Religious tolerance

[billvon 3,009]

Good example here:
--------------------------
Alan Cooperman
Washington Post
Posted June 1 2007, 10:44 AM EDT

WASHINGTON _ Florida evangelist Bill Keller says he was making a spiritual -- not political -- statement when he warned the 2.4 million subscribers to his Internet prayer ministry that ``if you vote for Mitt Romney, you are voting for Satan!''

. . .

Keller, 49, who has a call-in show on a Tampa television station and a Web site called Liveprayer.com, on May 11 sent out a ``daily devotional'' that called Romney ``an unabashed and proud member of the Mormon cult founded by a murdering polygamist pedophile named Joseph Smith nearly 200 years ago.

''If the former Massachusetts governor wins the GOP nomination and the presidency, Keller's message added, it will "ultimately lead millions of souls to the eternal flames of hell.''

. . .

Keller, in a telephone interview, laughed off the controversy. ``Let them come after me for making a spiritual statement about Mitt Romney. I would love that,'' he said. ``Bring it on.''
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[Remster 30]

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``Bring it on.''

Remster

[mnealtx 0]

Great...another asshat a la Fred Phelps and his insane ilk...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 3,009]

>>``Bring it on.''

>

Remember what happened to the last guy who said that?

[Remster 30]

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Remember what happened to the last guy who said that?

People listened to him...

Remster

[JohnRich 4]

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Florida evangelist Bill Keller says he was making a spiritual -- not political -- statement when he warned...

The reason for the distinction is to preserve his tax-free status.
That seems to be the only thing he's apologizing for.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Florida evangelist Bill Keller says he was making a spiritual -- not political -- statement when he warned...

The reason for the distinction is to preserve his tax-free status.
That seems to be the only thing he's apologizing for.

Should Romney actually win, he'll find that distinction insufficient to protect him from the Feds.

On the subject, I think the Mormons don't deserve their tax exempt status anymore either.

[grue 1]

I have yet to hear a good reason why religious organizations shouldn't pay taxes.

cavete terrae.

[mnealtx 0]

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I have yet to hear a good reason why religious organizations shouldn't pay taxes.

I think as soon as the pastor / congregation starts putting themselves into the political spectrum, or candidates hold speeches / rallys at a church, that they should get stripped of the tax exempt status.

So, yeah, I agree in principle.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 3,009]

> I have yet to hear a good reason why religious organizations shouldn't pay taxes.


"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion . . ."

Can we pass a law to tax religions? No. See above.

Can we pass a law to tax all property? Yes, provided it is administered to everyone without regard for religious affiliation.

[mnealtx 0]

Disagree. See below, emphasis mine.

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IRS Code § 501c3 reads as follows:

Sec. 501. Exemption from tax on corporations, certain trusts, etc.
(c) List of exempt organizations —

(3) Corporations, and any community chest, fund, or foundation, organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, testing for public safety, literary, or educational purposes, or to foster national or international amateur sports competition (but only if no part of its activities involve the provision of athletic facilities or equipment), or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation, (except as otherwise provided in subsection (h)), and which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 3,009]

?? I agree with you that political organizations are not religions. If a religion spends a significant amount of its time/energy/money on politics, then it's a political organization, not a religious one. Likewise, if a group claims it's a religion, but spends most of its time building cars and selling them at a profit, it's a car company, not a religion.

[DSE 5]

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Good example here:
--------------------------
Alan Cooperman
Washington Post
Posted June 1 2007, 10:44 AM EDT

WASHINGTON _ Florida evangelist Bill Keller says he was making a spiritual -- not political -- statement when he warned the 2.4 million subscribers to his Internet prayer ministry that ``if you vote for Mitt Romney, you are voting for Satan!''

. . .

Keller, 49, who has a call-in show on a Tampa television station and a Web site called Liveprayer.com, on May 11 sent out a ``daily devotional'' that called Romney ``an unabashed and proud member of the Mormon cult founded by a murdering polygamist pedophile named Joseph Smith nearly 200 years ago.

''If the former Massachusetts governor wins the GOP nomination and the presidency, Keller's message added, it will "ultimately lead millions of souls to the eternal flames of hell.''
------------------------

How dare he say that????? Joseph Smith (historically speaking) never murdered anyone.
While I don't agree that a vote for Romney is a vote for Satan, it is a vote in the direction of stupidity.
Mitt Romney quotes....
Reporter:"Mr Romney, what's wrong with America?"
Romney: " Nothing"

The CNN quote "I'll never forget that day, it was so powerful... back in 1970 something"

On Quantanamo: "We ought to double Guantanamo..."

On presidential power: "I like vetoes."

On hunting: "I've been an avid hunter my entire life. I've gone hunting twice."

His favorite novel? "Battlefield Earth," by L. Ron Hubbard. Mormonism is very outspoken about Scientology's evils.

On marriage? "There is no work more important to America’s future than the work that is done within the four walls of the American home,” Romney said. He also criticized people who choose not to get married because they enjoy the single life.

“It seems that Europe leads Americans in this way of thinking,” Romney told the crowd of more than 5,000. In France, for instance, I’m told that marriage is now frequently contracted in seven-year terms where either party may move on when their term is up. How shallow and how different from the Europe of the past.”

disclaimer; Mitt Romney is the only person I've personally known that is/has run for president.

The guy is a liar and defines flip-flop. He'll do *anything* to become president.
If it's his religion that becomes his undoing, more power to the prayer.

Is it religious intolerance to make negative commentary on a presidential candidate? His religion is a weird one, based on fantasy and fiction, founded by a pedophile (convicted) that was a polygamist, who wrote a book while staring at rocks inside of a hat, who was later charged with plagiarism.

Or is it only intolerant because it's a religion making a "religious" statement?

Or, as we currently (arguably) live in a theocratic state, is it merely pointing out salient points for social consideration? Does that make it intolerant or biased but informative?

At the very least, it's almost entirely factual (strike out the word "murdering" and it's 100% accurate).

[jakee 1,501]

So the IRS trumps the constitution?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Amazon 7]

Why is it that in this country with so many "cristians" CLAIMING religeous intolerance.....are actually the most intolerant among the people of America???.

[DSE 5]

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So the IRS trumps the constitution?

Of course it does.
You have freedom of speech, so long as you don't have any dog in the fight. Once you have a dog in the fight, you have to pay to feed him.

Religions aren't allowed to make political statements because then they aren't religious any longer. In other words, they don't pay taxes which allows them to speak freely. Free speech isn't free.
Pay the tax, open your yap.

[mnealtx 0]

Exactly as you and Bill stated...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

As L Ron Hubbard stated ... religion is the best scam going.

[Hubbard himself was perhaps as concerned to make money as he was to help humanity and he had some interesting ideas about how to do it. Around this time he was invited to address a science-fiction group in Newark hosted by the writer, Sam Moskowitz. 'Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous,' he told the meeting. 'If a man really wanted to make a million dollars, the best way to do it would be to start his own religion.'[2]]


http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/bfm/bfm09.htm

I guess he succeeded.

[mnealtx 0]

He (his heirs in the Scientology movement) probably got 10x that from Cruise and Travolta alone...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[tbrown 26]

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Florida evangelist Bill Keller says he was making a spiritual -- not political -- statement when he warned...

The reason for the distinction is to preserve his tax-free status.
That seems to be the only thing he's apologizing for.

If the IRS can go after an Episcopalian church in Pasadena for anti-Bush statements in 2004, then they should go after this joker now. Unless God only disapproves of certain points of view from left of cneter ?

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[skydyvr 0]

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Unless God only disapproves of certain points of view from left of cneter ?

It's worse than that. God only approves of my particular viewpoints. He realizes that everyone is is basically FUBAR. I know this because he told me so.

. . =(_8^(1)

[gitRdone 0]

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Mitt Romney is the only person I've personally known that is/has run for president.

The guy is a liar and defines flip-flop. He'll do *anything* to become president.
If it's his religion that becomes his undoing, more power to the prayer.

Just curious about your strong opposition to Mitt Romney from your personal knowledge you mentioned? I too have know Mitt personally for many years, he is a stand-up guy who just believes he can offer something to the Country. Wheather he can or can't is certainly up for debate and thats what the election process is all about. Just trying to understand your strong opposition as I am proud to call Mitt a friend. Admittedly I am a friend who chooses not to follow politics very closely but I do know Mitt well and IMHO he is a decent, stand-up guy.

[Channman 2]

> I think as soon as the pastor / congregation starts putting themselves into the political spectrum, or candidates hold speeches / rallys at a church, that they should get stripped of the tax exempt status.

Would this include all those African American churches Dems seem to speak at and give political speeches to a voting block that supports them by 90% or better?

[DSE 5]

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Mitt Romney is the only person I've personally known that is/has run for president.

The guy is a liar and defines flip-flop. He'll do *anything* to become president.
If it's his religion that becomes his undoing, more power to the prayer.

Just curious about your strong opposition to Mitt Romney from your personal knowledge you mentioned? I too have know Mitt personally for many years, he is a stand-up guy who just believes he can offer something to the Country. Wheather he can or can't is certainly up for debate and thats what the election process is all about. Just trying to understand your strong opposition as I am proud to call Mitt a friend. Admittedly I am a friend who chooses not to follow politics very closely but I do know Mitt well and IMHO he is a decent, stand-up guy.

then you don't really know Mitt. Mitt Romney is a liar who defends his lies, who then tried to force a family member to bury the information about his lies. Romney also told CNN that he'd "commissioned me" to write a torch theme song for the Olympics. That's a lie; I was asked to write the torch theme song by the Director of Indian Affairs long before Romney "saved" the Olympics.
Romney is a liar. A yellow-bellied, chicken-shit liar. Who lies more when caught out.
Funny how after all these years, he's only now decided to make his wife's illness public. Wow. Great political tool, eh? Romney is a flip-flopper as well, far worse than Bush. Frankly, if given a choice between Bush and Romney for our next pres, I'd absolutely hands-down vote for Bush.
Romney claimed to have originated the "Light the Fire Within" campaign as well. Bullshit.
I do however, claim the "Fight the Liar Within" campaign against Romney.
Even if he was an honest, stand up guy, I wouldn't vote for him. The idea of having Gordon B. Hinckley as the president of the USA scares the shit out of me. You can't compare Kennedy/the Pope with Romney/Gordon B. Hinckley. Kennedy never had to swear allegience and obedience to the Pope, but Romney had to swear and continue to swear allegience and obedience to the prophet of the LDS faith. He's a Mormon, and by that very definition alone, he should not be electable, and by recent polls, apparently most of America agrees with that. Mormons are one step away from being conservative Muslims.
I have yet to meet a single person who has spent meaningful time with Romney (who isn't a personal friend or acolyte) that considers him to be anything better than a snake. That list includes ranking politicians in the Utah Senate/House, Dept of Public Safety, Department of Commerce, Agricultural leaders, and top dogs at the University of Utah. He was recently booed outside of BYU, and even our own Republican governor has nothing good to say about the slime; even while his own father is Romney's biggest financial support.
Additionally, Romney is too ingrained and owes too much to big money to be president.
I'm embarassed to say I know Mitt Romney, let alone having family members still very close to him and his family.

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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Even if he was an honest, stand up guy, I wouldn't vote for him. The idea of having Gordon B. Hinckley as the president of the USA scares the shit out of me. You can't compare Kennedy/the Pope with Romney/Gordon B. Hinckley. Kennedy never had to swear allegience and obedience to the Pope, but Romney had to swear and continue to swear allegience and obedience to the prophet of the LDS faith. He's a Mormon, and by that very definition alone, he should not be electable, and by recent polls, apparently most of America agrees with that. Mormons are one step away from being conservative Muslims.

You sir, are a bigot.