Exit Delay, stop pushing me

[kallend 2,026]

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A couple jumps ago I was spotting for the whole load, basically, and the uppers were very high. (We knew this on the ground, and I picked a climbout and exit position based on this and the number of groups.)

The jumpers behind me were very agitated in the manner you describe. I told them they were free to go first, and I easily shifted and cleared the wide Caravan door. I promised I'd wait plenty of time before following them. They did not take me up on my offer. I can't recall if this was because they actually looked out at that point, or some other thought process.

So in the end, everyone opened precisely where I intended them to, and we all had no trouble flying back and landing happily, proving* wind charts, a little math, and a couple hundred jumps' experience at that location with that jump run heading can do wonders.

(* Really, one jump proves nothing. But I made sure to talk to each of them afterward to try and rub in how well my exit point worked out for them. )

IMO exit separation delays are non-negotiable. However, the first group out cannot wait for the perfect spot, they should take an acceptable spot.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[FlyingJarhead 0]

the wind was still that day..but anyways, can someone explain to me the "bad spot" because personally i like jumping out over the lake...

[billvon 2,991]

>can someone explain to me the "bad spot" . . .

Bad spot - a spot where, if you open at your normal altitude, there's no way you can get to the landing area even if you do everything right.

Good spot - a spot where, if you have a low pull, a mal and a cutaway, you can still make the landing area with no problem.

Most spots - everything in between.

[FlyingJarhead 0]

thanks..

[JohnMitchell 16]

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Bad spot - a spot where, if you open at your normal altitude, there's no way you can get to the landing area even if you do everything right.

Good spot - a spot where, if you have a low pull, a mal and a cutaway, you can still make the landing area with no problem.

And then there are those high wind days, where the right spot for a 2200' cutaway is over a 1/2 mile or more from the DZ, over the trees, and a 1200' cutaway will put your junk in the trees. I always spot for the freebag, but sometimes they come out high, sometimes they come out low, and the trees seem to suck them in.

I have spotted Vskydiver's freebag into the parking lot from 10,,500.
I do remember walking in from a bad spot one day after a bunch of us hummed it down. When one of our jumpers bitched to the spotter, who opened at 2 and made it back, he said "Well, if you had opened at a safe altitude, you would have made it back."

The jumper replied "What kind of spot is it that requires you to open as a safe altitude? Jeez."

[mnealtx 0]

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I have spotted Vskydiver's freebag into the parking lot from 10,,500.

I believe that's what used to be called "spotting for the reserve" Nice job!!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[fcajump 164]

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I have spotted Vskydiver's freebag into the parking lot from 10,,500.

I believe that's what used to be called "spotting for the reserve" Nice job!!

If you've ever jumped at the (now quiet) Hartwood, you LEARNED TO SPOT (see photo). They started with rounds, and when I started there, we still jumped w/ round reserves. As you see, you either landed in or out... there was little in-between.

Saw an AFF level 1 have a bag lock. The reserve side aided in getting the SOS pulled and left him under a Strong 26' lopo. The still bagged main landed 100 yards straight out from manifest on the grass run-way and the student (w/ radio assist) centered it in the peas. We understood what a WDI was and why the "spotter" stuck his head out before exit. (I called for a correction on a jumprun a while back and although the pilot was cool with it, most of the jumpers had never heard of such a thing...)

Blue ones,
JW

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

[fcajump 164]

Talked to the DZ... they said that they got it... here (DZ.com)...

So with a quick search I found the following:

Down at the bottom of
http://indra.net/~bdaniels/ftw/index.html
is an article called "Dealing with Uppers" that
has some ground speed vs seconds numbers
plus a discussion of where they came from.

http://indra.net/~bdaniels/ftw/sg_crt_spreadsheet.xls
is the URL.
***

The chart looks VERY similar to what we have (I'll compare it this weekend.)

The chart can be easily expanded to include any speed(s) you want to allow for faster planes and/or downwind runs.

Have fun,
JW

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

[gemini 0]

Last weekend I was first out in a two-way. There was another 2-way behind us.

In freefall, I see one of guys fall past us with about 200 ft separation. What scared me was that I couldn't find his buddy, so our jump effectively stopped when the first guy went past.

I landed and asked the guy how much time he had given us and he replied "3 seconds". He got a quick lesson in separation, upper winds, ground speed, etc.

A lot of jumpers will yell at people in the door regardless of what is going on.

I have also been requested by a 4-way team to make sure the 2-way behind them gave them a good delay. I stood up when the 4-way did and leaned out the door when they exited and watched. Then turned to the two-way and said "you ready?"

On the ground I made sure the two-way (two very inexperienced jumpers) understood why I did what I did. Turns out they had not given the 4-way team much separation on an earlier jump, but did not realize it because no one had talked to them about upper wind speeds since one of their early AFF jumps.

Blue skies,

Jim