How about " I am an atheist, and proud of it?

[rehmwa 2]

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Can I be 'Bobistic'? It sounds like a cool club. Those non-bobistics are so unfortunate and need to be saved from themselves. Hurry, the heathens are getting away!

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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[jakee 1,489]

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I'd call the fervor for politics some people have equivalent to 'religious faith' also.

Whatever you do, don't mention the war! I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rehmwa 2]

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Whatever you do, don't mention the war! I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.

what war?

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[derivative 0]

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sounds agnostic - sounds like my position after a certain age until right now. I'm not surprised at all.

it doesn't sound atheistic (in which I do imagine people walking around chuckling to themselves - you see them everywhere.)

atheists have a strong belief which can't be proven nor disproven, they disdain or pity those that don't believe as they do, they are in missionary/recruit mode at all times, no matter how many they are, they always moan about being treated poorly, etc, etc, etc, - that's a religion in my book. (also sounds like a political party activist)

If someone wants to label themselves as a-theistic (i.e., anti-theistic) when they really just don't care either way, then they can call themselve a-theistic, they can also call themselves Bob-istic with the same definition - it matters equally. (Except to language experts and dictionary authors, then it really pisses them off)

I am an athiest, (If the term a-theist doesn't work for you, try non-theist - it's the same thing) but the last thing I do is go around chuckling about my superiority to others - I don't feel that I am superior to anyone, nor do I go around recruiting others. The vast majority of the discussions that I get into are just like this thread: usually started by a believer who is some brand of Christian who decides to challenge me on my beliefs, or lack thereof. Just look at the first post in this thread. As I've written earlier, I don't care what other people believe - until they try to legislate their beliefs.

As far as the science bit goes, why accept supernatural explanations for the way things are when we haven't exhausted natural expanations? I believe in the human capacity for reason to understand the universe as it is, without invoking miracles. We may not understand some things right now, but that doesn't mean that we won't figure them out.

I also believe that we as humans have the potential to be better than we act. It makes me sick to see so much of our energy spent in what amounts to be nothing more than tribalism - yes that includes organized religion. I think some religious philosophies have good ideas for how we should treat each other, but the execution of those ideas is severely lacking.

...the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, and make it possible.
- T.E. Lawrence

[jakee 1,489]

Ah, I promise you any english person reading that will get the quote! Fawlty Towers with John Cleese (of Monty Python) accidentaly taunting some germans about the war.

German: Please, vould you stop talking about ze var!
JC: Well you started it
G: No ve didn't
JC: yes you did you invaded Poland!

Just thought about it when you said how uptight people get over politics, politics = iraq, iraq = war, war = fawlty towers.

Trust me, it was a very very funny reference

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Royd 0]

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atheists have a strong belief which can't be proven nor disproven, they disdain or pity those that don't believe as they do, they are in missionary/recruit mode at all times, no matter how many they are, they always moan about being treated poorly, etc, etc, etc, - that's a religion in my book. (also sounds like a political party activist)

Does anyone remember Madeline Murray O'Hare? She was totally militant, and had a serious agenda. I would actually call her a God-hater.
It is ironic that her son is now in evangelistic Christian ministry. Talk about rebelling against your parents.

[Sockpuppet 0]

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Ah, I promise you any english person reading that will get the quote! Fawlty Towers with John Cleese (of Monty Python) accidentaly taunting some germans about the war.

German: Please, vould you stop talking about ze var!
JC: Well you started it
G: No ve didn't
JC: yes you did you invaded Poland!

Just thought about it when you said how uptight people get over politics, politics = iraq, iraq = war, war = fawlty towers.

Trust me, it was a very very funny reference

Er yes. In my earlier years I went to Belgium and Germany with the British Army, we got a little bit drunk in a bar and started singing "You'd all be speaking German if is wasn't for us".

Went down like a lead ballon. Not as bad as the "2 World Wars and 1 World Cup Doo Dar Doo Dar..." we sang in the German bar.

Hint: Most europeans dont find my sense of humor funny.

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Two of the three voices in my head agree with you. It might actually be unanimous but voice three only speaks Welsh.

[Andy9o8 2]

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Does anyone remember Madeline Murray O'Hare? She was totally militant, and had a serious agenda. I would actually call her a God-hater.

[semantics]
Militant, yes. God-hater, no; for to hate God, one must first acknowledge the existence of God.
[/semantics]

[Shotgun 1]

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>Oh, and I have decided to devote my life to promoting the
>militant atheist agenda . . .

Yep. I can still remember you throwing religious symbols at people and burning crosses and stars-of-David at your last barbeque . . .

Odd, I've been calling around all day trying to find a Jesus pinata for our next barbecue, but no one seems to keep them in stock... I guess there aren't enough militant atheists around who enjoy beating candy and cheap toys out of a paper Jesus.

[niolosoiale 0]

Just wanted to point out something....

Atheists and agnostics don't necessarily believe that everything came from nothing.

Certain individuals, like myself, take the position that all that exists didn't just spontaneously appear.

No one really buys into any "big bang" theory or anything else that involves one moment nothing, the next moment everything.

There has always been something. I specificially theorize that all that exists is made of energy and force. The energy has always been there and it expands infinitely. There never was nothing.

Christians should have no trouble rationalizing this as a possibility. Given the nature of christians and their tendencies to form undeniable answers about things they can't know.

[Royd 0]

semantics]
Militant, yes. God-hater, no; for to hate God, one must first acknowledge the existence of God.

[Shotgun 1]

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Can I be 'Bobistic'? It sounds like a cool club.

Actually, Bobisticism is not all it's cracked up to be. A bunch of pansy know-it-alls who think they're better than everyone else... Hmm, quite similar to atheism and Christianity.


In fact, screw the atheists and all those other religious-types... I think I'll go join in on the whole militant homosexual agenda thing... I bet they have a lot more fun than anyone else.

[philh 0]

"Atheistic faith: The sudden appearance of all matter from nothing, by nothing, and for nothing"

i think you need to check your facts. First off there is an observed phenemenon called a quantum vacum fluctuation which exactly meets your description. Many scientists have built model of the origin of the universe based upon such fluctuations. The idea being that negative gravatational energy balances out the positive mass energy, thus allowing the universe to be borne out of such a vacum fluctuation. Whether these two energy do balance out is not exactly known. But to say its basd upon blind faith is very wrong indeed.

Furthermore atheism does not imply any belief as to the origin of the univers. Even if the models described above are entirely wrong its makes no difference. Atheism is the dis belief in god not the the belief in any one explanation of the universes origin. To simply answer "I dont know" to the question of our origins is sufficient. Even if every proposed scientific explanaiton is wrong does not make the god explantion right.

[pirana 0]

[pajarito 0]

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Spritiuality is individualistic, religion is a group activity.

A religion is merely a roadmap to a destination. I can practice a religion all by myself.

[pirana 0]

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I consider an atheist to be 'actively' non-religious (a religious position in itself).

So choosing not to be religious is being religious? If I choose not to buy into astrology am I being astrological?

I'll give you that believing God does not exist is a belief, but not that it is a belief system. Religion with it's rituals, worship, martyrs, sacred places, etc. is a belief system.

A person with no awareness of religious beliefs, and therefore no opinion on them, would not have a belief in God. Using your logic, they would be religious.

Just to reiterate, because I get a lot of questions that obviously try to corner me as anti-God or anti-religious. I have no problem accepting others religious beliefs as valuable to them, and respecting them and their beliefs as long as they stick to matters of faith - such as belief in God's existence. I do take issue, and strongly oppose any attempt to institutionalize dogmatic beliefs that are proven untrue (such as the Earth being created in 7 days and other such tripe).

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[JackC 0]

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I consider an atheist to be 'actively' non-religious (a religious position in itself).

So choosing not to be religious is being religious? If I choose not to buy into astrology am I being astrological?

I'll give you that believing God does not exist is a belief, but not that it is a belief system. Religion with it's rituals, worship, martyrs, sacred places, etc. is a belief system.

A person with no awareness of religious beliefs, and therefore no opinion on them, would not have a belief in God. Using your logic, they would be religious.

Just to reiterate, because I get a lot of questions that obviously try to corner me as anti-God or anti-religious. I have no problem accepting others religious beliefs as valuable to them, and respecting them and their beliefs as long as they stick to matters of faith - such as belief in God's existence. I do take issue, and strongly oppose any attempt to institutionalize dogmatic beliefs that are proven untrue (such as the Earth being created in 7 days and other such tripe).

I agree completely. But there is a subtle difference between the statements: "I do not believe in god" and "I believe there is no god". Both statments of atheism but meaning different things.

Although I still can't get my head around how someone can actively not do something. Not doing something seems to be about as inactive as you can get.

Tonight I'm going to actively not do the washing up, I'm going to actively not do my paperwork and I'm going to actively not go to the gym. In other words, I'm going to actively sit on my arse and do fuck all.

[rehmwa 2]

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If I choose not to buy into astrology am I being astrological?

Maybe non-strological. If you mocked and actively tried to derail astrology, then would it be a-astrological. But that's silly, you have more important things to do than that. Like get your skis tuned up for next year.

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I'll give you that believing God does not exist is a belief, but not that it is a belief system. Religion with it's rituals, worship, martyrs, sacred places, etc. is a belief system.

Ahh, that I can accept. I do differentiate between Faith, Religion, and (organized) Church and have done it here before

Faith - a belief (subjective and unprovable in nature)
Religion - rituals and behavior used to exercise faith
Church - a power structure design to provide Religion in order to exploit the Faith(ful) [call me cynical]

so I'll change my game and call atheism a faith, not a religion. But, I then have to call the DFL and RNC "Churches". This is fun

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[pajarito 0]

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Although I still can't get my head around how someone can actively not do something. Not doing something seems to be about as inactive as you can get.

Try jumping out of the plane and "not" deploy your parachute. Your "inaction" will get you killed. Inaction can be just as important as action.

[JackC 0]

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Try jumping out of the plane and "not" deploy your parachute. Your "inaction" will get you killed. Inaction can be just as important as action.

Sure inaction can be dangerous but that's not what I'm talking about. I don't see how I can actively not do something. How can I be actively inactive?

[hairyjuan 0]

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Although I still can't get my head around how someone can actively not do something. Not doing something seems to be about as inactive as you can get.

"faith is being siezed by what you cannot see." Martin Luther King

Try jumping out of the plane and "not" deploy your parachute. Your "inaction" will get you killed. Inaction can be just as important as action.

we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively


wishers never choose, choosers never wish

[pajarito 0]

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Sure inaction can be dangerous but that's not what I'm talking about. I don't see how I can actively not do something. How can I be actively inactive?

You are actively refusing to take action.

[jakee 1,489]

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If I choose not to buy into astrology am I being astrological?

Maybe non-strological. If you mocked and actively tried to derail astrology, then would it be a-astrological. But that's silly, you have more important things to do than that. Like get your skis tuned up for next year.

So do Aardvarks go around hating Ardvarks? I always thought there was something off about those critters.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[JackC 0]

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You are actively refusing to take action.

So, there must be an infinite number of things I must be actively not doing, not believeing or not thinking at any given moment. I didn't know I was so busy. If I tell my boss about this, will I get a raise?

[Royd 0]

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As far as science being concerned with whether or not a spiritual experience is/was real or not; I do not know what you mean or what you are asking

According to the secular side of this discussion, if something cannot eventually be grasped and understood by the five senses, then it cannot possibly be real.

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I am very spiritual, but not in the least bit religious.

Being spiritual is admission that something outside of the realm of oneself, can influence our thought patterns.
The gathering of likeminded people to support and stengthen one another in their common bond, only seems to raise the ire of certain people when spirituallity is the common bond.
As I wrote in an earlier post, going to church week in and week out is like being stuck forever in the 12th grade. There's just got to be more to it than this.
That is where we must separate Christianity and religiosity. One is the performance of God and Christ, the other is the effort of man.