Bodies of G.I.'s Show Signs of Torture, Iraqi General Says

[steveorino 7]

Quote

If you happen to live in a society in which the only way to get a decent education is to be rich or join the forces ...

Your statement is woefully ignorant. My brothers made it through college. My dad was anything but rich. So did my wife and daughter. I earned a BS and MS without the GI bill. I'm earning another MA without benefit of it either. You obviously talk to many whining Americans who would rather complain than get off their butt and do something about their lives.If I were you I'd lay off the comments about our military or educational system, because you obviously do not have insight to either.

steveOrino

[Skyrad 0]

Maybe not you education system but I've had enough dealings with you mil. Anyway I'll say what i like when I like if you don't like it don't read it, or feel free to respond.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

You didn't answer my question (surprise, surprise)

Would you still say suck it up, war is war yada yada yada if we leveled the place?

Check out this webpage:
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Usa/Tests/Cromeo1.jpg

That's a hydrogen bomb test the US did. About 15 megatons in size (...Hiroshima was 10,000 to 15,000 kilotons. So, this test was basically 1,000 times larger.

Just 100 of these bombs would have killed the earth via a nuclear winter.

The Russians set off a 50 megaton hydrogen bomb. It broke windows 1000 miles away. If this thing had gone off in NYC, it could have broken windows from Chicago to New Orleans.

Nuclear weapons are NOT a viable weapon of war amongst rational nations.

We are all engines of karma

[warpedskydiver 0]

You mention that wea re fighting an asymetrical war currently.


Would you be pleased if we pulled out all but maybe 10k SPEC OPS troops and waged symetrical warfare?

Just think, then all the charges of the US using counterinsurgency tactics, like assassination, torture, mass murders, dismemberment, maiming, rape, killing the clergy, infanticide, bombings, sacking cities, could then be actually fair.

Would you then be happy?

Or are you satisfied that we actually have a professional army, willing to wear uniforms identifying ourselves, and subjecting our troops to the rules of warfare?

[steveorino 7]

Quote

Maybe not you education system

But you were so eloquent in your statement!

Quote

but I've had enough dealings with you mil. Anyway I'll say what i like when I like if you don't like it don't read it, or feel free to respond.

I thought that was what I was doing? Silly me!

steveOrino

[steveorino 7]

Quote

Nuclear weapons are NOT a viable weapon of war amongst rational nations.

Lord, I know that. I was on a SADM team (Special Atomic Demolition Munitions) in Special Forces. I was only trying to see where he'd draw the line with "war is war, suck it up" mantra.

steveOrino

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

Your statement is woefully ignorant. My brothers made it through college. My dad was anything but rich. So did my wife and daughter. I earned a BS and MS without the GI bill. I'm earning another MA without benefit of it either. You obviously talk to many whining Americans who would rather complain than get off their butt and do something about their lives.If I were you I'd lay off the comments about our military or educational system, because you obviously do not have insight to either.

Yes, Skyrad's statement is clearly not fully informed.

We are all engines of karma

[Skyrad 0]

Quote

Quote

Maybe not you education system

But you were so eloquent in your statement!

Quote

but I've had enough dealings with you mil. Anyway I'll say what i like when I like if you don't like it don't read it, or feel free to respond.

I thought that was what I was doing? Silly me!

There you go, I knew we'd agree on something if just kept going

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[steveorino 7]

In Reply To
------------------------------------------------------------

Your statement is woefully ignorant. My brothers made it through college. My dad was anything but rich. So did my wife and daughter. I earned a BS and MS without the GI bill. I'm earning another MA without benefit of it either. You obviously talk to many whining Americans who would rather complain than get off their butt and do something about their lives.If I were you I'd lay off the comments about our military or educational system, because you obviously do not have insight to either.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Yes, Skyrad's statement is clearly not fully informed.


But that is what I love about SC. People speak with such authority on subjects they have no knowledge of.

steveOrino

[Skyrad 0]

So because Steve and his kin are motivated and adaptable individuals does that mean that I am wrong? I know of two US soldiers who joined for the educational opportunities how many more do then? Its not an unusual reason I'm sure.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

Would you be pleased if we pulled out all but maybe 10k SPEC OPS troops and waged symetrical warfare?

Yes, why don't we do that? I'm sure it would be effective in its own way. The world would most certainly be a different place, and quite possibly a better one.

We are all engines of karma

[warpedskydiver 0]

It would certainly be efficient

Hey here is a thought:

What would the world be like if the US let it's citizens conduct terrorist operations, unimpeded by our own government, laws, and even better yet if we armed them all, and gave them as much support as we could muster.

hmmmmm?

[Skyrad 0]

I'd like to see a total withdrawl.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

does that mean that I am wrong?

Which time?

Quote

I know of two US soldiers who joined for the educational opportunities how many more do then?

Last time I checked, about 25% of high school graduates go to college. Lots of people go into the US military for the applied education it brings.

Quote

Maybe not you education system

Ahh, I don't recall ever seeing you misspell a word. Is it time to take your shoes off?

We are all engines of karma

[Skyrad 0]

?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[StreetScooby 5]

Quote

?

??

Quote

Is it time to take your shoes off?

Oh, are you referring to this? Remember posse comitatus

We are all engines of karma

[livendive 8]

Quote

Quote

If you happen to live in a society ...

Your statement is woefully ignorant ...

Which letter in the word "If" triggered such a reaction?

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[Skyrad 0]

LOL.... You drunk again mate?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

Yea, raw nerve I guess.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[StreetScooby 5]

Working on it Coors lite. Probably won't get there, but that's OK.

We are all engines of karma

[Skyrad 0]

Quote

Working on it Coors lite. Probably won't get there, but that's OK.

Q) Whats the difference between American beer and sex in a canoe?

A) Theres no difference, ther're both fucking close to water!

Good luck! J

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[kallend 2,027]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Where did you get that? In no way did I imply that.

'Doing that (torture) since their prophet (Mohammed) was alive'. Thats how I read it.

I was just pointing out that torture, for every civilisation, goes back beyond the dawn of time.

As standards of decency evolve, so things like torture and capital punishment become increasingly unacceptable in advanced societies.

So why does the US indulge in both with the overwhelming consent of its people?

Not sufficiently evolved...

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,991]

>But you are saying it was okay, right?

Nope. But good try, there.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

I'm also glad the article is descriptive. People need to be reminded of the kind of sadistic sub-humans we are up against.

How do you say that in Arabic?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060619/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_soldiers_charged

If they murdered innocent people then they need to stand trial and be judged.

Are you somehow trying to show parity to torturing someone by cutting off their testicles, gouging out their eyes, ripping out their hearts and cutting off their heads? It's pretty sad you don't see the difference.

Deads dead. How do you know those dead iraqis wern't tortured first either....You don't.

And you don't either. Not that it changes anything either way. It takes a sick mind to do what they did whether the soldiers were dead or alive. Sad, but not surprising you can't see it.

[opurt 0]

The beheading of soldiers and the grotesque individual brutality videotaped for public consumption was predicted well before Zarqawi made his cinematic debut. In October 2001, on Hackworth.com, Article 01, an expert on military and political affairs wrote the following:

"During the war with the Soviets [Afghanistan], videotapes were made of communist prisoners having their throats slit. Indeed, there did exist a "trade" in prisoners so that souvenir videos could be made by outsiders to take home with them.

This practice has spread to the Philippines, Bosnia and Chechnya were similar videos are being made today and can be found on the web for those so inclined. We can expect our soldiers to be treated the same way.

Sometime during this war I expect that we will see videos of US prisoners having their heads cut off.

Our enemies will do this not only to demonstrate their "strength" to their followers, but also to cause us to overreact, to seek wholesale revenge against civilian populations and to turn this into the world wide religious war that they desperately want. This will be a test of our will and of our character. (For further collaboration of this type of activity please read Kipling).

This will not be a pretty war; it will be a war of wills, of resolve and somewhat conversely of compassion and of a character.

Towards our enemies, we must show a level of ruthlessness that has not been part of our military character for a long time.

But to those who are not our enemies we must show a level of compassion probably unheard of during war. We should do this not for humanitarian reasons, even though there are many, but for shrewd military logic."

From Hackworth.com, October 2001.

An article well worth reading. FYI, the second link above, in Article 02 also has the somewhat famous Barry McCaffrey "We are going to disrupt these people..." email.