I would like to tell you a bit more about God

[JackC 0]

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I don't think it's an issue. If you're going to follow all the rules, you wouldn't be having extra/pre-marital sex anyway.

If you are NOT following the rules (ie, you're having pre-marital sex) then by definition you're not going to follow the rules about the condoms either.

By that logic, if you're guilty if speeding, you're not going to have any problem with murder either and that is obviously complete rubbish. People don't follow all the rules or none of them. They follow the rules they think are important. Anyway, marriage isn't a magic potion that prevents you from passing HIV to your spouse.

The absolute bottom line is that the catholic church is condemning the use of condoms. Given that condoms can help prevent the spread of STDs, that is a very stupid thing to do. I am absolutely amazed that anyone is defending them.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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I don't think it's an issue. If you're going to follow all the rules, you wouldn't be having extra/pre-marital sex anyway.

If you are NOT following the rules (ie, you're having pre-marital sex) then by definition you're not going to follow the rules about the condoms either.

By that logic, if you're guilty if speeding, you're not going to have any problem with murder either and that is obviously complete rubbish. People don't follow all the rules or none of them. They follow the rules they think are important. Anyway, marriage isn't a magic potion that prevents you from passing HIV to your spouse.

The absolute bottom line is that the catholic church is condemning the use of condoms. Given that condoms can help prevent the spread of STDs, that is a very stupid thing to do. I am absolutely amazed that anyone is defending them.

bit of an overstated comparison there. Murder is a MUCH bigger deal than speeding.

But if someone is having pre-marital sex, that's a much bigger step outside the rules than just putting on a condom. If you're already fucking around, you're obviously not worried about what the pope approves of , so why NOT use a condom? I think it's a non-issue in the real world.

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[JackC 0]

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But if someone is having pre-marital sex, that's a much bigger step outside the rules than just putting on a condom. If you're already fucking around, you're obviously not worried about what the pope approves of , so why NOT use a condom? I think it's a non-issue in the real world.

Like it or not, people and not just catholics, do listen to what the pope says and he is knowingly disseminating false information that may prevent people using a device that could save their life. He's telling porkies and it costs lives. How on earth can you possibly think this is a non-issue?

It seems to me that the catholic church is fanatically protective of the unborn potential people and don't give much of a shit about protecting the ones who are actually alive. That's a fricken bizarre philosophy if ever I heard one.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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It seems to me that the catholic church is fanatically protective of the unborn potential people and don't give much of a shit about protecting the ones who are actually alive.

Not fucking around is FAR more protective than fucking around, even with a condom. Sounds to me like they do care.

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[Royd 0]

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There are many innocent victims of AIDS/HIV, but make no mistake about it; the pandemic is the cause of individuals actions. The culpability of these individuals is between them and God only. Not being permitted to use condoms has not caused the spread of AIDS. The action of individuals has caused it. According to the Catholic teaching, you cannot perform an evil act in order to have a good result.

But you just don't get it. We evolved from lower primates and have no self control. When the feeling comes over us, we just have to stick it in something.

[kallend 2,026]

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There are many innocent victims of AIDS/HIV, but make no mistake about it; the pandemic is the cause of individuals actions. The culpability of these individuals is between them and God only. Not being permitted to use condoms has not caused the spread of AIDS. The action of individuals has caused it. According to the Catholic teaching, you cannot perform an evil act in order to have a good result.

But you just don't get it. We evolved from lower primates and have no self control. When the feeling comes over us, we just have to stick it in something.

You must be referring to Catholic priests and kids, right?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,990]

>Sounds to me like they do care.

If this were in the skydiving world, the equivalent would be an organization that protests the use of reserves, and teaches that if you pack your main parachute well you don't need a dangerous and failure-prone reserve parachute. Literally true perhaps, but I think most people would agree such an attitude would overall lead to a lot more deaths.

[maadmax 0]

So atheists, what is the big deal. None of you could care less what the Catholic Church has to say about anything. You are obviously trying to make some other point. There is nothing in the Bible about condom usage. So it is a non issue as far as developing a relationship with God is concerned. If some religious person wants to "help God out" by clarifying or confusing the issue, that is his problem. It is not a Christian Spiritual problem. You all are using another smoke screen issue to confuse what the more important issues are. Mainly salvation and relationship with God. The Bible does say those guilty of indecent sexual acts will receive the due penalty of their sins manifest in their person. Go figure, Why would a loving God
make such a statement?

[JackC 0]

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So atheists, what is the big deal. None of you could care less what the Catholic Church has to say about anything.

Don't confuse disbelief with not caring. I care very much when people knowingly lie, especially when that lie can cost lives. The real question is why don't you care?

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You are obviously trying to make some other point. There is nothing in the Bible about condom usage. So it is a non issue as far as developing a relationship with God is concerned. If some religious person wants to "help God out" by clarifying or confusing the issue, that is his problem. It is not a Christian Spiritual problem. You all are using another smoke screen issue to confuse what the more important issues are. Mainly salvation and relationship with God.

A relationship with god is not an issue for me at all. It would be as rediculous as having a relationship with the easter bunny. The issue is the Vatican deliberately putting out false and misleading information about condoms. It's dishonest, it's dangerous and it deserves to be challenged.

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The Bible does say those guilty of indecent sexual acts will receive the due penalty of their sins manifest in their person. Go figure, Why would a loving God make such a statement?

Well god is a fictional character, so it was in the script. But if we assume that god did say that, it would imply that he sent HIV as a punishment for sexual impropriety on top of the eternal punishment waiting for us in hell. How you can think god is loving after that is beyond me.

[Royd 0]

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Don't confuse disbelief with not caring. I care very much when people knowingly lie, especially when that lie can cost lives. The real question is why don't you care?

Isn't it a lie that man does not have the moral fortitude to forego the fleeting pleasure of an illicit sexual encounter?

Here's the irony.The liberals of this world, for years, have promoted a laissez faire attitude toward sexual responsibility. We're a new generation. We practice sexual freedom, blah, blah, blah.....

Now that things have run their course, and we are paying the price for our own stupidity, we still want someone else to fix the problem. The problem is, that we don't really want it fixed. We just want to slap a huge bandage on it and continue on with our bad behavior.
This applies across the board, not just in the sexual realm. We want the doctor to replace our clogged arteries while we are stuffing a grease burger in our face.
Who's responsibility is the 6 yr. old who weighs 125 lb. and can't even put his knees together?

Here's another irony. These same people insist that everything has evolved and it is a world of survival of the fittest, yet these same people insist on keeping the stupidest, weakest of us alive, and for what? To propagate the species?

[jakee 1,489]

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I don't think it's an issue. If you're going to follow all the rules, you wouldn't be having extra/pre-marital sex anyway.

If you are NOT following the rules (ie, you're having pre-marital sex) then by definition you're not going to follow the rules about the condoms either.

Complete and utter bullshit, as I have explained at length to Royd.

It is absolutely not the case that people will always either follow all rules or no rules. You're a rational and intelligent guy, you should be fucking ashamed of yourself for using such a transparently false argument.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,489]

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So atheists, what is the big deal.

The big deal is the Catholic church contributing to the spread of AIDS. How could you possibly have been following the thread and not understanding that?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[JackC 0]

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Isn't it a lie that man does not have the moral fortitude to forego the fleeting pleasure of an illicit sexual encounter?

People also have the fortitude to forego flying on holiday to far flung destinations but they don't, even though there is a risk that some idiot might hyjack the plane and fly it into a building.

It's funny but people generally think that taking precautions like tightening airport security is a wise thing to do because they recognise that people are gong to want to fly from A to B in safety.

Likewise people are going to want to have sex with each other but somehow taking precautions isn't allowed. They have to stop shagging all together because the myths of a bunch of bronze age nomads still override common bloody sense.

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Here's another irony. These same people insist that everything has evolved and it is a world of survival of the fittest, yet these same people insist on keeping the stupidest, weakest of us alive, and for what? To propagate the species?

And what is that supposed to mean?

[SpeedRacer 1]

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>Sounds to me like they do care.

If this were in the skydiving world, the equivalent would be an organization that protests the use of reserves, and teaches that if you pack your main parachute well you don't need a dangerous and failure-prone reserve parachute. Literally true perhaps, but I think most people would agree such an attitude would overall lead to a lot more deaths.

Invalid analogy, first of all.

Secondly, you seem to be making the logical error here known as "reasoning from analogy" http://www.soyouwanna.com/site/syws/logic/logic6.html

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[SpeedRacer 1]

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I don't think it's an issue. If you're going to follow all the rules, you wouldn't be having extra/pre-marital sex anyway.

If you are NOT following the rules (ie, you're having pre-marital sex) then by definition you're not going to follow the rules about the condoms either.

Complete and utter bullshit, as I have explained at length to Royd.

It is absolutely not the case that people will always either follow all rules or no rules. .

That is true. But picture the situation: a guy who is about to screw some chick (that he's not married to) is , in the real world, highly unlikely to be worried about the church's opinion on wearing a little rubber thing while he does it.

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[JackC 0]

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That is true. But picture the situation: a guy who is about to screw some chick (that he's not married to) is , in the real world, highly unlikely to be worried about the church's opinion on wearing a little rubber thing while he does it.

Since when is getting married the magic bullet that stops you from passing HIV to your spouse?


Edit: 1000th post. I should have done better.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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That is true. But picture the situation: a guy who is about to screw some chick (that he's not married to) is , in the real world, highly unlikely to be worried about the church's opinion on wearing a little rubber thing while he does it.

Since when is getting married the magic bullet that stops you from passing HIV to your spouse?

.

There is no magic bullet. Certain activities (such as having multiple sex partners) increase your chances of contracting HIV or other STD.

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Edit: 1000th post. I should have done better.

this thread is getting to be like That Other Thread.

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[maadmax 0]

Don't confuse disbelief with not caring. I care very much when people knowingly lie, especially when that lie can cost lives. The real question is why don't you care?
___________________________________________

I do care very much about the temporal and eternal condition of yours and others souls.
You are right those who spread false information should be held accountable. Hopefully all people who engage in such activity will stop. But the last time I looked this thread was about God, not the Catholic Church.


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But if we assume that god did say that, it would imply that he sent HIV as a punishment for sexual impropriety on top of the eternal punishment waiting for us in hell. How you can think god is loving after that is beyond me.

[billvon 2,990]

> Here's another irony. These same people insist that everything has
>evolved and it is a world of survival of the fittest, yet these same people
>insist on keeping the stupidest, weakest of us alive, and for what? To
>propagate the species?

No, that's something called compassion. Believe it or not, those people you think are "stupid and weak" are loved by someone - and are just as important to them as you are to your loved ones.

[Royd 0]

> Here's another irony. These same people insist that everything has
>evolved and it is a world of survival of the fittest, yet these same people
>insist on keeping the stupidest, weakest of us alive, and for what? To
>propagate the species?

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No, that's something called compassion. Believe it or not, those people you think are "stupid and weak" are loved by someone - and are just as important to them as you are to your loved ones.

If they loved them so much, maybe a little tough love at the proper moment would have been in order.

[Royd 0]

Here's another irony. These same people insist that everything has evolved and it is a world of survival of the fittest, yet these same people insist on keeping the stupidest, weakest of us alive, and for what? To propagate the species?

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And what is that supposed to mean?

Basically, it means that this liberal world wants to have its cake and eat it, too.
If AIDS were dealt with like every other communicable disease, it would run its course in one or two generations. For some reason, it's not PC to let the rest of the community know that someone has AIDS and is possibly spreading it, yet the CDC quarantines a man at the mention of TB.

It's quite ironic how everyone gets up in arms about someone's right to privacy inside the bedroom, whether that person is doing it with ten other people, or their dog, but we are supposed to feel great compassion for the person and throw tons of money at the end result of this person's stupidity, hopefully finding a cure, so that they can continue in their stupidity.

[billvon 2,990]

> If AIDS were dealt with like every other communicable disease, it would
> run its course in one or two generations.

AIDS IS being treated like other communicable diseases.

>For some reason, it's not PC to let the rest of the community know that
>someone has AIDS and is possibly spreading it, yet the CDC quarantines a
>man at the mention of TB.

That's because you can't be in the same room with someone who has TB without risking transmission.

>It's quite ironic how everyone gets up in arms about someone's right to
>privacy inside the bedroom, whether that person is doing it with ten other
>people, or their dog, but we are supposed to feel great compassion for the
>person and throw tons of money at the end result of this person's
>stupidity, hopefully finding a cure, so that they can continue in their
>stupidity.

Would you have them rounded up and executed?

They have a disease and are treated for it. Like every single other disease out there.

But let's look at the two things that, together, are the #1 cause of death in the US - smoking and obesity. That's #1 - hundreds of thousands of dead a year, due to heart disease brought on by diet and smoking. Yet obese smokers still have the right to smoke and eat all they like in private OR in public. Do you want to change that as well?

[Royd 0]

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But let's look at the two things that, together, are the #1 cause of death in the US - smoking and obesity. That's #1 - hundreds of thousands of dead a year, due to heart disease brought on by diet and smoking. Yet obese smokers still have the right to smoke and eat all they like in private OR in public. Do you want to change that as well?

They've been warned already. Not my problem, unless one of them trips and falls on me with a cigarette in her mouth.

[funkcanna 0]

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God is honoring our free will and making a way for us to regain our previous position. .

He is honoring it by doing what exactly? Absolutely fuck all? I thought so. Convenient. He shows his presence by doing fuck all.

Which links me to my other thread - what does God do while he is "Honoring our free will"?

To know requires proof
To believe requires evidence
To have faith requires neither.
If you stick with that, we'll never be confused again

[maadmax 0]

He is honoring it by doing what exactly?

By allowing people like you to have it and exercise it freely.
____________________________________________
Absolutely fuck all? I thought so. Convenient. He shows his presence by doing fuck all.

What ever on earth are you talking about?

____________________________________________

Which links me to my other thread - what does God do while he is "Honoring our free will"?