crwtom 0 #1 June 14, 2007 Hamas has taken over Gaza - Fatah is likely to crack down on Hamas in the West Bank in retaliation after Abbas already fired the PM. The geographical separation, and political as well as military hostility make a desintegration of Palestine into two even smaller states look more likely than ever. For Israel it's even better than "divide and conquer" - the dividing is done for them. Will Fatah and Hamas eventually get themselves together to have a stronger position vs Israel, or will they follow the same trend of hatred and deintegration for which Iraq is already setting an example. Given that Palestine/Israel conflict has been the greatest source of animosity between the arab and western world throughout the last half century today's events seem pretty significant. Cheers, T ******************************************************************* Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #2 June 14, 2007 In what timeframe? I think they'll continue to divide-unite-divide-unite for quite some time. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #3 June 14, 2007 Quote In what timeframe? I think they'll continue to divide-unite-divide-unite for quite some time. Blues, Dave Does modern Palestine (since 1947) have a history of civil rivalries on par with recent developments? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #4 June 14, 2007 It does seem to be the very sad fate of that area of the world.What is it abou that particular region that makes it so unstable?.... Or is it that we're lucky? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #5 June 14, 2007 Quote Quote In what timeframe? I think they'll continue to divide-unite-divide-unite for quite some time. Blues, Dave Does modern Palestine (since 1947) have a history of civil rivalries on par with recent developments? I don't know, and don't have enough distance to evaluate current events in proper context. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #6 June 14, 2007 You need to have an option in your poll that there is no "Palestine", and there never has been. Fatah was just getting ready to respond to some very juicy olive branches from Israel. Hamas, a tool of Syria and Iran, could not allow that to happen as it is not in line with Iran's doctrine of taking Israel "off the map".So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #7 June 14, 2007 QuoteFatah was just getting ready to respond to some very juicy olive branches from Israel. Hamas, a tool of Syria and Iran, could not allow that to happen as it is not in line with Iran's doctrine of taking Israel "off the map". I think we should take off... and nuke them from space... its the only way to be sure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #8 June 14, 2007 QuoteQuoteFatah was just getting ready to respond to some very juicy olive branches from Israel. Hamas, a tool of Syria and Iran, could not allow that to happen as it is not in line with Iran's doctrine of taking Israel "off the map". I think we should take off... and nuke them from space... its the only way to be sure. Mama always had a way of explaining things so I could understand them.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #9 June 14, 2007 So finally now, you are noticing this? Where is Darius when you need him to explain this? "According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crwtom 0 #10 June 14, 2007 QuoteYou need to have an option in your poll that there is no "Palestine", and there never has been. Take whatever defintiion of the status of the terrirories predominantly inhabited by people identifying themselves as Paletinians you want - whether they are states, territories, semi-autonomous regions, refugee camps or whatever is not the point of the poll. Whether they stay united ot not is. Hope that helps, T ******************************************************************* Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #11 June 14, 2007 QuoteYou need to have an option in your poll that there is no "Palestine", and there never has Amen brotha. People seem to forget this fact.7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rmsmith 1 #12 June 15, 2007 The United States spends a lot of money in this part of the world with little to nothing in return. It would be better spent providing universal healthcare and upper education to its own citzens, IMHO. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #13 June 15, 2007 QuoteThe United States spends a lot of money in this part of the world with little to nothing in return. It would be better spent providing universal healthcare and upper education to its own citzens, IMHO. OR, crazy idea, let's just not spend that money. HECK, let's not even take it from "its own citizens" in the first place. Then they can buy their own healthcare and upper education. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #14 June 15, 2007 QuoteThe United States spends a lot of money in this part of the world with little to nothing in return. It would be better spent providing universal healthcare and upper education to its own citzens, IMHO. That conclusion does not recognize that Israel has survived. Of course some don't see that as a positive result. A long lasting peace is certainly the ultimate goal, but not the only outcome worth recognizing as a good "return". I don't think any country should contribute relief to the Palestinian Authority without Arafat's estate giving up money that he took during his reign.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #15 June 15, 2007 Quote Quote The United States spends a lot of money in this part of the world with little to nothing in return. It would be better spent providing universal healthcare and upper education to its own citzens, IMHO. OR, crazy idea, let's just not spend that money. HECK, let's not even take it from "its own citizens" in the first place. Then they can buy their own healthcare and upper education. Now that's just crazy talk. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #16 June 15, 2007 QuoteQuoteYou need to have an option in your poll that there is no "Palestine", and there never has Amen brotha. People seem to forget this fact. "Palestine" was where Israel was plopped. The Brits called it "Palestine". If you want to go earlier then you can take your pick. There's "Palestine", "Syria Palestinia", "Caanan", "Philistia", "Kingdom of Jerusalem", "Land of Israel", "Trans Jordan". And many many more names. Why is it that people only want to acknowledge a Zionist viewpoint? Personally I think they should just call it "The Southern Levant" or maybe "The Holy Land". That way it works for everyone. To try to deny the multi-cultural history in favor of one group or another is just plain ignorant and why we have this problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #17 June 15, 2007 Quote OR, crazy idea, let's just not spend that money. REHMWA for President! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #18 June 15, 2007 QuoteQuote OR, crazy idea, let's just not spend that money. REHMWA for President! that bastard? damn guy is insensitive to the needs of the middle east, he's against children, he's anti-good, pro-evil, anti-business, pro-business, anti-property, he once voted simultaneously for and against a bill that could be construed as pro-anti choice of various things. And you should just see some of the stuff from his past. He once walked past a church. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #19 June 15, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteYou need to have an option in your poll that there is no "Palestine", and there never has Amen brotha. People seem to forget this fact. "Palestine" was where Israel was plopped. The Brits called it "Palestine". If you want to go earlier then you can take your pick. There's "Palestine", "Syria Palestinia", "Caanan", "Philistia", "Kingdom of Jerusalem", "Land of Israel", "Trans Jordan". And many many more names. Why is it that people only want to acknowledge a Zionist viewpoint? Personally I think they should just call it "The Southern Levant" or maybe "The Holy Land". That way it works for everyone. To try to deny the multi-cultural history in favor of one group or another is just plain ignorant and why we have this problem. There has never been a recognized country called Palestine. The land never belonged to the "Palestinian" people. They simply occupied the land. That' doesn’t make it theirs, just like the old apartment I used to occupy, but did not own. You can call that piece of land whatever name you want, including "Palestine", "Syria Palestinia", "Caanan", "Philistia", "Kingdom of Jerusalem", "Land of Israel". However the land to this day doesn’t belong to the "Palestinians", just like it didn’t belong to them in the 40's, when England, the rightful owner, handed the land over to the Israelis, who are now the rightful owners.7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #20 June 15, 2007 QuoteFor Israel it's even better than "divide and conquer" this is not better in any way or form. not for israel and not for the palestinians. now, instead of a dispute over land (as problematic as it is) with a (alightly) pragmatic entity it will become a religious issue of a holy war where Iran and other religious extremists are pulling the strings. the only (very vey very small) improvement is that now, when rockets are flying out of Gaza you cannot say that "these are extremists out of the PA's control" like they usuaaly say. when israel is now attacked from Gaza, it is by the official rulling party there. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #21 June 15, 2007 QuoteQuoteREHMWA for President! that bastard? damn guy is insensitive to the needs of the middle east, he's against children, he's anti-good, pro-evil, anti-business, pro-business, anti-property, he once voted simultaneously for and against a bill that could be construed as pro-anti choice of various things. And you should just see some of the stuff from his past. He once walked past a church. He would just spend the majority of his time doing 4-Way out of Air Force One!"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #22 June 15, 2007 Quote when England, the rightful owner,.. That's the funniest thing I've heard in a while. Good one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #23 June 15, 2007 Quotewhen rockets are flying out of Gaza you cannot say that "these are extremists out of the PA's control" like they usuaaly say. Quite right! Not only were the attacks out of the PA's control, but Israel was expected to negotiate with the PA regardless, despite their inability to control it.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #24 June 15, 2007 Quotewhen England, the rightful owner, handed the land over to the Israelis, actually it was divided between the two nations who lived there, one simply never accepted the division plan. but that's irrelevant to this post. i'll be lying if i said that i don't prefer them shooting at eachother than shooting at me but I'm not happy with it at all. right after Israel was founded, it too was one step away from a civil war (look up "altalena") but Ben-Gurion a nation can only have one armed force and not a group of militias. this is something Israel has demanded tfrom Arafat since 1993 but he chose to let them be (and even use them when he thought it would be useful). now his party is overpowered and we're getting a much worse option... O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #25 June 15, 2007 Quote Quote when England, the rightful owner,.. That's the funniest thing I've heard in a while. Good one. What part of the world that matters hasn't had control determined by the winner of a war?People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
