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kallend 2,057
Hmmm...interesting graph. Now how about a graph of projected medicare and medicaid costs over the next few years under the current health care system to go along with it? CBO projections are readily available for you to produce such a graph...
You want such a graph? CBO projections are readily available for you to produce such a graph...
Can anyone explain why the USA needs to spend more on "defense" than the next 14 countries combined?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
billvon 3,028
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>Despite what you may think, insurers provide an actual service.
I agree 100%. But if you are buying a service, and company A must employ 1000 people for an hour to produce it, and company B must employ 300 people for an hour to produce it - which one will provide the service more cheaply?
>and generally scrambling to figure out how to offer insurance inside
>our perverted and shifting regulatory environments.
Well, there you have it. When the system is set up such that healthcare involves lawyers to convince insurance companies to pay out, lawsuits for the most trivial healthcare issues, dozens of forms to be filed for every office visit - it's going to be expensive. That doesn't mean all insurance companies are evil, or that basic healthcare is intrinsically expensive. It does mean that the screwed-up system we have now is a very expensive one that does not provide great care. I would prefer to fix the system while keeping care levels the same. Once we've done that, THEN we can decide where we want to go from there.
>For as much as healthcare already costs, squeezing the providers and
>the infrastructure will only siphon more out of a leaky system.
Agreed. Fixing the leaks should take priority.
>We must come to terms with the fact that we cannot afford all of the
>healthcare that we want, that we currently get and perversely feel entitled
>to unlimited quantities of.
Ding ding! Exactly! Which is why I am in favor of offering only minimal care under a national healthcare system. If you want more care (i.e. that MRI before your next training weekend, a nose job, a transplant) then you pay.
>The market will always provide some newer, more expensive regimen
>that is out of reach, often impossibly so, this is human nature. It's the
>entrepreneurial spirit and the embodiment of market economics that
>makes it so--it is the manifestation of hope.
I agree. So you keep those regimens in the private sector, where people will pay whatever the doctors/drug companies ask. (Or they will get very very good health coverage.)
I agree 100%. But if you are buying a service, and company A must employ 1000 people for an hour to produce it, and company B must employ 300 people for an hour to produce it - which one will provide the service more cheaply?
>and generally scrambling to figure out how to offer insurance inside
>our perverted and shifting regulatory environments.
Well, there you have it. When the system is set up such that healthcare involves lawyers to convince insurance companies to pay out, lawsuits for the most trivial healthcare issues, dozens of forms to be filed for every office visit - it's going to be expensive. That doesn't mean all insurance companies are evil, or that basic healthcare is intrinsically expensive. It does mean that the screwed-up system we have now is a very expensive one that does not provide great care. I would prefer to fix the system while keeping care levels the same. Once we've done that, THEN we can decide where we want to go from there.
>For as much as healthcare already costs, squeezing the providers and
>the infrastructure will only siphon more out of a leaky system.
Agreed. Fixing the leaks should take priority.
>We must come to terms with the fact that we cannot afford all of the
>healthcare that we want, that we currently get and perversely feel entitled
>to unlimited quantities of.
Ding ding! Exactly! Which is why I am in favor of offering only minimal care under a national healthcare system. If you want more care (i.e. that MRI before your next training weekend, a nose job, a transplant) then you pay.
>The market will always provide some newer, more expensive regimen
>that is out of reach, often impossibly so, this is human nature. It's the
>entrepreneurial spirit and the embodiment of market economics that
>makes it so--it is the manifestation of hope.
I agree. So you keep those regimens in the private sector, where people will pay whatever the doctors/drug companies ask. (Or they will get very very good health coverage.)
nanook 1
Can anyone explain why the USA needs to spend more on "defense" than the next 14 countries combined?
-we are at war
-we war every 10 years
-our interests are spread out over the globe more than most countries.
-protecting other countries' borders/seaways gives us secondary (and sometimes primary) economic maintenance.
-we are a lot bigger
_____________________________
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
Dell is selling an actual product.
Why would anybody pay an insurance company if they weren't getting something valuable in return? Insurance is a financial product just like stocks, bonds, annuities, options etc.
The main reason you don't see clearinghouses & exchanges in the US is that insurance is regulated by each state instead of by the Federal govt like stocks & bonds, and the contracts are typically a bit more customized. In other countries, like in the UK, insurance and other financial products are often sold by the same company, and generally more "securitized". This has only started recently in the US as a result of diminished regulation in the last few decades. See Lloyd's of London.
Wellpoint, otoh, sells insurance and hopes to minimize the amount of it used.
I suspect you've never tried to return a defective Dell part. This criterion does not distinguish Dell from Wellpoint--Dell's warrantees are in fact a type of insurance. Nobody will patronize an insurance program that does not pay out fully per its terms--the payout is part of the contractual relationship. The friction involved in making a claim is simply part of what you are paying for--offer to pay more up front and you can usually buy a higher level of service. "Gold" or "platinum" service from Dell, it may not named as attractively but good service is surely for sale from any health insurer. HMO, PPO, tiers of service, it's directly analogous.
My advice is to do what your parents did; get a job, sir. The bums will always lose. Do you hear me, Lebowski?
nanook 1
Sounds like the way to fix it is to reform healthcare-related lawsuits rather than a change in infrastructure. I'm more for trying the easier way first.
_____________________________
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
billvon 3,028
>-we are at war
>-we war every 10 years
That explains why we DO spend more on defense than the next 14 countries combined, but does not explain why we NEED to spend money on optional wars.
>-we war every 10 years
That explains why we DO spend more on defense than the next 14 countries combined, but does not explain why we NEED to spend money on optional wars.
nanook 1
Has there ever been a war that was not "optional"? Even the Revolutionary War and Civil Wars were optional. History has told that those wars were way more "optional" and disliked than this current one.
I can't help you on the "NEED". It's a Fallacy. It's based on opinion. It can't be answered. There's no wrong answer. Present-going war rhetoric is useless until the resolution and fallout of the war has been completed.
I can't help you on the "NEED". It's a Fallacy. It's based on opinion. It can't be answered. There's no wrong answer. Present-going war rhetoric is useless until the resolution and fallout of the war has been completed.
_____________________________
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln
The difference being, that if a dell laptop has issues under warranty, they fix it. When Sony made them a shitload of defective batteries, they recalled them. And so far as I know, they've never taken a policy of 'refuse everything the first time and make the customer appeal.;
Dell is selling an actual product. Wellpoint, otoh, sells insurance and hopes to minimize the amount of it used.
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