Illinois: Driving alternative fuel car may be a felony

[Andy9o8 2]

http://techdirt.com/articles/20070307/133704.shtml

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Fines And Felony Charges For Letting Your Car Run On Restaurant Vegetable Oil?
from the not-such-a-good-thing dept

There have been numerous stories recently about people converting their cars to run on leftover vegetable oil from restaurant kitchens. Many restaurants need to get rid of that oil anyway, and are more than happy to give it away for nothing or next to nothing (though, obviously that would change as demand grows). While this seems like a great example of one way that people can help take a step away from the oil addiction the government is apparently afraid of, it seems that (oops) the government isn't going to make it very easy for people.

Yehuda Berlinger points us to the bureaucratic insanity faced by a retired couple in Illinois who simply want to drive their vegetable oil-fueled car, but now face huge fines and possible felony charges for doing so. The details sound like they're right out of a bad movie. They've owned the car for while and they fuel it up using leftover restaurant cooking oil. However, earlier this year, two officials knocked on their door from the Illinois Department of Revenue, telling the couple that they were violating the law by not paying an additional motor fuel tax

[mnealtx 0]

God forbid .gov not get their cut.... friggin morons.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[IanHarrop 42]

I'm am surprised these people haven't been locked up yet. The USA is very good a institutionalizing their citizens and after all the used vegetable oil people are going to damage business that the friends of GWB run. I say hang em high

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[jakee 1,564]

I think that's already the case here in the UK

All the money the gov spends on trying to get us to use eco friendly transport, but when someone actually goes and does it.....

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[warpedskydiver 0]

Our governor blojobabitch has made so many enemies it is amazing he is still in office.

The fuckwad is virtually trying to tax this state to death instead of encouraging business.

Add that to his vision of removing our constitutional rights.

[kallend 2,108]

So what you're Really Saying is that tax evasion is a felony in Illinois. Imagine that!

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[dbattman 0]

Illinois motor vehicle fuel tax law.

According to this they are 'blenders' and are required to pay the fuel tax when they put untaxed motor vehicle fuels in their tank. The fuel tax pays for the roads and infrastructure. OK, fine- they said they'd pay it. As far as the special permits and bonds go, that's an awful lot of red tape to collect $5 a month. It would be simpler to have it as an extra fee on the yearly registration with a substantial fine if you are caught without it.

That's a bit of a Catch-22. If you buy B-100 your paying tax at the pump, but if you're vegging it you'd need a registration rider and how do you distinguish between the two at a traffic stop? Interesting conumdrum.

I'm a bit curious how the revenuers learned about this anyways. My money is on a grease hauler sore about losing the recycling from the restaurants, since they normally get paid to haul off the used oil.

[Andy9o8 2]

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I'm a bit curious how the revenuers learned about this anyways. My money is on a grease hauler sore about losing the recycling from the restaurants, since they normally get paid to haul off the used oil.

Yeah. Let's get some mafiosi to break his knees.

[mnskydiver688 0]

Hmm... The government is encouraging people to be more mindful of the environment and find new ways to cut down on negative impacts to the environment. But instead of rewarding them we punish them for doing what has been asked of them. Also isn't the government considering tax breaks to people who adopt practices such as these? Or are those tax breaks only for the energy companies? you know those guys that Cheney and G.W. are friends with. I wonder if illegal aliens caught in this situation would have to pay? I guess they wouldn't because they don't have to worry about paying there share, and if they did have to pay they would just use there nifty welfare checks.

Sky Canyon Wingsuiters

[mnealtx 0]

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So what you're Really Saying is that tax evasion is a felony in Illinois. Imagine that!

It's not as if they're using untaxed farm diesel... it's a bullshit charge, unless the state is going to start levying fuel taxes on cooking oil...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[sundevil777 102]

If the tax laws require that tax be applied to all fuel (regardless if it is gas or peanut oil or whatever) used for motor vehicles on the road, then they are stuck. It would be good to encourage the use of alternatives by exempting them from taxes, but that's not the case now. Of course it is still a lot of effort (tax money spent) to collect a small bit of tax - probably a negative return, just to make a point.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[penniless 0]

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So what you're Really Saying is that tax evasion is a felony in Illinois. Imagine that!

It's not as if they're using untaxed farm diesel... it's a bullshit charge, unless the state is going to start levying fuel taxes on cooking oil...

The issue is whether or not evading a tax is OK. If there's something wrong with a FUEL tax on unorthodox FUEL, then the tax should be fixed, not evaded.

[mnealtx 0]

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So what you're Really Saying is that tax evasion is a felony in Illinois. Imagine that!

It's not as if they're using untaxed farm diesel... it's a bullshit charge, unless the state is going to start levying fuel taxes on cooking oil...

The issue is whether or not evading a tax is OK. If there's something wrong with a FUEL tax on unorthodox FUEL, then the tax should be fixed, not evaded.

I don't see it as evading a tax - I see it as the state poking it's nose in where it shouldn't (again). As I said above - if they were getting caught using farm fuel or something similar, I'd agree with the charge - but the story as described is bullshit.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[sundevil777 102]

It is something similar to farm fuel, in the sense that they were using a fuel for a vehicle operated on the roads. All fuel for that purpose is to be taxed, right? I don't know the details of Illinois law, but isn't that the issue?

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[mnealtx 0]

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It is something similar to farm fuel, in the sense that they were using a fuel for a vehicle operated on the roads. All fuel for that purpose is to be taxed, right? I don't know the details of Illinois law, but isn't that the issue?

The OP was discussing used cooking oil... seems to me like the state is trying to get in a 'double dip'...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[sundevil777 102]

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It is something similar to farm fuel, in the sense that they were using a fuel for a vehicle operated on the roads. All fuel for that purpose is to be taxed, right? I don't know the details of Illinois law, but isn't that the issue?

The OP was discussing used cooking oil... seems to me like the state is trying to get in a 'double dip'...

Double dip, that's a good one. The restaurant probably didn't pay retail tax on it.

If the law doesn't exempt alternative fuels, then the law (tax) applies to them also. It would be good to exempt them, to encourage their use, but that isn't the case now. Don't get me wrong, I think the Illinois tax collectors should pursue bigger tax evaders.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Andy9o8 2]

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The restaurant probably didn't pay retail tax on it.

Why would you not think that they paid some sort of sales tax on it when they purchased it?

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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The restaurant probably didn't pay retail tax on it.

Why would you not think that they paid some sort of sales tax on it when they purchased it?

Because they have an FEIN and the oil is effectively for resale like the rest of what goes into their food?

[nanook 1]

It seems like what's going on is: since they are not paying the "fees" (taxes) for using the public govt built roads, they are violating the law. even if they are not buying gas, they are still using the roads. (from what I understand on Farm fuel; you are using it on private/coporate property mostly, and rarely on public govt funded roads so it's not going to be taxed in that way.)

If this is the case, then that story is a spin on the reality of what's going on. It's too bad Illinois laws are not alternative fuel friendly.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[riggertj9 0]

I see people going in the wrong direction here. The main Issue I get is that the Illinois Department of Revenue has made it difficult to do pay the tax. This is a little unclear,

Sec. 1.20. "Receiver" means a person who either produces, refines, blends, compounds or manufactures fuel in this State, or transports fuel into this State or receives fuel transported to him from without the State or exports fuel out of this State, or who is engaged in distribution of fuel primarily by tank car or tank truck, or both, and who operates an Illinois bulk plant where he has active fuel bulk storage capacity of not less than 30,000 gallons.

Check out the Red 'and'. I'm not completely convinced that they fall under the category of a receiver either. bottom line is they are willing to pay the tax. But coming up with a $2500 bond for the permission to pay the tax? Come on now. I don't think this law was ever designed to be enforced on individuals. I can't figure out where the $2500 bond number came from. The tax law states it should be at least twice the average quarterly return, IF it's required at all. According to the numbers listed in the article that would be a little over $30. Some of the information is missing here. Why is the bond so high? I can't find any minimum dollar amount in the tax law. Even so the law makes no mention of personal use. This needs to be changed to reflect current technology.

[nanook 1]

I think the issue is that the Revenue Dept is making it impossible for anybody to privately distribute their own fuel. the $2500 is the smaller problem: you still need at a bare minimum 30,000 gallon bulk store ect. ect. ect. They want a commercial vender to give you fuel only. Maybe it's the only way they can prevent an individual from getting away from paying a tax.

Or they have absolutely no type of infastructure in place to receive a rare private tax payment. In that case, I don't think any govt will rewrite a complete different box or line in their accounting paperwork to include a barely used tax collection. It might cost more to keep an "eye" on that sector than to receive payment of tax on. Pure speculation here.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[IanHarrop 42]

Good thing these guys aren't located in Illinois

http://www.homebiodieselkits.com/

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy