SkyDekker 1,465 #76 June 23, 2005 QuoteI am sure I know more about the US processes than you.... I would hope so...you are a US citizen...but then, you did start by claiming the president was elected by the people......so your knowedge is a little suspect... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #77 June 23, 2005 QuoteQuoteI am sure I know more about the US processes than you.... I would hope so...you are a US citizen...but then, you did start by claiming the president was elected by the people......so your knowedge is a little suspect... He (or someday she) is. You tried to add the word "directly" to the sentence to make it false. That we use an electoral college system on a state by state basis doesn't alter the fact that the people determine who is president. It certainly isn't a parliamentary system where the legislators pick the PM. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #78 June 23, 2005 QuoteQuoteWell then maybe they should not claim to have that proof? Some of us just don't need third degree burns as proof that there was a fire... You know, that phrase can effectively be turned the other way too. IOW - Bush didn't need to wait for Saddam to rain chemical weapons down on some target AGAIN before concluding that maybe we can't trust fate and leave him be. Consider every time he turned away an UN inspector as a fire alarm going off. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #79 June 23, 2005 QuoteHe (or someday she) is. You tried to add the word "directly" to the sentence to make it false. That we use an electoral college system on a state by state basis doesn't alter the fact that the people determine who is president. It certainly isn't a parliamentary system where the legislators pick the PM. They don't, since a minority vote can lead to election... You are right, parliament does not pick, the electoral college picks...and there is no requirement to pick the candidate whose party received the most votes either..... The people do not elect the president..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #80 June 23, 2005 Quotethere is no requirement to pick the candidate whose party received the most votes either Yeah, but when was the last time a member of the EC voted against what the state voters did? Secondly, the amount of times a president has been elected by the EC, but not by popular vote is very few. I think 2 or 3 times. And the reason he won in that situation is because he won some bigger states. That's how the system works, too bad. Otherwise, the president has been elected by popular vote as well (if you want to look at it that way). Thus, how is the president not elected by the people? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #81 June 23, 2005 Quotehow is the president not elected by the people? You just answered that question yourself.... When was the last time you went to your polling station and actually voted for the president? Where was a ballot listing the presidential candidates and you picked which cendidate you wanted to be president? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #82 June 23, 2005 QuoteWhen was the last time you went to your polling station and actually voted for the president? Where was a ballot listing the presidential candidates and you picked which cendidate you wanted to be president? Every single time. The people elect the president. If it makes you feel better to qualify it by saying in 2000 that a minority of the people indirectly elected George Bush, good for you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #83 June 23, 2005 QuoteEvery single time. Wouldn't mind seeing a copy of such a ballot. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #84 June 23, 2005 QuoteWhen was the last time you went to your polling station and actually voted for the president? Ummm, lets see, it was...oh yeah, last November. QuoteWhere was a ballot listing the presidential candidates and you picked which cendidate you wanted to be president? At every single polling station in America. Seriously, did you even read what you wrote? You're obviously incredibly ignorant of the election process if you think ballots with candidates on them don't exist. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #85 June 23, 2005 QuoteYou're obviously incredibly ignorant of the election process if you think ballots with candidates on them don't exist. and what is the statement on that ballot? Let me see if this rings a bell for you: "A vote for the candidate will actually be a vote for their electors" Though I will concede I was wrong on the listing on the ballot issue. Still doesn't change the original statement though...the people do not elect the president. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #86 June 23, 2005 By the way, here's a picture of a presidential ballot. Gee, what a surprise, you punch the hole of the candidate YOU want. This little stint of this topic is laughable. I mean, who thought somone would try to argue that ballots don't exist. But, I guess there's always someone out there ignorant enough to do it. Sorry, I usually refrain from such accusations, but this time, it's so bad I just have to. http://www.newyorkslime.com/florida-ballot.jpg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,998 #87 June 23, 2005 >But, I guess there's always someone out there ignorant enough to do it. Your one warning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #88 June 23, 2005 Now look at that ballot and tell me what the line is between brackets....that line clearly states you are not voting for the candidate... Then read my post right above yours...I agree, I was wrong about the listing on the ballot....though, funny enough, it proves my point.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #89 June 23, 2005 The voter information packet says that you are casting a vote for the candidate of your choosing. I guess it should also say to not complain if the canidate you voted for doesn't win. By the way, have you EVER voted in a US election, presidential or congressional? Because if you have, do us all a favor and don't vote; you've made it clear that you do not understand the system. That's ok, just don't vote unless you actually understand the system and how it works. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #90 June 23, 2005 My one warning? I don't understand. Honestly...I don't want to break rules, just tell me what was wrong and I'll rectify it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #91 June 23, 2005 QuoteNow look at that ballot and tell me what the line is between brackets....that line clearly states you are not voting for the candidate... What lines between the brackets? I think I'm confused about which lines you are talking about. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #92 June 23, 2005 QuoteBy the way, have you EVER voted in a US election You are asking that, yet calling me ignorant? Hummm, No I have never voted in any US election since I am Canadian. You do understand not everybody on here is from the US right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #93 June 23, 2005 QuoteWhat lines between the brackets? I think I'm confused about which lines you are talking about. the one that says: "A vote for the candidate will actually be a vote for their electors" Which pretty clearly indicates you are not voting for the candidate. The elector is under no obligation to chose the candidate of his party. (granted that is what usually if not always happens, but it still means the people do not elect the president) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites IanHarrop 42 #94 June 23, 2005 QuoteNow look at that ballot and tell me what the line is between brackets....that line clearly states you are not voting for the candidate... Then read my post right above yours...I agree, I was wrong about the listing on the ballot....though, funny enough, it proves my point.... Is this what you are refering to? From what I can see in the picture it says: "A vote for the candiadate will actually be a vote for their electors" Edited to add: Looks like you beat me to it!"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #95 June 23, 2005 >I don't want to break rules, just tell me what was wrong You can attack a person's ideas all you want, but you can't call them ignorant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ViperPilot 0 #96 June 23, 2005 Gotcha, sorry about that guys, didn't mean to offend anyone with a personal attack. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ViperPilot 0 #97 June 23, 2005 When has an elector not voted the way of the state's voters? Think of it this way - The electors of a state vote for the candidate who receives the most popular votes in that state, thus giving those electoral points to the candidate. Therefore, the people of the state have indeed voted for their candidate of choosing. So again, how is it that the people do not vote for their candidate? Now, if your argument of the eletor going against the state voters actually happened all the time, then I would be much more apt to agree with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelpdiver 2 #98 June 23, 2005 Quote Hummm, No I have never voted in any US election since I am Canadian. You do understand not everybody on here is from the US right? Yet it didn't stop you from making a totally incorrect statement about what's on our ballots. What else might you have completely wrong? Do you see the name of the Elector on that ballot? No, you see the name of the candidate. Who the citizens select. Torture English as much as you like, you won't change that reality. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ViperPilot 0 #99 June 23, 2005 I realize there are canadians on here. So seeing that you haven't voted in a US election, then what makes you such the self-appointed expert on the topic? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #100 June 24, 2005 Never said I was an expert...but the ballot clearly states that you are not voting for the person on the ballot....don't have to torture english for that......it says it right there.... Ron stated that the people elect the president....they don't. Your president is chosen, the persons who chose him are elected by the people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 4 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
SkyDekker 1,465 #92 June 23, 2005 QuoteBy the way, have you EVER voted in a US election You are asking that, yet calling me ignorant? Hummm, No I have never voted in any US election since I am Canadian. You do understand not everybody on here is from the US right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #93 June 23, 2005 QuoteWhat lines between the brackets? I think I'm confused about which lines you are talking about. the one that says: "A vote for the candidate will actually be a vote for their electors" Which pretty clearly indicates you are not voting for the candidate. The elector is under no obligation to chose the candidate of his party. (granted that is what usually if not always happens, but it still means the people do not elect the president) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IanHarrop 42 #94 June 23, 2005 QuoteNow look at that ballot and tell me what the line is between brackets....that line clearly states you are not voting for the candidate... Then read my post right above yours...I agree, I was wrong about the listing on the ballot....though, funny enough, it proves my point.... Is this what you are refering to? From what I can see in the picture it says: "A vote for the candiadate will actually be a vote for their electors" Edited to add: Looks like you beat me to it!"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,998 #95 June 23, 2005 >I don't want to break rules, just tell me what was wrong You can attack a person's ideas all you want, but you can't call them ignorant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #96 June 23, 2005 Gotcha, sorry about that guys, didn't mean to offend anyone with a personal attack. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #97 June 23, 2005 When has an elector not voted the way of the state's voters? Think of it this way - The electors of a state vote for the candidate who receives the most popular votes in that state, thus giving those electoral points to the candidate. Therefore, the people of the state have indeed voted for their candidate of choosing. So again, how is it that the people do not vote for their candidate? Now, if your argument of the eletor going against the state voters actually happened all the time, then I would be much more apt to agree with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #98 June 23, 2005 Quote Hummm, No I have never voted in any US election since I am Canadian. You do understand not everybody on here is from the US right? Yet it didn't stop you from making a totally incorrect statement about what's on our ballots. What else might you have completely wrong? Do you see the name of the Elector on that ballot? No, you see the name of the candidate. Who the citizens select. Torture English as much as you like, you won't change that reality. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ViperPilot 0 #99 June 23, 2005 I realize there are canadians on here. So seeing that you haven't voted in a US election, then what makes you such the self-appointed expert on the topic? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #100 June 24, 2005 Never said I was an expert...but the ballot clearly states that you are not voting for the person on the ballot....don't have to torture english for that......it says it right there.... Ron stated that the people elect the president....they don't. Your president is chosen, the persons who chose him are elected by the people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
