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QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteI do not see why anyone would believe something in the complete absence of any evidence in support of it.
I guess you think your fellow professors who teach philosphy are wasting everyone's time, eh?
No, they amuse the students.
Besides, everyone needs an easy A!
That's what physics and engineering courses are for.
Somehow I seriously doubt that!
I miss Lee.
And JP.
And Chris. And...
Richards, that's a question I've found myself pondering enough times. How could an ever merciful and loving God do such a thing?
I think this is more likely to be earlier man's interpretation of things - I try to believe in God. It doesn't bother me too much lack of evidence or some of the stories in the bible that lack authenticity. (Like the lady getting turned into a pillar of salt. Sure she did.)
The bible is a book of fables or parables really. I try and read it with this in mind. Like organised religion, man has interferred too much; for power, control and money - hence, don't come to church and spend your tithing you'll spend eternity getting toasted with the devil sticking a pitchfork in your ass.
I'm 60/40 in a belief of God. Evidence? I thought the whole point was there to never be evidence! What would be the point of our existence if everybody knew, without any doubt, God existed?
On a course a few years back we had to 'supposedly' relearn Newtons laws (I never really knew them). But what interested me was energy and how it transfers. It can't ever just cease to exist. Like the stone I have aimed at your face has potential energy. I throw it - kinetic energy. It misses and hits a brick wall - heat and sound energy, on so on.
Well, what happens to our energy when we pass away in our sleep???
One last thought - infinity. An atom - consists of a nucleus with varying electrons orbiting and sometimes tacheons orbiting the electrons. Split it. Massive release of energy.
Sun = an atom? Planets, moons, etc? Worm/blackholes between the 'levels'?
Edited to add reincarnation: If your a bellend throughout your life and come back as dung beetle or something, what's the point in that? Your not going to remember being a bellend are you? So where's the punishment? Fables again I reckon.
Come to our organised religion!Pay your tithings!Or you'll burn in hell!
(or end up a dung beetle)
p.s. Just about every church I ever visited in Central Scotland as a kid had a 'church roof' collection point. Perhaps a case of the Church being more interested in what the congregation can do for the church, rather than the other way round - the way it should be?
p.p.s. why are so many organised religions and leaders fabulously wealthy?
'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'
I think this is more likely to be earlier man's interpretation of things - I try to believe in God. It doesn't bother me too much lack of evidence or some of the stories in the bible that lack authenticity. (Like the lady getting turned into a pillar of salt. Sure she did.)
The bible is a book of fables or parables really. I try and read it with this in mind. Like organised religion, man has interferred too much; for power, control and money - hence, don't come to church and spend your tithing you'll spend eternity getting toasted with the devil sticking a pitchfork in your ass.
I'm 60/40 in a belief of God. Evidence? I thought the whole point was there to never be evidence! What would be the point of our existence if everybody knew, without any doubt, God existed?
On a course a few years back we had to 'supposedly' relearn Newtons laws (I never really knew them). But what interested me was energy and how it transfers. It can't ever just cease to exist. Like the stone I have aimed at your face has potential energy. I throw it - kinetic energy. It misses and hits a brick wall - heat and sound energy, on so on.
Well, what happens to our energy when we pass away in our sleep???
One last thought - infinity. An atom - consists of a nucleus with varying electrons orbiting and sometimes tacheons orbiting the electrons. Split it. Massive release of energy.
Sun = an atom? Planets, moons, etc? Worm/blackholes between the 'levels'?
Edited to add reincarnation: If your a bellend throughout your life and come back as dung beetle or something, what's the point in that? Your not going to remember being a bellend are you? So where's the punishment? Fables again I reckon.
Come to our organised religion!
Pay your tithings!Or you'll burn in hell!
(or end up a dung beetle)
p.s. Just about every church I ever visited in Central Scotland as a kid had a 'church roof' collection point. Perhaps a case of the Church being more interested in what the congregation can do for the church, rather than the other way round - the way it should be?
p.p.s. why are so many organised religions and leaders fabulously wealthy?
'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'
Buddhism is kinda plagued by a mystical hollywood thing.
Koans and such are made to shock your mind out of set patterns of thinking. Sometimes people create patterns of behavior and one of those habits is seeing your death as separate from the rest of the world, when it is truly an interdependent part of life itself.
As long as there is consciousness there is existence. Think shrodengers cat, an observer of some sort is needed to carry on reality.When you die the world isn't over. It's not really "you" that's reincarnating, it's consciousness itself. Just another way of saying life goes on basically.
The leaf dies, but the tree lives.
If you walk, just walk. If you sit, just sit. But whatever you do, don't wobble.
- Master Ummon
Koans and such are made to shock your mind out of set patterns of thinking. Sometimes people create patterns of behavior and one of those habits is seeing your death as separate from the rest of the world, when it is truly an interdependent part of life itself.
As long as there is consciousness there is existence. Think shrodengers cat, an observer of some sort is needed to carry on reality.When you die the world isn't over. It's not really "you" that's reincarnating, it's consciousness itself. Just another way of saying life goes on basically.
The leaf dies, but the tree lives.
If you walk, just walk. If you sit, just sit. But whatever you do, don't wobble.
- Master Ummon
pirana 0
I would guess most atheists do not believe that anything like a soul (that survives after the biological functions have ceased) even exists; so probably wouldn't believe in it.
I do think that because we continue on in the memory of living people, and have at least some small influence in how they lead their lives, that the "spirit" of the person continues on beyond death. But not reincarnation in the sense that those who have it as part of their religion would believe.
Beliefs echo down thru the generations, spreading like ripples, ever-widening and ever-weakening.
I also think there is a connection between the belief in reincarnation and the tangible handing down of beliefs from generation to generation. Similar to the idea many anthropologists have that reverence for the elders of the tribe in life evolved into reverence to the elders in death to reverence to spirits to reverence to dieties. It would explain a lot.
I do think that because we continue on in the memory of living people, and have at least some small influence in how they lead their lives, that the "spirit" of the person continues on beyond death. But not reincarnation in the sense that those who have it as part of their religion would believe.
Beliefs echo down thru the generations, spreading like ripples, ever-widening and ever-weakening.
I also think there is a connection between the belief in reincarnation and the tangible handing down of beliefs from generation to generation. Similar to the idea many anthropologists have that reverence for the elders of the tribe in life evolved into reverence to the elders in death to reverence to spirits to reverence to dieties. It would explain a lot.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
Quote
But what interested me was energy and how it transfers. It can't ever just cease to exist. Like the stone I have aimed at your face has potential energy. I throw it - kinetic energy. It misses and hits a brick wall - heat and sound energy, on so on.
Well, what happens to our energy when we pass away in our sleep???
We are all engines of karma
QuoteAnd then you really regretted it when her monthly friend came and she wasn't prepared!
Not really.
This thread reminds me of a funny Mel Gibson line from Air America. GREAT movie.
"Yeah.......when you die, they put you in a box, throw dirt on top of you, and don't even let you out for weekends."
pirana 0
QuoteQuoteThere is not one piece of actual testable evidence in support of reincarnation.
Testable evidence is flawed as well.
Years ago, we "proved" that the Sun moves around the Earth. We "knew" that bloodletting would cure all ailments.
There will come a time when we have to admit that everything that we know now.... is really wrong.
Actually the fact that they got the revolving part right was a good step in moving away from the everything-on-a-shell-in-a-fixed-distance-above-Earth idea. Later corrected to better define the system, with additional corrections always coming.
Rarely does a well established theory (an often misunderstood term - individual opinions do not constitute a theory) get completely thrown out. They are almost always built upon.
Newton's findings did not dismantle Euclidian geometry, they built on it. Relativity built on Newton, and quantum mechanics is building on relativity. That's how most science works. It is how all of the physical sciences have proceeded since the early
Geeks. They really got the whole science thing going in high gear after the Ahabs got the motor running. Think of the pesky Dark Ages as a major breakdown that caused a delay in the journey.
So, in spirit I would agree with you, but would change it to saying most of what we know is incomplete to make it an accurate statement.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
micro 0
QuoteQuoteAnd then you really regretted it when her monthly friend came and she wasn't prepared!
Not really.
This thread reminds me of a funny Mel Gibson line from Air America. GREAT movie.
"Yeah.......when you die, they put you in a box, throw dirt on top of you, and don't even let you out for weekends."
I LOVE that movie!!!
I miss Lee.
And JP.
And Chris. And...
I appreciate your taking the time to offer perspective but I still have a question that bothers me. How can eternal damnation be rationalised. I can see the rational in never letting someone into heaven (eternal bliss must be earned) and I can even see temporary hell time being justified but why eternal suffering? If God feels someone simply does not deserve heaven then why not just get rid of him and make his soul cease to exist (he has the power to do that.). What is the purpose being served if after five hundred trillion milleniums of constantly screaming in horrific agony in a lake of fire the person has no end in sight to his/her suffering? What is the purpose of keeping a soul consious for an eternity simply to make that person scream from hideous unendurable mindbending agony? If it is too late for that person to change then what are you teaching the person? What crime deserves eternal horrific agony? The whole hell business seems so disproportionally cruel that it makes me frightened to even comprehend what kind of god could conceive something so horrificly sadistic. That makes me wonder if I should worship God for his grace or simply worship him for the same reason people in dictatorships worship their leaders (out of fear). I never asked him to create me; why should I be terrorized out of fear of hell if I don't meet the standards of someone who I did not ask to create me?
I do not mean to be disrespectful to your religion. In fact my wife is a practicing Catholic and I respect those who have such strong faith in their religion but I seriously want to know the answers to some of my harder questions.
Richards
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