Kids & Guns in the Home

[JohnRich 4]

News:

Teen kills burglar in home

A 14-year-old boy shot and killed a man who broke into his family's home today and threatened to kill him and his mother.

The man confronted a woman as she was carrying groceries into her home. The man forced her inside and tied up her and her son. The woman was able to loosen the binding and free her son, who got his father's revolver from a security box beneath a bed. As the man tried to break into the room where the two were and threatened to kill them both, the teen fired a shot through the door and hit the intruder in the head.

Source

[wmw999 2,439]

That's nice. According to the NRA site, 56 children were killed by gunfire in 2003 (that's the latest year I could find in there). I'll bet that 56 didn't defend their families against intruders.

I'm not saying it's bad to have guns in the house, just saying that you're ignoring that giant gorilla in the corner (careless parents who don't protect guns well enough) in your desire to see the good that can come.

They exist. Saying they shouldn't isn't very helpful or realistic. If people all did what they should we wouldn't need police either.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[kallend 2,026]

Guns Put Children at Risk

CHILDREN ARE DYING AT significantly higher rates in states with higher levels of gun ownership. This information, revealed in a study by the Harvard School of Public Health, establishes a clear link between firearms and violent death among children.

The study, funded in part by the Joyce Foundation, focused on children aged 5-14 and compared ten years of data from all 50 states. While the five states with the highest gun ownership have about as many children as the five states with the lowest gun ownership, they have very different violent death rates among children, researchers found: over a ten-year period, 253 children died gun-related deaths in the high gun states, compared to 15 in the low gun states. And, while non-gun-related suicide rates were similar in both sets of states, 153 children used a gun to kill themselves in the five highest ranking gun states, compared to 22 in the lowest ranking states.

"When most people buy a gun, especially a handgun, they do so under the presumption that they are protecting the people they care about and the property they own," said lead author Matthew Miller, M.D., ScD., of the Harvard Injury Control Research Center. "Our results suggest that, on average, this presumption is not warranted: children whom parents seek to protect with guns are instead being killed by guns."

These findings are consistent with international comparisons. The U. S. has the highest level of firearm ownership among developed nations. Before a child in the U. S. reaches 15, he or she is five times more likely than a child in the rest of the industrialized world to be murdered, twice as likely to commit suicide, and 12 times more likely to die a gun-related death.

Gun-related deaths are the third leading cause of death among American children 5-14, following car accidents and cancer.

Matthew Miller, Harvard Injury Control Research Center

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SpeedRacer 1]

I wonder if children are drowning at significantly higher rates in homes with swimming pools.

Speed Racer
--------------------------------------------------

[Lindsey 0]

Quote

I wonder if children are drowning at significantly higher rates in homes with swimming pools.

You might have a correlation with kids who aren't good swimmers having easy access to a pool when nobody's watching....

I think the same prob'ly holds true for guns. I bet you see the problems when you have 1) kids who haven't been taught how to handle a gun safely (or to leave them alone) 2) in a home with unsecured guns while they're 3) not being watched.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Nightingale 0]

you say that 56 kids were killed by guns... however, you didn't say WHOSE guns. If those guns belonged to intruders, drive by shooters, or people otherwise not in the home, your statistic doesn't demonstrate any correlation between guns in the home and shooting deaths of children.

I think far too many parents who don't own guns don't bother to gun-proof their own kids, thinking that guns aren't a danger to that kid, because, after all, there aren't any guns in the house. Sure, you may not have a gun in the house, but your neighbor might. Or your kid might find a gun somewhere outside of the home, perhaps a weapon ditched by a criminal. Kids that understand guns are going to go running for the nearest adult. Kids that don't understand guns are going to pick it up and investigate it themselves.

IMO, kids are much more likely to play with guns when they don't understand that guns are not toys to be played with. My brother and I would NEVER touch my dad's guns when we were little, because we knew they were not toys and we knew what guns were capable of. Dad didn't teach us to shoot, but he certainly made us gun-safe. We were taught about the power of guns, and that you never, ever touched one without permission. We never had toy guns, and we weren't allowed to play with other kids' toy guns, because guns are not toys.

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

I wonder if children are drowning at significantly higher rates in homes with swimming pools.

I would think that the chance of a kid drowning in his own backyard is greater if his backyard has a pool in it than if it doesn't.

Anyhow, it's a qustion of balancing interests: if the kids don't have access to a gun in their house, there's less of a chance that (a) there will be an accidental shooting, AND (b) a burglar breaking in will be deterred or defended against.

[Nightingale 0]

Quote

Quote

I wonder if children are drowning at significantly higher rates in homes with swimming pools.

You might have a correlation with kids who aren't good swimmers having easy access to a pool when nobody's watching....

I think the same prob'ly holds true for guns. I bet you see the problems when you have 1) kids who haven't been taught how to handle a gun safely 2) in a home with unsecured guns while they're 3) not being watched.

linz

Exactly. you list three factors, and without any one of those factors, a gun accident isn't going to happen. If you have a kid who knows gun safety in a home with unsecured guns while not being watched, that kid is a lot safer than one who doesn't know to leave a gun alone.

[downwardspiral 0]

Quote

you say that 56 kids were killed by guns... however, you didn't say WHOSE guns. If those guns belonged to intruders, drive by shooters, or people otherwise not in the home, your statistic doesn't demonstrate any correlation between guns in the home and shooting deaths of children.

I think far too many parents who don't own guns don't bother to gun-proof their own kids, thinking that guns aren't a danger to that kid, because, after all, there aren't any guns in the house. Sure, you may not have a gun in the house, but your neighbor might. Or your kid might find a gun somewhere outside of the home, perhaps a weapon ditched by a criminal. Kids that understand guns are going to go running for the nearest adult. Kids that don't understand guns are going to pick it up and investigate it themselves.

IMO, kids are much more likely to play with guns when they don't understand that guns are not toys to be played with. My brother and I would NEVER touch my dad's guns when we were little, because we knew they were not toys and we knew what guns were capable of. Dad didn't teach us to shoot, but he certainly made us gun-safe. We were taught about the power of guns, and that you never, ever touched one without permission. We never had toy guns, and we weren't allowed to play with other kids' toy guns, because guns are not toys.

*swoon*


A friend of mine put a hole in his parents dinning room floor because he thought his dad kept their 12 gauge UNloaded. He would have put it in my back or the wall had I not urged him to point it at the floor before he pulled the trigger. Scrared the shit out of us. Thank goodness my dad taught me about handguns at a young age.

Please teach your children gun safety.


edited to change loaded to UNloaded.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[DrewEckhardt 0]

Quote

Guns Put Children at Risk

Although it's a slight risk.

Firearms are responsible for less than 1% of accidental deaths among children under 14 years old. Keeping children off bicycles (2%) and out of water (16%) would save far more lives.

While its easy to vilify guns, our children face much bigger risks elsewhere.

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

That's nice. According to the NRA site, 56 children were killed by gunfire in 2003 (that's the latest year I could find in there). I'll bet that 56 didn't defend their families against intruders.

If you include non fatal incidents, I'd bet you'd find a lot more than 56.

In any event, guns and 12-14yos work out a lot better than guns and 6 yos, provided the parenting is at all present. That age is more than sufficient to learn and understand, and would be preferable to find the guns and hoping the kids never find em.

[livetofall 0]

Sweeeeet! damn I havent wanted one since rocknroll concert days, but I want this kids autograph! WOW!
Edit: one thing odd on report: it says that kid shout through door after he threatened to kill and break in. Being that he just got done tying them up, wouldnt he just have to turn the doorknob , not BREAK in??? Good story, poor reporter.

www.911missinglinks.com the definitive truth of 9/11..the who and why, not how

You can handle the TRUTH www.theforbiddentruth.net

[rickjump1 0]

Quote

you say that 56 kids were killed by guns... however, you didn't say WHOSE guns. If those guns belonged to intruders, drive by shooters, or people otherwise not in the home, your statistic doesn't demonstrate any correlation between guns in the home and shooting deaths of children.

I think far too many parents who don't own guns don't bother to gun-proof their own kids, thinking that guns aren't a danger to that kid, because, after all, there aren't any guns in the house. Sure, you may not have a gun in the house, but your neighbor might. Or your kid might find a gun somewhere outside of the home, perhaps a weapon ditched by a criminal. Kids that understand guns are going to go running for the nearest adult. Kids that don't understand guns are going to pick it up and investigate it themselves.

IMO, kids are much more likely to play with guns when they don't understand that guns are not toys to be played with. My brother and I would NEVER touch my dad's guns when we were little, because we knew they were not toys and we knew what guns were capable of. Dad didn't teach us to shoot, but he certainly made us gun-safe. We were taught about the power of guns, and that you never, ever touched one without permission. We never had toy guns, and we weren't allowed to play with other kids' toy guns, because guns are not toys.

Sadly, I've met two different couples who had accidential shooting in their homes. Both resulted in the death of a child who was a visitor.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[Nightingale 0]

Sounds like those people should've had the sense to lock their guns when they had someone visiting. If they'd done that, OR if the parents of those kids had taught them about guns, those kids would probably be alive today.

[rickjump1 0]

Quote

Sounds like those people should've had the sense to lock their guns when they had someone visiting. If they'd done that, OR if the parents of those kids had taught them about guns, those kids would probably be alive today.

You are right.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[Stumpy 284]

Which would also be the case if the guns hadn't been in the house.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[peregrinerose 0]

There was a case a couple of days ago in Harrisburg. 14 year old playing with gun, insisted he knew what he was doing, ejected the magazine, didn't realize that doesn't mean the gun isn't still loaded, and fatally shot himself in the head. Where did the gun come from? It was stolen out of another home several weeks ago.

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[NCclimber 0]

Quote

There was a case a couple of days ago in Harrisburg. 14 year old playing with gun, insisted he knew what he was doing, ejected the magazine, didn't realize that doesn't mean the gun isn't still loaded, and fatally shot himself in the head. Where did the gun come from? It was stolen out of another home several weeks ago.

So, does this mean there one less criminal in the gene pool?

With all the talk about gun related deaths of children, I'd like to see a study comparing current statistics to those of 40 or 50 years ago. My guess is we'd see a significantly higher gun death per armed household for today versus 40 or 50 years ago, which would indicate this issue has a lot to do with gun safety and gun education.

I grew up around guns. My father collected them. We had boxes of ammo that were easily accessable (Anyone ever put a loaded cartidge in a vise???). Aside from intentionally shooting my brother in the ass with my daisy, I've never ever pointed a gun at anyone. It's just not done!

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Guns Put Children at Risk

I think it's simple - people that own guns that don't respect them will always have issues. And their children might pay for it.

People that own guns and that take the time to also "Teach their Children" about guns have no real issues.

Fear of guns, rather than respect, is what drive anti-gun sentiment. And I agree, these people shouldn't have them because they might look like adults, but with firearms they act like children.

My dad is a gunsmith and collector. As kids were taught responsible gun safety since well before even starting school. At the age of 4, if I'd have seen a gun "lying about" like happens with city folk according to anti-gunners - I'd have never touched it and would have found my dad immediately. At the age of 8 or 9, I'd have been able to unload it and take it to him. We never 'played' with them - our parents were responsible enough to teach us that.

I wonder if these same parents had table saws instead, how many of their kids would be hurt that way instead. Eventually all of them I'd guess.

Guns need to be a normal and accepted part of society, not some secret or romantic or shameful thing that needs to be hidden - anti gun sentiment is more likely a primary cause of accidental gun deaths that anything else. (for those weird lefties compare it to your contraceptive vs uptight parents argument as an analogy you might get). Or is the knowledge argument only for Politically Correct topics?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Lindsey 0]

There are so many things in this world that put children at risk. But ya' can't raise 'em in a bubble. Educating children about how to be safe when there are hazards in their world (whether that's learning gun safety, learning traffic rules for when they ride a bicycle, teaching them how to swim, or teaching them that strangers sometimes try to "trick" them), will go a lot further in their raising than teaching them to stay away from things that are potentially hazardous. I'd rather have my child grow up competent than avoidant.

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[SkyDekker 1,465]

pretty violent nation that America...no wonder they keep going all over the world to kill people....

(sorry don't know what else to say anymore when JR keeps posting stuff reminding everybody what an incredibly violent nation the US is)

[Tonto 1]

Quote

the teen fired a shot through the door and hit the intruder in the head.

What happened to

"When using or storing a gun, always follow these NRA rules:

Know your target and what is beyond.
Be absolutely sure you have identified your target beyond any doubt."

Is the force strong in this boy?

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[mnealtx 0]

pretty violent nation that America Britain...no wonder they keep going all over the world to kill assault people at soccer matches....

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[NCclimber 0]

Quote

pretty violent nation that America...no wonder they keep going all over the world to kill people....

(sorry don't know what else to say anymore when JR keeps posting stuff reminding everybody what an incredibly violent nation the US is)

Every night, when I go to bed. I pull the covers over my head...










and cry a little.

We live in a scary, scary world. Sometimes, it's all I can do to summon the strength to even leave my house.

Think about it...

Armed thugs,
Terrorists,
Aids,
Ebola,
Global Warming,
Ozone Depletion,
Secondhand smoke,
High blood pressure,
High Cholestrol,
Heart disease
Lung Disease.
Cancer
Lead poisoning,
Mercury poisoning,

DRIVERS TALKING ON THEIR FOOKIN' CELL PHONES!

You get the point.

[Stumpy 284]

Old stereotype. Loads of countries are far worse now. We did something about it.

Never try to eat more than you can lift