your income forever. QuoteNot saying that motorcycle riders aren't at a higher risk from cars. They are. However, what makes me mad is seeing yahoos weave in and out of cars on the road...especially on the freeway. Kind of like hook turning too low to the ground. You may get away with it over and over..yet one day it'll bite you big time. Drive defensively people. ltdiver No doubt that happens, I see it occasionally. What I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. Since automobile drivers are usually at fault, are you now for legislation that forces automobile drivers to carry more insurance to cover them if they hit a motorcyclist? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #68 March 28, 2005 QuoteWhat I see more often is distracted drivers who yack on cell phones, play loud music or have kids in the car, pull out in front of me without looking or leave less margin than they do when I drive my Expedition or Acura TL. No shit! That's why I've made my bike fucking LOUD! Now if they don't see me and I can't move out of the way maybe they'll hear me and look again.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #69 March 28, 2005 IIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #70 March 28, 2005 QuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #71 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteIIRC, the amount of injuries dramatically increased after helmet laws were put into place, simply because many of those injuries would have been fatalities were it not for the helmets. Therefore, one could make the argument that helmet laws actually cost society more. You are correct. I think it's about time those responsible for injuries to motorcyclists be held accountable for their actions. We need to pass a law that requires all automobile drivers carry additional insurance so that society and motorcyclists are not saddled with the results of their actions. Dunno about where you live, but in Illinois that has been the law for many years. But there is no law requiring insurance coverage for self inflicted injuries.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ian84 0 #72 March 28, 2005 Just speaking from experience: When I first got a bike I would have loved to go cruising around with no helmet. Fortunately I didn't have that option. I crashed, the helmet saved me from some nasty injuries. Looking back I'm glad the law is there (in Ireland). I was 18 at the time so looking cool was higher on the agenda than crash survivability Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EBSB52 0 #73 March 28, 2005 In a general legislative intent diagnosis, it is obvious that these kinds of laws, helmet laws, seat belt laws, insurance laws are an example of Fascism. They are so because it's about the legislative intent, not the actuaul good or not for society. To say that insurance laws are a positive thing is use 'ends justify the means' logic. The insurance companies buy politicians to put in place these laws for their fiscal advantage. These laws took place and grew steam during the Reagan years, right when Fascism really took a stronghold in the US. As for right to die or not, that's more of a brain child of the religious right; some people don't have the right to die, other must die - their form of being the judger they claim not to be. The fiscal right, the original intent of the GOP way back when, facilitates the religious right to keep them in their voting pool. SO here we have the system that kinda sucks a lot - no way to stop it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #74 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #75 March 28, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Yeah, but you gotta admit this helmet stuff has gotten a little out of hand. http://www.thudguard.co.uk/ http://www.thehammer.ca/content/view.php?news=2004-11-08-ontario-helmets-mandatory Like "The Onion"....these are sites of satire. ltdiver Nope, Thudgaurd is a real product. And you notice they're in the U.K., not the U.S. ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
