warpedskydiver 0 #101 November 29, 2006 50 year old man is confronted by a 25 year old man, no apprant cause of dispute. 25 year old is being very aggressive and squaring up to him. He is swearing loudly and tenses his fists, his turns his body into a bladed fighting stance raises his arms. His head is tipped forward to protect his neck, his face is pale as his blood had rushed to all muscles and neccesary organs ready for a confrontation and to prevent bleeding in event of an injury (bodies natural defence). He has now stopped shouting (second major warning sign) and is focused on you. Its day time, in the town centre, he appears to have been drinking and doesnt seem to be in posession of any weapon. You'd probably be justified in delivery a pre-emptive strike, be it a kick, punch, palm heel strike or other basic movement. Alternatively of course, you could try and get away if there is an escape route and a safe location. For example into a busy shop. IT WOULD NOT BE PROPORTIONATE TO USE A FIREARM IN THIS CIRCUMSTANCEQuote Foot sweep, making sure the perp bounces his skull on the ground, followed by inserting your fingers in the notch behind the trachea, followed by ripping out the throat. NOBODY KNOWS WHETHER OR NOT THEIR INTENT IS TO KILL YOU. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #102 November 29, 2006 QuoteFoot sweep, making sure the perp bounces his skull on the ground, followed by inserting your fingers in the notch behind the trachea, followed by ripping out the throat. now, now, this kind of posturing just perpetuates the stereotype. If you are one of the the filthy rich in the country. (i.e., you make more than $25,000 gross annually) here's what you do You are supposed to try to first understand the 25 year old and validate/acknowledge his rage as result of society's lack of social support of his life choices. It's not his fault, it's someone else's. Probably some republican that he never met. Once that occurs, sing a few protest songs with him. This bonding will also help difuse his rage and route into a more productive and artful outlet. Finally, if you cry a little and hand over your wallet, let him strike those older and even more helpless people around him, and then give him a medal for "trying his best". Lastly, recommend a good lawyer to him so he can sue you for being nice to him. You know, don't judge. It's all about tolerance. Then, when he turns his back in disgust, hit him in the back of the head and run away making Woody Woodpecker noises........ if you are slimy (i.e., make any amount but just don't care) sue the local and federal government for not providing a safe location, and healthcare, and X-Box. perhaps the attacker will join your suit. remember, it's all about being a victim if you are poor, and have a conscience do nothing, take the lumps, someone from the slimy category has already decided what's best for you whether you want it or not ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Red_Skydiver 0 #103 November 30, 2006 Quote ....... Perhaps a cop, when facing a knife wielding criminal, should also disarm and face him only with his own knife. That would even it up...... Actually here in the UK our police do disarm people carrying knifes with nothing more than a baton and verbal reasoning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NCclimber 0 #104 November 30, 2006 Has anyone in this thread brought up the recently released study, "Gun Laws and Sudden Death"? It concluded that the 1996 Australian gun buy back program, which cost 500 million dollars, has had virtually zero impact on the number gun deaths. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Butters 0 #105 November 30, 2006 People kill people with guns. Guns don't kill people, they are inanimate objects, they don't do anything. PS: Wouldn't it be better to go after the motive and not the weapon?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Red_Skydiver 0 #106 November 30, 2006 QuoteThe premise behind the saying is that you're not going to assault people if you don't know whether or not they have the means to hurt you. You know, sort of like the concept of not going up and hassling the 250lb, 6'6" boxer sitting on a barstool. The same theory works with the gun debate - a crook isn't going to rob someone that may be armed. That's been proven by crime stats in general, as well as by prison interviews with convicted felons. That simply isn't true. How do you explain black on black gun crime here in the UK? They know there is a good chance of their target being armed which contradicts your theory. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #107 November 30, 2006 QuoteQuoteThe premise behind the saying is that you're not going to assault people if you don't know whether or not they have the means to hurt you. You know, sort of like the concept of not going up and hassling the 250lb, 6'6" boxer sitting on a barstool. The same theory works with the gun debate - a crook isn't going to rob someone that may be armed. That's been proven by crime stats in general, as well as by prison interviews with convicted felons. That simply isn't true. How do you explain black on black gun crime here in the UK? They know there is a good chance of their target being armed which contradicts your theory. Culture...and stupidity. My reference is to individual criminals, not gang-bangers - all bets are off, then.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #108 November 30, 2006 QuotePS: Wouldn't it be better to go after the motive and not the weapon? Did you actually look at the site or watch the video? The whole operation is aimed at making youngsters see that guns aren't cool and don't give you street cred. They are dangerous on the streets in gang environments. Think what DARE is to drugs, thats what Trident is to guns over here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Butters 0 #109 November 30, 2006 QuoteDid you actually look at the site or watch the video? The whole operation is aimed at making youngsters see that guns aren't cool and don't give you street cred. They are dangerous on the streets in gang environments. Yes, but I am talking about the motive for them to kill each other, not the motive for them to have guns. QuoteThink what DARE is to drugs, thats what Trident is to guns over here. DARE didn't do anything to curb drugs over here. Are you saying Trident isn't going to do anything to curb guns over there?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #110 November 30, 2006 Give me the magic wand to stop people wanting to kill or hurt each other and I'll use it. I think Trident has proved its success. One gun off the street is a potential life saved. If the Trident team weren't working hard keeping on top of supply of weapons and pressuring communities to speak out imagine what trouble we would have. To say something hasn't had an effect is foolish, sometimes the mere presence of the authority can be enough to prevent crime. Only if you were without it it would you truly appreciate the good work it does. As a simple example. Police officer does foot patrol all night. Sees loads of people, chats to the community, is a high vizibility presence in the area and no reports come in for that area that evening. Is that a negative result or a positive result? Just because he wasn't rolling around on the floor arresting people (do your police do that?) doesn't mean he didnt do some good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites juanesky 0 #111 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteAnd the opposite side of the coin... the belief that everything will be sunshine and puppy dogs if all those evil guns can be gotten rid of. I'm not sure I insinuated that... However, do you not agree that the world would be a better place if there were no guns at all and never had been? Incidentally you failed to answer my original question... No Guns, No knifes, no cars, no medications, no drugs, alcohol cigarettes, no more chemicals, no more anything that can harm us. It will be a great world! back to the stone age. THe only problem once there, then it would be no clubs, arrows, and frozen salmons. THen I would be pissed."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #112 December 1, 2006 QuoteI think Trident has proved its success. One gun off the street is a potential life saved. If the Trident team weren't working hard keeping on top of supply of weapons and pressuring communities to speak out imagine what trouble we would have. Yup...get rid of those evil guns making those angelic youth act so bad and it will be all puppies and butterflies.... Neo...wake up.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #113 December 1, 2006 Your annoying me now. Your probably right though, you know better than the masses of chief police officers and street officers working on it day in day out having an impact on peoples lives and affecting their community for better. What should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Maybe we should try to councel them and ask them why they do what they do and try to nurture them or we could convict those that break the law. Its an old fashioned approach, but I like it, call me grandad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NCclimber 0 #114 December 1, 2006 A few posts back, you said "I think Trident has proved its success." Do you have anything more than testimonials to back it up? Any studies? I'm not trying to piss you off or anything. It's just that back in the 80s, there was a drug education program started here in the US. For years, all I heard was how great it was. Local politicians and advocates loves to heap praises on it. Then I got involved in a discussion about it with some people who actually had experience with the program. They said is was bogus. I'm not sure, but I think they produced some studies that showed it wasn't that effective. Sometimes the claims from advocates don't measure up to the actual reslults. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites vortexring 0 #115 December 1, 2006 I'm with you on this one - it's an effort in the right direction. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #116 December 2, 2006 QuoteYour annoying me now. I'm so sorry...want a tissue? QuoteYour probably right though, you know better than the masses of chief police officers and street officers working on it day in day out having an impact on peoples lives and affecting their community for better. Where have I said that? I'm commenting on the fact that you STILL think that the tool being used controls the situation. QuoteWhat should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Maybe we should try to councel them and ask them why they do what they do and try to nurture them or we could convict those that break the law. Its an old fashioned approach, but I like it, call me grandad. Community outreach programs are good. Blaming the tool for the actions of the user is moronic.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybill 22 #117 December 3, 2006 Hi scoop, Only thing I gotta say is,"just remember that when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns!!" So if you are being acosted by a criminal with a gun and you don't have one to defend yourself, then just pick up your phone and call 911- state sponcered dial-a-prayer!!! Maybe you can club him with the receiver.SCR-2034, SCS-680 III%, Deli-out Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DaVinci 0 #118 December 12, 2006 QuoteWhat should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Gonna ban matches next? STOP THE MATCHES!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #119 December 13, 2006 Its OK everyone, I've ordered a bulk delivery of 7 foot rolls of cotton wool. All the people breaking the law I was just going to wrap them up in it from now on. Gone are the days of enforcing legislation. After I make sure they're comfortable I'll sit them down with a cup of tea and we'll discuss why they are so violent and why they felt the need to shoot someone. Maybe the idea of not having weapons is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. 'Geez, everyones weird except us' - wankers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NCclimber 0 #120 December 13, 2006 QuoteMaybe the idea of not having weapons pursuing a different course of action is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. 'Geez, everyones weird except us' - wankers Fixed it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #121 December 13, 2006 I guess it does apply both ways but it was my thread dammit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DaVinci 0 #122 December 19, 2006 QuoteMaybe the idea of not having weapons is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. Pot meet Kettle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #123 December 19, 2006 Blind man, meet post above The difference being this thread was about the UK, not US so all your whiny non constructive opinions are irrelevant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #124 December 19, 2006 QuoteBlind man, meet post above The difference being this thread was about the UK, not US so all your whiny non constructive opinions are irrelevant. True, in this instance... but it WAS fun to watch you ricochet off the walls from a few well-placed questions... Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #125 December 19, 2006 Hook, line and sinker! Reel me in! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 5 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
rehmwa 2 #102 November 29, 2006 QuoteFoot sweep, making sure the perp bounces his skull on the ground, followed by inserting your fingers in the notch behind the trachea, followed by ripping out the throat. now, now, this kind of posturing just perpetuates the stereotype. If you are one of the the filthy rich in the country. (i.e., you make more than $25,000 gross annually) here's what you do You are supposed to try to first understand the 25 year old and validate/acknowledge his rage as result of society's lack of social support of his life choices. It's not his fault, it's someone else's. Probably some republican that he never met. Once that occurs, sing a few protest songs with him. This bonding will also help difuse his rage and route into a more productive and artful outlet. Finally, if you cry a little and hand over your wallet, let him strike those older and even more helpless people around him, and then give him a medal for "trying his best". Lastly, recommend a good lawyer to him so he can sue you for being nice to him. You know, don't judge. It's all about tolerance. Then, when he turns his back in disgust, hit him in the back of the head and run away making Woody Woodpecker noises........ if you are slimy (i.e., make any amount but just don't care) sue the local and federal government for not providing a safe location, and healthcare, and X-Box. perhaps the attacker will join your suit. remember, it's all about being a victim if you are poor, and have a conscience do nothing, take the lumps, someone from the slimy category has already decided what's best for you whether you want it or not ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red_Skydiver 0 #103 November 30, 2006 Quote ....... Perhaps a cop, when facing a knife wielding criminal, should also disarm and face him only with his own knife. That would even it up...... Actually here in the UK our police do disarm people carrying knifes with nothing more than a baton and verbal reasoning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #104 November 30, 2006 Has anyone in this thread brought up the recently released study, "Gun Laws and Sudden Death"? It concluded that the 1996 Australian gun buy back program, which cost 500 million dollars, has had virtually zero impact on the number gun deaths. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #105 November 30, 2006 People kill people with guns. Guns don't kill people, they are inanimate objects, they don't do anything. PS: Wouldn't it be better to go after the motive and not the weapon?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red_Skydiver 0 #106 November 30, 2006 QuoteThe premise behind the saying is that you're not going to assault people if you don't know whether or not they have the means to hurt you. You know, sort of like the concept of not going up and hassling the 250lb, 6'6" boxer sitting on a barstool. The same theory works with the gun debate - a crook isn't going to rob someone that may be armed. That's been proven by crime stats in general, as well as by prison interviews with convicted felons. That simply isn't true. How do you explain black on black gun crime here in the UK? They know there is a good chance of their target being armed which contradicts your theory. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #107 November 30, 2006 QuoteQuoteThe premise behind the saying is that you're not going to assault people if you don't know whether or not they have the means to hurt you. You know, sort of like the concept of not going up and hassling the 250lb, 6'6" boxer sitting on a barstool. The same theory works with the gun debate - a crook isn't going to rob someone that may be armed. That's been proven by crime stats in general, as well as by prison interviews with convicted felons. That simply isn't true. How do you explain black on black gun crime here in the UK? They know there is a good chance of their target being armed which contradicts your theory. Culture...and stupidity. My reference is to individual criminals, not gang-bangers - all bets are off, then.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #108 November 30, 2006 QuotePS: Wouldn't it be better to go after the motive and not the weapon? Did you actually look at the site or watch the video? The whole operation is aimed at making youngsters see that guns aren't cool and don't give you street cred. They are dangerous on the streets in gang environments. Think what DARE is to drugs, thats what Trident is to guns over here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #109 November 30, 2006 QuoteDid you actually look at the site or watch the video? The whole operation is aimed at making youngsters see that guns aren't cool and don't give you street cred. They are dangerous on the streets in gang environments. Yes, but I am talking about the motive for them to kill each other, not the motive for them to have guns. QuoteThink what DARE is to drugs, thats what Trident is to guns over here. DARE didn't do anything to curb drugs over here. Are you saying Trident isn't going to do anything to curb guns over there?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #110 November 30, 2006 Give me the magic wand to stop people wanting to kill or hurt each other and I'll use it. I think Trident has proved its success. One gun off the street is a potential life saved. If the Trident team weren't working hard keeping on top of supply of weapons and pressuring communities to speak out imagine what trouble we would have. To say something hasn't had an effect is foolish, sometimes the mere presence of the authority can be enough to prevent crime. Only if you were without it it would you truly appreciate the good work it does. As a simple example. Police officer does foot patrol all night. Sees loads of people, chats to the community, is a high vizibility presence in the area and no reports come in for that area that evening. Is that a negative result or a positive result? Just because he wasn't rolling around on the floor arresting people (do your police do that?) doesn't mean he didnt do some good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #111 December 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteAnd the opposite side of the coin... the belief that everything will be sunshine and puppy dogs if all those evil guns can be gotten rid of. I'm not sure I insinuated that... However, do you not agree that the world would be a better place if there were no guns at all and never had been? Incidentally you failed to answer my original question... No Guns, No knifes, no cars, no medications, no drugs, alcohol cigarettes, no more chemicals, no more anything that can harm us. It will be a great world! back to the stone age. THe only problem once there, then it would be no clubs, arrows, and frozen salmons. THen I would be pissed."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #112 December 1, 2006 QuoteI think Trident has proved its success. One gun off the street is a potential life saved. If the Trident team weren't working hard keeping on top of supply of weapons and pressuring communities to speak out imagine what trouble we would have. Yup...get rid of those evil guns making those angelic youth act so bad and it will be all puppies and butterflies.... Neo...wake up.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #113 December 1, 2006 Your annoying me now. Your probably right though, you know better than the masses of chief police officers and street officers working on it day in day out having an impact on peoples lives and affecting their community for better. What should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Maybe we should try to councel them and ask them why they do what they do and try to nurture them or we could convict those that break the law. Its an old fashioned approach, but I like it, call me grandad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #114 December 1, 2006 A few posts back, you said "I think Trident has proved its success." Do you have anything more than testimonials to back it up? Any studies? I'm not trying to piss you off or anything. It's just that back in the 80s, there was a drug education program started here in the US. For years, all I heard was how great it was. Local politicians and advocates loves to heap praises on it. Then I got involved in a discussion about it with some people who actually had experience with the program. They said is was bogus. I'm not sure, but I think they produced some studies that showed it wasn't that effective. Sometimes the claims from advocates don't measure up to the actual reslults. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #115 December 1, 2006 I'm with you on this one - it's an effort in the right direction. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #116 December 2, 2006 QuoteYour annoying me now. I'm so sorry...want a tissue? QuoteYour probably right though, you know better than the masses of chief police officers and street officers working on it day in day out having an impact on peoples lives and affecting their community for better. Where have I said that? I'm commenting on the fact that you STILL think that the tool being used controls the situation. QuoteWhat should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Maybe we should try to councel them and ask them why they do what they do and try to nurture them or we could convict those that break the law. Its an old fashioned approach, but I like it, call me grandad. Community outreach programs are good. Blaming the tool for the actions of the user is moronic.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybill 22 #117 December 3, 2006 Hi scoop, Only thing I gotta say is,"just remember that when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns!!" So if you are being acosted by a criminal with a gun and you don't have one to defend yourself, then just pick up your phone and call 911- state sponcered dial-a-prayer!!! Maybe you can club him with the receiver.SCR-2034, SCS-680 III%, Deli-out Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaVinci 0 #118 December 12, 2006 QuoteWhat should we do then Einstein? Build them community halls to hang out in, youth shelters? The very same ones they burn down? Gonna ban matches next? STOP THE MATCHES!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #119 December 13, 2006 Its OK everyone, I've ordered a bulk delivery of 7 foot rolls of cotton wool. All the people breaking the law I was just going to wrap them up in it from now on. Gone are the days of enforcing legislation. After I make sure they're comfortable I'll sit them down with a cup of tea and we'll discuss why they are so violent and why they felt the need to shoot someone. Maybe the idea of not having weapons is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. 'Geez, everyones weird except us' - wankers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #120 December 13, 2006 QuoteMaybe the idea of not having weapons pursuing a different course of action is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. 'Geez, everyones weird except us' - wankers Fixed it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #121 December 13, 2006 I guess it does apply both ways but it was my thread dammit! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaVinci 0 #122 December 19, 2006 QuoteMaybe the idea of not having weapons is odd to you, but its not to us. Get that in your thick heads and stop looking through your ethnocentric eyes. Pot meet Kettle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #123 December 19, 2006 Blind man, meet post above The difference being this thread was about the UK, not US so all your whiny non constructive opinions are irrelevant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #124 December 19, 2006 QuoteBlind man, meet post above The difference being this thread was about the UK, not US so all your whiny non constructive opinions are irrelevant. True, in this instance... but it WAS fun to watch you ricochet off the walls from a few well-placed questions... Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #125 December 19, 2006 Hook, line and sinker! Reel me in! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
