CornishChris 5 #1 February 13, 2007 6 dead after US shooting spree What do you think drives someone to do something like this? Also, it may just be the reporting of these events, but do you think that these tend to happen more in the US than elsewhere - this isn't meant to be an antagonistic question it is just a comment? If so what is it in the specific US mentality that causes this? Is it something to do with the celebrity culture we live in and people craving some kind of press/media? Whatever it is, it's fucked up. CJP Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #2 February 13, 2007 Quote6 dead after US shooting spree What do you think drives someone to do something like this?... What drives someone to do this is firstly the desire to do so, and secondly the ability! I'm sure that many folk have fantasised about "going postal" on their place of work but for most folk this remains a fantasy. What seperates the US from the remainder of the first world is the relative ease of gun acquisition which makes it easier for sufficiently disturbed folk to act out their fantasies (or obey the voices / whatever)! In effect, the thing that makes this less common elsewhere than in the US is the relative difficulty for the "Man Nutter in the Street" to actually obtain a gun. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #3 February 13, 2007 QuoteWhat do you think drives someone to do something like this? Not enough parental smackdowns, child labor laws, video games, boredom. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CornishChris 5 #4 February 13, 2007 There are lots of bored kids out there - not many of them go mental in a shopping centre and kill people. CJP Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #5 February 13, 2007 The UK is no different.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_Massacre or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre The US guys shoot straighter though.. especially in restaurants. http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/07/18/news/top_stories/16_42_237_17_04.txt http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/first100/1001214.html tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #6 February 13, 2007 QuoteThe UK is WAS no different.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_Massacre or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre You cite the 2 incidents which led (however stupidly) to the UK bans on self-loading weapons and handguns. This is part of the reason why obtaining guns in the UK is relatively difficult or impossible compared to the US. Hence... If "The Average Man NUTTER in The Street" can't get a gun, then he can't go on a shooting spree. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #7 February 13, 2007 The laws are different. The people are the same. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #8 February 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteWhat do you think drives someone to do something like this? Not enough parental smackdowns, child labor laws, video games, boredom. You're right; that makes people commit mass murder. I mean, it's patently obvious. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #9 February 13, 2007 Well said, Mike. While the overall effect of gun bans can be debated indefinitely, it's pretty clear that the gun ban in England put the kibosh on random shooting sprees over there.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,489 #10 February 13, 2007 Quote The UK is no different..[Frown] The UK is different, simply because of the relative frequency of these events - whether they occur with guns, blades or other weapons. The US is a prosperous, educated nation, and it doesn't have any violent video games, movies or TV that isn't also available throughout the rest of the western world. There must be something wrong with underlying US culture that leads so many Americans to go off and so things like this. Maybe it is due to the glorification of the gun, god knows we see enough of that on this forum.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #11 February 13, 2007 QuoteThe laws are different. The people are the same. True. Of course, I think the logic is that a gun is a more efficient stand-off killing implement than a knife, cricket bat, sword, spear, ball & chain mace, etc., so the Nutter with a gun can kill more people in a shorter period of time, over a wider area, before he's stopped. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #12 February 13, 2007 QuoteMaybe it is due to the glorification of the gun, god knows we see enough of that on this forum. Guns R Kewl. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #13 February 13, 2007 I'll bet you in a country where guns aren't allowed, I can buy one if I have enough cash. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #14 February 13, 2007 QuoteI'll bet you in a country where guns aren't allowed, I can buy one if I have enough cash. Yes. Absolutely. Speaking as a cop in the UK, I know who to approach, to be passed onto someone who might know someone who might have a phone number that'd... In the course of a week I probably "could" get a gun and a small quantity of ammunition. After going through a ritual which'd make spider mating dances seem simple. In the US I could go to Wal-Mart and put an arsenal on my Amex card in half an hour. As I said before, it comes down to the relative DIFFICULTY of getting a gun in various countries. I know that "Guns Don't Kill People, People Kill People". I also know that "Hammers Don't Hit Nails, People Hit Nails"... But it's a lot easier to hit nails effectively if you have a hammer. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #15 February 13, 2007 QuoteThe laws are different. The people are the same. Think it's more of a case that the laws, society and culture are different, people are pretty much the same. Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #16 February 13, 2007 Guns are part of the problem because they are easy to get, easy to use, and effective. However, guns are not the problem, people are the problem. (Banning guns is a temporary solution for a permanent problem.)"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
willard 0 #17 February 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteI'll bet you in a country where guns aren't allowed, I can buy one if I have enough cash. Yes. Absolutely. Speaking as a cop in the UK, I know who to approach, to be passed onto someone who might know someone who might have a phone number that'd... In the course of a week I probably "could" get a gun and a small quantity of ammunition. After going through a ritual which'd make spider mating dances seem simple. In the US I could go to Wal-Mart and put an arsenal on my Amex card in half an hour. As I said before, it comes down to the relative DIFFICULTY of getting a gun in various countries. I know that "Guns Don't Kill People, People Kill People". I also know that "Hammers Don't Hit Nails, People Hit Nails"... But it's a lot easier to hit nails effectively if you have a hammer. Mike. If one wants a handgun in the UK he doesn't neccessarily have to buy one there. One can be smuggled in by himself or a friend, or even fabricated if wanted badly enough. But even those points become moot if the guy is really intent on killing lots of people. A pipe bomb can be made from componants readily available at hardware stores or stuff found in a kitchen and garage. My point is this- If someone wants to kill badly enough, he will and there is nothing we can do to stop him. Yes, the ready availability of firearms in the US makes it simpler for the guy who is doing it on a whim, but those instances are the rare exception, not the rule. In most cases the killer has been planning for a while and/or has had his firearms for more than a few days. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #18 February 13, 2007 I believe there is a statistic that states that there are more guns per people in Canada then the US. However in Canada they don’t have nearly the same amount of crime. I don’t think it is the laws. I really don’t believe that the ease of getting a gun has anything to do with the number of crimes committed. I believe it might be more of a culture thing.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #19 February 13, 2007 Agree that people are the problem. However could it not be that guns exacerbate that problem by allowing those problem people to react in an instantaneous (and unfortunate) manner? If the gun wasn’t there the reaction would probably much less severe or by the time the person has obtained a weapon (a pipe bomb has been mentioned elsewhere in this thread) the person would have decided not to react in such a severe way. Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #20 February 13, 2007 Yep because nobody would use a knife Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick 0 #21 February 13, 2007 You obviously didn't bother to read or understand all of my post. Nick Gravity- It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #22 February 13, 2007 QuoteI believe there is a statistic that states that there are more guns per people in Canada then the US.... Yes, but Canada has gun control rather than the Right to bear arms by default. As such, getting a gun in Canada is rather more involved (the need to show a legitimate reason) than in the US where a person with appropriate ID is by definition allowed to obtain guns. In effect, the lack of even a poorly functioning set of checks makes gun ownership far more common, particularly among the less well adjusted parts of society from which these extreme examples of people with problems will emerge. Similarly, in the UK, it's not hard for a reasonably well organised & affluent person to physically obtain a gun illegally, but it IS more involved than going to a shop and buying one which is the case in the US. Mike. PS: I am not, repeat NOT(!!!) advocating gun control in the US. It is self-evidently unsuitable for their society and hence unenforcable. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #23 February 13, 2007 Thanks Mike for your input Go read the IL AWB proposal It should make even the hardliner lefties sick. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,489 #24 February 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteMaybe it is due to the glorification of the gun, god knows we see enough of that on this forum. Guns R Kewl. No doubt, guns are cool. It goes beyond that though.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zipp0 1 #25 February 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteMaybe it is due to the glorification of the gun, god knows we see enough of that on this forum. Guns R Kewl. No doubt, guns are cool. It goes beyond that though. Whenever I see one of these things go down I fell saddened that no good guys were carrying that day. I'd like to think that if I were there I could have put an end to this. But then the cops probably would have rushed in and shot me...... -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
