0
pop

Social Healthcare?

Recommended Posts

1> As soon as they stop nurturing both fruits from the same fertilizer, I'll consider them separate. In the mean time, since you're considering that the healthcare costs come form the general pool also, it's only fair.
2.See point one. I'm not in this thread to discuss budgetary process.
3.You're part of a society that by it's very nature, cares for itself as one - at least in general principle.
4>I, a tax paying person, subsidize public functions we all benefit from. Would you please stop being greedy with those?

It's almost impossible to separate out individual costs and services provide. Want the cops to issue a bill to you when they respond? (besides the tickets anyway) Fireman, library, every bridge and road, public library, infrstructure support??? As a society you don't have the luxury of choosing what you pay for directly. Deal with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

i dont thiank anything is free.....maybe you missed the part where i wrote "paid by taxpayers." Everyone shuold have access to healthcare the same way they have access to schooling....that's my only point. Everyone shares these costs in the form of taxes. why should healthcare be any different from education? You got to go to school on everyone elses money. Were you complaining then? I didnt think so.



There are several big differences between public education and a universal healthcare program.

- Public education is provided to 1/3rd of the population in a given year, not the entire population.
- Public education is fairly uniform in what is provided - 6 hours of classroom instruction - 180 days per year. Comparatively, it's a cookie cutter operation.
- Total gov't funding of K-12 public education is approximately $500 billion per year. Total healthcare costs run 2-3 TRILLION DOLLARS per year. IOW it's a much bigger expenditure.

Here's the kicker, we've had nationwide "free" education for about 90 years, yet we seem unable to get it right. There's always a push for more money and the quality of education seems to constantly be lacking. Anyone live in a school district that actually runs smoothly and doesn't constantly have a bunch of infighting?

Do you realy want to turn over your healthcare to someone who has consistently shown an inability to manage programs that involve a large portion of the population? Programs far simpler than universal healthcare?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

i dont thiank anything is free.....maybe you missed the part where i wrote "paid by taxpayers." Everyone shuold have access to healthcare the same way they have access to schooling....that's my only point. Everyone shares these costs in the form of taxes. why should healthcare be any different from education? You got to go to school on everyone elses money. Were you complaining then? I didnt think so.



There are several big differences between public education and a universal healthcare program.

- Public education is provided to 1/3rd of the population in a given year, not the entire population.
- Public education is fairly uniform in what is provided - 6 hours of classroom instruction - 180 days per year. Comparatively, it's a cookie cutter operation.
- Total gov't funding of K-12 public education is approximately $500 billion per year. Total healthcare costs run 2-3 TRILLION DOLLARS per year. IOW it's a much bigger expenditure.

Here's the kicker, we've had nationwide "free" education for about 90 years, yet we seem unable to get it right. There's always a push for more money and the quality of education seems to constantly be lacking. Anyone live in a school district that actually runs smoothly and doesn't constantly have a bunch of infighting?

Do you realy want to turn over your healthcare to someone who has consistently shown an inability to manage programs that involve a large portion of the population? Programs far simpler than universal healthcare?



I'd rather turn it over to people who only care about my health when I dont have any prblems...since that's the only way they make money. I'd like to have corporations carrying about my health. They have proven to be so caring.

Did you know that once you have a heart attack you can no longer have insurance. So what do you do then?
7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
So you're actively involved in the discontinuance of the welfare system, WIC program, and any similar state programs already in place?
Florida has had a state ran child medical insurance program for a number of years, so we're already paying for the underpriviledged children.
I appreciate your efforts to incite with your PA's and insults too.
Just being a parent doesn't make us all bad...some of us do actually raise fine members of society.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Believe me, you got your money's worth. Think otherwise? Try doing the numbers for replacing the entire Dept of Defense with Blackwater contractors.



Could you cite that? During the Congressional testimony last week Eric Prince (the CEO of Blackwater) suggested that one needs to be done -- just on the value to the taxpayer of contracting Blackwater versus employing federal workers in Iraq.
Thanks.

Yesterday I was at WR AFB. In a different area (i.e., not security), they've found that private contractors cost more. And were less successful.

VR/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

There are several big differences between public education and a universal healthcare program.

- Public education is provided to 1/3rd of the population in a given year, not the entire population.
- Public education is fairly uniform in what is provided - 6 hours of classroom instruction - 180 days per year. Comparatively, it's a cookie cutter operation.
- Total gov't funding of K-12 public education is approximately $500 billion per year. Total healthcare costs run 2-3 TRILLION DOLLARS per year. IOW it's a much bigger expenditure.

Here's the kicker, we've had nationwide "free" education for about 90 years, yet we seem unable to get it right. There's always a push for more money and the quality of education seems to constantly be lacking. Anyone live in a school district that actually runs smoothly and doesn't constantly have a bunch of infighting?

Do you realy want to turn over your healthcare to someone who has consistently shown an inability to manage programs that involve a large portion of the population? Programs far simpler than universal healthcare?



I'd rather turn it over to people who only care about my health when I dont have any prblems...since that's the only way they make money. I'd like to have corporations carrying about my health. They have proven to be so caring.

Did you know that once you have a heart attack you can no longer have insurance. So what do you do then?



Does this have anything to do with the points/comparisons I made?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

You got to go to school on everyone elses money.




On everyone elses money? My parents paid there taxes!


Quote

Everyone shuold have access to healthcare




Everyone does have access. You just want everyone else to pay for it.
If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote



K-12: Private schools. No scholarships.

College: I signed a ROTC scholarship for a State University. It would've been the same cost to me, I chose State U over a private school for academic reasons, in effect saving the Govt money. And I paid back my end of the Contract via service to the Dept of Defense.



Woah there why should some one taxes pay for YOUR education. You are reaping a benefit from a social perspective

What would you say to some one that objects to taxes were taken to pay for defense not for education why should you get compensated? You chose to enroll I didn’t force you to why should I pay for your education?

“I paid for mine and will pay for my children why should you pick my pocket for that?” because you could not get a civilian job or pay your own way for school?

There are many social aspects you are using without acknowledging it but you have such a hard stance against health care.

You keep bring up why should you keep paying for people indiscriminate breeding “insert continued rant here”

Why because you NEED to have a continued maintained population if only those that can afford to completely raise children without government assistance the population would decline then you need to increase immigration ( and we all know how open of a topic that is and I’m not talking about the illegals) Then they need to ensure they have the economic means to raise children if not they look else where to go immigrate to.

Education health care is tipping the balance. How many people have complained about out sourcing to foreign nation? The cost of companies to support private insurance is becoming to cost prohibitive to compete. If they not offer health insurance then they do not get the talent and stable work force they require. The moving of job to other countries help how ? The decline continues and then it starts to affect everyone. There are repercussions of not supporting the correct social programs it’s not picking your pockets as it helps line them. If social decline continues unabated the economically it will cost YOU more in the long run. If you don’t think the disparity between the rich has no real impact the you haven study the depression and the impact of not having social programs in place.

http://www.gusmorino.com/pag3/greatdepression/

This could very well repeat itself if a country is not careful with the correct checks and balance to support it work force and populace.
SO this one time at band camp.....

"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I paid back my end of the contract with the government. I doubt those who want universal health care will pay back (with interest) the true cost of care.

This seems to be another US/UK divide. We fought a war 231 years ago to not be the same. No point in badgering each others.
Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

You got to go to school on everyone elses money.




On everyone elses money? My parents paid there their taxes!



I guess they didn't get good value in the spelling department.

Quote




Quote

Everyone shuold have access to healthcare




Everyone does have access. You just want everyone else to pay for it.



But did YOUR parents pay the true cost of your education, or was some wealthier family actually subsidizing you from their taxes?

Ditto for the use of police, fire and other services and infrastructure.

Or possibly future generations will be paying for you, on account of the fact that we don't actually pay our way at all, but just borrow and borrow - more than $3Trillion during the Bush presidency alone.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I paid back my end of the contract with the government. I doubt those who want universal health care will pay back (with interest) the true cost of care.

This seems to be another US/UK divide. We fought a war 231 years ago to not be the same. No point in badgering each others.



Did you pay back the TRUE cost of your education?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

I paid back my end of the contract with the government. I doubt those who want universal health care will pay back (with interest) the true cost of care.

This seems to be another US/UK divide. We fought a war 231 years ago to not be the same. No point in badgering each others.



Did you pay back the TRUE cost of your education?



Yes and then some. Opportunity cost as well as sweat equity.

Let us speak of your cause cause celebre': Why do taxpayers foot the bill for ATC? Why not fee-for-service?
Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

College: I signed a ROTC scholarship for a State University.



Well, there you have it. State Universities receive significant government subsidies. That's why tuition at U of Illinois is less than 1/3 of what it is at the private U. of Chicago or Northwestern U. You are a social leech after all.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

College: I signed a ROTC scholarship for a State University.



Well, there you have it. State Universities receive significant government subsidies. That's why tuition at U of Illinois is less than 1/3 of what it is at the private U. of Chicago or Northwestern U. You are a social leech after all.



The govt paid it, and I earned it thru my efforts. It's called a contract.

Would you say IIT shouldn't have their tax exemption? They're so eager to recruit ROTC students and their paid in full-tuition... it costs the US Govt less to pay for a Cadet at State U than IIT...
Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

Quote

I paid back my end of the contract with the government. I doubt those who want universal health care will pay back (with interest) the true cost of care.

This seems to be another US/UK divide. We fought a war 231 years ago to not be the same. No point in badgering each others.



Did you pay back the TRUE cost of your education?


Yes and then some. Opportunity cost as well as sweat equity.

Let us speak of your cause cause celebre': Why do taxpayers foot the bill for ATC? Why not fee-for-service?


The taxpayers in question are the purchasers of aviation fuel. :P The more you fly, the more you pay whether or not you use ATC services.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote


Did you pay back the TRUE cost of your education?



Yes and then some. Opportunity cost as well as sweat equity.


Sweat equity??
Given the price the government assigns to the military educations they provide for us, I highly doubt that. Unless you simply carried a weapon anyway.
Even more doubtful if you were an Officer....although the limited education provided in the service for those is another discussion in itself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

Quote

College: I signed a ROTC scholarship for a State University.



Well, there you have it. State Universities receive significant government subsidies. That's why tuition at U of Illinois is less than 1/3 of what it is at the private U. of Chicago or Northwestern U. You are a social leech after all.



The govt paid it, and I earned it thru my efforts. It's called a contract.

Would you say IIT shouldn't have their tax exemption? They're so eager to recruit ROTC students and their paid in full-tuition... it costs the US Govt less to pay for a Cadet at State U than IIT...



You can't weasel out of it. YOU received a tuition subsidy from the state's taxpayers in order to attend a state university. Your ROTC scholarship didn't offset that subsidy. Your heroic "efforts" and "sweat" were for your own benefit, not the university's or the state's taxpayers' benefit. It costs them the same whether you get straight "A"s or straight "D"s.

Sorry, you are a recipient of government handouts.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

College: I signed a ROTC scholarship for a State University.



Well, there you have it. State Universities receive significant government subsidies. That's why tuition at U of Illinois is less than 1/3 of what it is at the private U. of Chicago or Northwestern U. You are a social leech after all.



The govt paid it, and I earned it thru my efforts. It's called a contract.

Would you say IIT shouldn't have their tax exemption? They're so eager to recruit ROTC students and their paid in full-tuition... it costs the US Govt less to pay for a Cadet at State U than IIT...



You can't weasel out of it. YOU received a tuition subsidy from the state's taxpayers in order to attend a state university. Your ROTC scholarship didn't offset that subsidy. Your heroic "efforts" and "sweat" were for your own benefit, not the university's or the state's taxpayers' benefit. It costs them the same whether you get straight "A"s or straight "D"s.

Sorry, you are a recipient of government handouts.



Do you teach students whose tuition is being paid by ROTC? If so: Pot, Kettle. Kettle, Pot.
Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Or possibly future generations will be paying for you, on account of the fact that we don't actually pay our way at all, but just borrow and borrow - more than $3Trillion during the Bush presidency alone.



Hey... let's throw unfunded Medicaid, Social Security, etc. promises into the mix. Then our debt rises dramatically to a total of $59.1 Trillion.

Makes the financial aspects of universal healthcare that much more appealing, eh?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

How many people have complained about out sourcing to foreign nation? The cost of companies to support private insurance is becoming to cost prohibitive to compete.



1. They'd still be in the same boat with the government "paying" for health insurance since wages would have to increase to leave enough for housing and other expenses. Socialized medicine is only going to reduce costs if coverage is reduced (in which case some employers are still going to be paying for health insurance) or efficiency increases (we spend more per capita than other countries so this is theoretically possible, although it would require avoiding excessive pork and concessions to the medical industry)

2. The difference between our expenses and developing countries far exceeds even the $1000/month price of an excellent group plan. Chinese auto workers earn $150 a month, while the union contract with Daimler-Chrysler calls for $3000-$6000/month in America depending on pay grade.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

free public schools,



Yep. Got my ass kicked all the time, too.

Quote

got their via free roads



Actually, it WAS free, I guess, because I rode my bike every day.

Quote

Were you also speaking out so loudly against free schooling when you were getting to educate yourselves paid by taxpayer money?



Nope. I was busy trying to defend myself. Then I became the bully.

p.s. - roads aren't free.


My wife is hotter than your wife.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

0