I knew Cheney was a DICK but

[Ron 10]

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Not slamming the US, just those who blindly follow, in any country.

Gee it seems strange you say that since all your posts seem to slam the US.

See you claim that pressure can be apllied without knowledge...The same can be said of hatred.

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Nope, never said that. Reading comprehension really isn't that difficult. I said that often pressure can be exuded without it being voiced. Sometimes that even happens without the person realizing it. Hence rules get put into place when people are too closely related. When you get high enough it gets to be a bigger problem.

You said EXACTLY that, and then attacked anyone that didn't agree with you. My reading is just fine, your writting needs work. Also you could use a new subject...You have over done Anti American ramble.

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"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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[Ron 10]

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What is he blaming the US for?

He is blaming the US for allowing a guy that he thinks is a crook to be VP.

But he has never provided proof. And in this country you need proof, not just hearsay.

And like someone else pointed out if there was anything the Dems would have been all over it.

Then he has some crazy idea that its the VP's fault if a company he had ties to gets speciall treatment EVEN IF THE VP HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

Of couse he did claim the VP did have something to do with it right up until asked to provide proof, then he comes up with a crazy theory that it happend and it was the VPs fault..EVEN THOUGH HE DID NOT DO ANYTHING.

Then he claims that a guy whos job it is to deal with Government Contracts does not know what he is talking about.

There is a guy that has no idea what he is talkinga bout...And that guy is the one making accusations he can't back up and saying that a guy that does something for a living does not know what he is talking about...Oh and staying the course of his Anti American retoric.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[mr2mk1g 10]

Um... no; you're blaming the US for allowing Cheney to be VP, he's simply saying Cheney is a crook.

If I said "Nixon was a crook", I'm not blaming anyone for anything but Nixon for being a crook.

Sure the fact that the US allowed Nixon to be in the position he was while he was a crook is tacit in my statement... but that's not what my statement is actually about.

The same is true here. Skydeckers post is simply in relation to Cheney and his actions - not the people of the US. What anyone reads into the post above and beyond that is down to the reader.

Of course... he could have anticipated you, the reader, would read into it in precisely the way you have done.

[Ron 10]

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Um... no; you're blaming the US for allowing Cheney to be VP, he's simply saying Cheney is a crook.

If I said "Nixon was a crook", I'm not blaming anyone for anything but Nixon for being a crook.

Sure the fact that the US allowed Nixon to be in the position he was while he was a crook is tacit in my statement... but that's not what my statement is actually about.

From SD

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hi hi hi, you guys crack me up. Those blinders must get pretty uncomfortable after time. Even on horses they take them off after a little while.

Here he is saying anyone that does not agree with him has blinders on.

Here he is saying ayone that does not agree with him is blind:

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Not slamming the US, just those who blindly follow, in any country

Then he TWICE attacks my reading skills:

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Reading comprehension really isn't that difficult

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Of course... he could have anticipated you, the reader, would read into it in precisely the way you have done

You can look up most of his posts and they are anti US.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and talks like a duck....it is a duck.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[GTAVercetti 0]

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If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and talks like a duck....it is a duck.

FINALLY! I get to post this:

http://www.piratesandemperors.com/

And just for the record, I think it is a silly cartoon I saw on Bored At Work, but since you used the phrase and it occurs in, I felt I must post it. Even if it is meant to be a slam...the parable of the Pirate and Emperor does ring true...for ANY powerful nation.
As for this topic. The reason the Dems don't make a big stink about Cheney is because they all do it too. Both sides have history of being friends to big business and many times the same big businesses over time.

Is it wrong? Probably. Will it stop? Doubtful. Doesn't matter if there is an Elephant or Donkey in the White House.

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[mr2mk1g 10]

I've not followed his posting history but I'm quite happy to accept your assessment of it.

I agree with him regarding to the meaning of his "without being voiced" statement. I feel you were either nit picking or simply latching onto an alternative interpretation of the meaning of the phrase for the sake of argument. His attacking your reading skills was in a direct response to your attacking him for his writing skills.

You called him "illiterate"; in response he suggested you had difficulties in comprehension. Tit for tat, it's hardly worth getting bent out of shape over.I find it a shame that people here can't have a dispute without slagging each other off.

I see nothing in that whole saga however that I would term an attack on the US as a whole.

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Here he is saying anyone that does not agree with him has blinders on.

Here he is saying ayone that does not agree with him is blind:

Yup - he admits to slamming anyone who blindly follows and he (note "he" not "I" in case this solicits an attacking response) considers some here to be blindly following. Thus he's admitting to "slamming" some posters here. Thankfully for the sake of world peace, slamming a small number of people on an internet forum does not equate to attack a nation as a whole.

Finally - I'm also happy to accept your assessment of him as a duck. That doesn't mean I heard him say quack.

[Ron 10]

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And just for the record, I think it is a silly cartoon I saw on Bored At Work, but since you used the phrase and it occurs in, I felt I must post it. Even if it is meant to be a slam...the parable of the Pirate and Emperor does ring true...for ANY powerful nation

I found it funny.

I think thats part of the Anit-US thing...Everyone wants to see the big guy fall and is quick to point out any failures...Even if they have to make them up.

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"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt


"Citizenship in a Republic,"
Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Ron 10]

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You called him "illiterate"; in response he suggested you had difficulties in comprehension

Peep who called who Illiterate:

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By the way, for those somewhat illiterate I said that the VP, or any senior officer be it in government or corporate life often does make recommendation. Those recommendation tend to carry a lot of weight. With the seniority of a VP, those recommendations can even be in place without being voiced.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1598599#1598599

He also claim to know more about Government Contracts than a guy who's job it is to deal with them daily.

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I usually find that the guys that know all the little acronyms have no idea what the big picture looks like. Those are the guys that just see the signatures on paper, but have no idea who is pulling the strings.

Thats funny.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[mr2mk1g 10]

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Thats funny.

Yup. I think it would be even funnier though if SD would post the world "QUACK" right after my post.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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He is blaming the US for allowing a guy that he thinks is a crook to be VP.

Nope, I am wondering why people think it is not an issue. Being Canadian, it is a very relevant questioin in light of the gomery inquiry. Which is looking into high level government interference in awarding of contracts. All the way up to the Prime Minister's Office.

Now, in Canada the PM does not award contracts, nor does the finance minister, or the minister of public works, but boy does it ever look like they had a say into who would be considered.

Which goes back to my comment about the acronyms. If you get some one saying, hey if you don't know the acronyms, you obviously don't know about the process. The process isn't the issue, the bigger picture, the "who-is-pulling-the-strings" question is what is the issue.

Lastly, the thought process of some one that high in government does not get involved with awarding contracts is exactly what led to the sytematic awarding of fraudulent million dollar payments in Canada. If you or anybody else want to continue thinking that cannot happen in the US, fine, but it is somewhat the definition of naieve.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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He also claim to know more about Government Contracts than a guy who's job it is to deal with them daily.

Nope, didn't do that either. Back to the reading comprehension thing.

[Ron 10]

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Nope, I am wondering why people think it is not an issue.

I can think of two reasons right now.

1. Republicans
2. Democrats

The Repubs are not going to put a person that could be taken down easily as a running mate. And the Dems probably looked into Cheney so close as to know what color underware he wore to his prom.

COULD it be an issue? Sure. Does that make it an issue? No. and without proof you are doing nothing but spouting political BS.

Since I am in the quoting mood:

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"Criticism is necessary and useful; it is often indispensable; but it can never take the place of action, or be even a poor substitute for it.-Theodore Roosevelt, 1894

And just because you are in the middle of a big controversy about the same kind of thing does not make it true anywhere else...Its called a frame of reference. You look for like problems to the point of making them up.

Also we in the States have a thing called "innocent till PROVEN guilty". No one has shown any PROOF...If they have it please provide it...I am sure the Democratic party would be quite happy.

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Which goes back to my comment about the acronyms. If you get some one saying, hey if you don't know the acronyms, you obviously don't know about the process. The process isn't the issue, the bigger picture, the "who-is-pulling-the-strings" question is what is the issue.

Ah, but a guy that knows the acronyms because he does it every day I bet knows the process better than a guy that does not. After all Vinny does Government Contracts ALL DAY...How many US Government Contracts have you done today? This year? In your life?

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Lastly, the thought process of some one that high in government does not get involved with awarding contracts is exactly what led to the sytematic awarding of fraudulent million dollar payments in Canada. If you or anybody else want to continue thinking that cannot happen in the US, fine, but it is somewhat the definition of naieve.

Who says it CAN'T happen? I never did.

But to assume that if it happend to you it MUST have happend in the US and to say so WITHOUT PROOF is the definition of "Conspiricy Theorist".

Also notice you are making comments about the US (without Proof), but you didn't post anything about the PM of Canada?

Why?

Why is it news worthy for you to try and drag down a US official with no proof but you don't see a single thread about your problems in Canada?

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Ron 10]

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He also claim to know more about Government Contracts than a guy who's job it is to deal with them daily.

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Nope, didn't do that either. Back to the reading comprehension thing.

Really?

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Vinny: If I knew nothing about government contracting, DoD operations, business, and foreign policy, this chronology might make me think badly of our Vice President.

Fortunately, that's not the case.

SD: It is fortunate that you don't think badly of your Vice President? (which had NOTHING to do with Vinny's post)

Vinny: Naaahh...fortunate that I know a bit about gov't contracting. You can tell the level of knowledge of these bozos by the fact they consider cost plus award fee and IDIQ (indefinite delivery indefinite quantity) contracts to be out of the ordinary. Buffoons.

SD: so, it is correct to say you see absolutely nothing wrong with this Cheney - Haliburton association?

Vinny: Suuuuure the VP has a role in determining who gets what contract. Suuuuuuure he does. Say hello to the Lochness Monster and Puff the Magic Dragon for me. The Tooth Fairy too. Actually, kick the tooth fairy in the ass for me - she was always quite stingy. Left me a measly penny for my front tooth! Stingy bitch.

This Halliburton nonsense is merely leftists preying upon the ignorance of the masses (typical tactic for them) to smear the VP. Nobody who knows a damned thing about gov't contracting gives them the slightest bit of credibility. Those making such accusations wouldn't know the difference between USD(AT&L) and DUSD(LM&R) or CPAF and FFP contracts, i.e. they don't know what the hell they're talking about.

SD: I usually find that the guys that know all the little acronyms have no idea what the big picture looks like. Those are the guys that just see the signatures on paper, but have no idea who is pulling the strings.
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1598599#1598599

Gee you said those who know the acronyms have no idea.

Go fish.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[TheAnvil 0]

1) I'm not a horse, I'm a JACKASS, thank you.

2) I don't wear blinders.

3) You don't know anything about gov't contracting. If you did, you wouldn't give this drivel any credibility.

4) The acronyms I mentioned are but a few among several that anyone with even a small amount of knowledge of gov't contracting or defense acquisitions would recognize.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[SkyDekker 1,465]

okay for both of you, I'll try and say it a bit simpler if I can.

The issue isn't just the awarding of goverment contracts in the US. The issue is human interaction and psyche behind it.

Blindly saying that it is impossible for the VP to influence the process because he has nothing to do with the awarding of contracts is just too simple.

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Vinny: If I knew nothing about government contracting, DoD operations, business, and foreign policy, this chronology might make me think badly of our Vice President.

Fortunately, that's not the case.

SD: It is fortunate that you don't think badly of your Vice President? (which had NOTHING to do with Vinny's post)

Reading comprehension mixed with sarcasm Ron. The fortunate part could relate back to two items. I know what Vinnie does, so it was an easy opportunity to make a jokingly sarcastic comment.

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Gee you said those who know the acronyms have no idea.

You forgot to finish the sentence Ron. I said no idea of the big picture, the who is pulling the strings part.

Sorry for the delay in responding, I had to go have lunch with the Mayor of Toronto.

[Ron 10]

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okay for both of you, I'll try and say it a bit simpler if I can.

You keep acting like we are stupid...But it is clear that your hatred of the US is overshaddowing your logic...

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The issue isn't just the awarding of goverment contracts in the US. The issue is human interaction and psyche behind it.

And the psyche of your hatred.

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Blindly saying that it is impossible for the VP to influence the process because he has nothing to do with the awarding of contracts is just too simple.

Blindly assuming he does and has used it is the talk of a conspiricy theorist.

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Reading comprehension mixed with sarcasm Ron. The fortunate part could relate back to two items. I know what Vinnie does, so it was an easy opportunity to make a jokingly sarcastic comment

Nice try at a back peddle. But you flat out said you did not say that...So are you John Kerry now?

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You forgot to finish the sentence Ron. I said no idea of the big picture, the who is pulling the strings part.

You still claim to know more than a guy that does it every day....I like how you refused to answer how many US Government Contracts you have been involved with.

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Sorry for the delay in responding, I had to go have lunch with the Mayor of Toronto.

So? Don't have an argument you throw a red herring?

You can't defend your position, and have been show to be a liar.

If I were in your position I'd try a diversion as well.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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You keep acting like we are stupid...But it is clear that your hatred of the US is overshaddowing your logic...

That one is getting a little old.....like some one else already said, I didn't say anything about the US on this thread. Could it be that you are slightly over sensitive?

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Blindly assuming he does and has used it is the talk of a conspiricy theorist.

I am sorry, is there a point to that sentence?

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Nice try at a back peddle.

Wasn't a back peddle, sorry if you didn't understand it the first time around.

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You still claim to know more than a guy that does it every day....I like how you refused to answer how many US Government Contracts you have been involved with.

I never claimed to have known more about the awarding of contracts in the US than Vinnie. I claim it isn't relevent to the issue at hand.

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So? Don't have an argument you throw a red herring?

You can't defend your position, and have been show to be a liar.

Really, where did I lie? Was it a lie, like the one where you claimed to make your last post to a thread?

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If I were in your position I'd try a diversion as well.

Wasn't a diversion, it was an indication that I am well versed with high level negotiations of contracts and the process of influence behind it. I do that all day for a living, sorry no acronyms for that.

[Ron 10]

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I am sorry, is there a point to that sentence?

Yeah, you always bash the US without any proof.

You claim to know more about a subject than a guy that does it for a living.

When called on that, you try to change the subject.

You have nothing to stand on, but that does not stop you from doing your best to bash.

You have no backing or proof to any of your posts...Reference the Pope thread where you tried to bash him for being a member of the Hitler Youth...Anyone that actually knew more than just that he was a member would have known at that time you HAD to join...If you had done any homework you would have see that he only did what he had to do, never joined any meetings, tried to get removed due to religious convictions, eventually fled from it risking death to return to the Church....

But you didn't bother to learn anything before spouting off about that subject or any other subject....Makes you look foolish, and I'm done with you. I refuse to discuss anything with a guy that doesn't bother to know anything about a subject and refuse to learn before he starts bitching about it.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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I refuse to discuss anything with a guy that doesn't bother to know anything about a subject and refuse to learn before he starts bitching about it.

You mean like tasers for instance Ron?

Plus considering the history of the RC curch and the Nazi's, the coce of a former Hitler Youth (even if he had to join, which growing up in Holland I know much more about than you would know) is not the smartest choice.

[rhino 0]

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And all this time we thought Iraq had WMD!

HA HA!!! Maybe you are right... I guess it was just PIXIE DUST that Sadham sprinkled on the Kurds killing thousands of people...

Pixie Dust... No WMD's...

To deny that Sadham had WMD's is to lack intelligence.. To deny the possibility that their are some WMD's buried in that big ass desert or that Sadhams sons could have smuggled wmd's out of the country just like they did billions of dollars of oil would be naive...

Rhino

[mr2mk1g 10]

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I guess it was just PIXIE DUST that Sadham sprinkled on the Kurds killing thousands of people...

By "had" I'm guessing he means at the time Sadam was failing to comply with the UN at the start of this century... not way back in the 1980's when he gassed the Kurds. Even our owns governments now say they were wrong and that Sadam didn't have any WMD at that time.

[rhino 0]

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Even our owns governments now say they were wrong and that Sadam didn't have any WMD at that time.

That's political backpeddling and trying to save face.. If and when they do find something this will all come full circle.. They will say I TOLD YOU SO..

Rhino

[GTAVercetti 0]

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Even our owns governments now say they were wrong and that Sadam didn't have any WMD at that time.

That's political backpeddling and trying to save face.. If and when they do find something this will all come full circle.. They will say I TOLD YOU SO..

Rhino

So backpedaling is okay if done by the Bush Administration?

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[03CLS 0]

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And all this time we thought Iraq had WMD!

HA HA!!! Maybe you are right... I guess it was just PIXIE DUST that Sadham sprinkled on the Kurds killing thousands of people...

Pixie Dust... No WMD's...

To deny that Sadham had WMD's is to lack intelligence.. To deny the possibility that their are some WMD's buried in that big ass desert or that Sadhams sons could have smuggled wmd's out of the country just like they did billions of dollars of oil would be naive...

Rhino

He didn't have them and to think he did lacks our intelligence as a country. Oh, but that's right everybody else said he did. Clintos said it to ........get real we went in for OIL and I'm sure once they measure the fields Iraq will have the largest reserves in the world.

And if the Taliban would have handed over Bin laden we probably woundn't even be in Afganistan.

Btw.Cheney is a dick

[newsstand 0]

Not at this level but I have written a few purchase orders that had to meet federal guidelines. Guess what I got exactly what I wanted down to the manufacturer. You just have to know how to write it so that no one else qualifies. While it would be a little blatant a phrase like "former CEO must no be vice-president" would probably fly right through.

"Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening."
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes