Marijuana growers taking over cottage country

[NCclimber 0]

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Casual pot usage is not to be feared. But everyday usage is not health to the body or the mind. But pot is not better/worse than alcohol and at least smoking pot and drinking alcohol gives you something in return. Smoking cigarettes is a complete waste of time.

So, it's been 12 months, eh?

[normiss 800]

true...but it sucks here in Orlando as the patio has become the smoking/pet section of a restaurant since we now allow dogs in restaurants downtown.
If you want to eat outside in nice weather, you're screwed!

[Gawain 0]

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Oh yeah, and please reconcile point 3 with this thread you started a few weeks ago.

Where's that regard for property rights now?

The active ingredient in MJ smoke is a drug - not so with tobacco.

Nicotine is not only a drug, it's one of the most addictive substances known to man.

In fact, nicotine on its own is potentially very deadly.

However, the psychoactive effects are way different from THC. Long term use with THC is linked to paranoid delusions, hallucinations and other psychotic episodes. That doesn't include the long term effects on memory, apathy...ad infinitum.

With so much over regulation taking place now with just cigarettes, legalization of marijuana is a non-starter. The debate over health care would boil over and the over all health of the nation would plummet.

Regulation of a dangerous substance does not equal safety. Alcohol regulation does not stop DUIs. Tobacco regulation does not stop people from smoking, and the regulation is so tight, that tax revenue from tobacco is in danger of evaporating.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[Esquilax 0]

If there is enough will to legalize cannabis, then those with that will should engage their Government representatives to change the law.

Lacking said change, if one intentionally flaunts State and Federal Law, a rational adult should be expected to be held responsible under the penal provisions of the law they have broken.

I personally don't care. I've never smoked anything, never will. I enjoy a beer, but seldom to excess.

Change the law thru the governmental processes. I really don't see a judicial remedy here, as I doubt the right to smoke cannabis is right under the law.

Ostriches and rheas are the only birds that urinate and defecate separately. They read Parachutist while doing #2.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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Oh yeah, and please reconcile point 3 with this thread you started a few weeks ago.

Where's that regard for property rights now?

The active ingredient in MJ smoke is a drug - not so with tobacco.

Nicotine is not only a drug, it's one of the most addictive substances known to man.

In fact, nicotine on its own is potentially very deadly.

However, the psychoactive effects are way different from THC. Long term use with THC is linked to paranoid delusions, hallucinations and other psychotic episodes. That doesn't include the long term effects on memory, apathy...ad infinitum.

With so much over regulation taking place now with just cigarettes, legalization of marijuana is a non-starter. The debate over health care would boil over and the over all health of the nation would plummet.

Regulation of a dangerous substance does not equal safety. Alcohol regulation does not stop DUIs. Tobacco regulation does not stop people from smoking, and the regulation is so tight, that tax revenue from tobacco is in danger of evaporating.

Yep. End the war on drugs. Save $, take the profit out of the hands of criminals, free up space in prisons, time, $, & manpower enforcing drug laws, etc etc. Then pot would only harm people dumb enough to abuse it.

Speed Racer
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[Richards 0]

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true...but it sucks here in Orlando as the patio has become the smoking/pet section of a restaurant since we now allow dogs in restaurants downtown.
If you want to eat outside in nice weather, you're screwed!

What's wrong with bringing mans best freind to a patio. I would love to be able to take my dog out for a beer.

With respect to the patio smoking I guess it comes down to individual tolerance. I personally do not like cigarette smoke in a confined area but I have no problem with it in an open one like a patio or outdoor stadium.

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[normiss 800]

I love taking the dog to the restaurant. They have drinks and snacks for them too. I also share beer with my pooch. He also like Crown Royal, but we save that for special events.
I don't like having lost the nice patio dinner to "everything we don't want inside" though.
Sometimes it would be nice to enjoy a nice out door meal without smelling a cigarette because I just want to puke when I smell them, even more so around food.
but that's me.

[normiss 800]

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Long term use with THC is linked to paranoid delusions, hallucinations and other psychotic episodes.

Now I'm not a proponent of pot - nor do I smoke it. But I simply do not believe this...you been listening to the government?
I believe we should have the choice to pollute our bodies as we see fit, it IS my body after all. Just make me responsible for my actions, both sober and under the influence.
I know plenty of people that smoke weed in the privacy of their own home, they have no problems. A number of them are very well off. The illegality is the only issue for some that enjoy it the same as those that enjoy wine or beer, a fine cigar, a pipe...
You've probably got a number of them around you you're unaware of.

[Gawain 0]

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Long term use with THC is linked to paranoid delusions, hallucinations and other psychotic episodes.

Now I'm not a proponent of pot - nor do I smoke it. But I simply do not believe this...you been listening to the government?
I believe we should have the choice to pollute our bodies as we see fit, it IS my body after all. Just make me responsible for my actions, both sober and under the influence.
I know plenty of people that smoke weed in the privacy of their own home, they have no problems. A number of them are very well off. The illegality is the only issue for some that enjoy it the same as those that enjoy wine or beer, a fine cigar, a pipe...
You've probably got a number of them around you you're unaware of.

I read of one study in the UK released earlier this year, but I can't immediately find it. Yale did a study a few years ago...http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2004-06/yu-sfc061404.php

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[normiss 800]

Odd, I've never met a schizophrenic pot head.
"HEY! Be quiet in here!"

Seriously...those seem to be standard effects of the drug while it is active in a person's system.
Check them again after the effects wear off.

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These symptoms included suspiciousness, unusual thoughts, paranoia, thought disorder, blunted affect, reduced spontaneity, reduced interaction with the interviewer, and problems with memory and attention

Aren't those the effects a person desires when smoking weed? That's like telling me "we tested people under the influence of alcohol - they were drunk."

Also, are these "labbits" regular consumers of the product or only for the lab tests? Have they consumed other "products" in their lives?

Statistics can be massaged pretty much any way we choose to use them.

Much like a drunk uses a lamp post. More for support than for illumination.

[SpeedRacer 1]

OH dear. If ONLY the Great & Glorious Almighty Government would come to save us from ourselves!!

Speed Racer
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[NCclimber 0]

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Alcohol is legal and a drug. We don't allow children to have it. That's a bit harder to do with an airborne drug, don't you think?

Hah! Are you seriously going to argue that the nicotine in cigarette smoke is either less addictive or less harmful than the THC in cannabis smoke?

Please, share with us how nicotine is just as harmful as THC. I'd love to here this.

How about it Jakee? You seem to think your so smart. Let's here about how nicotine is so harmful.

[nerdgirl 0]

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Please, share with us how nicotine is just as harmful as THC. I'd love to here this.

How about it Jakee? You seem to think your so smart. Let's here about how nicotine is so harmful.

Clearly I'm not "Jakee" but I'll offer three concise ways (a couple of which have been mentioned or alluded to by other posters) by which nicotine is more harmful than THC:

(1) Toxicity. The LD50 (lethal dose) is at least two orders of magnitude lower for nicotine than THC, i.e., need a lot less nicotine to kill.

(2) Greater impact on US healthcare costs due to use of nicotine-containing products, e.g., lung cancer, emphysema.

(3) Greater absolute number of deaths per year due to smoking or using nicotine-containing products.

Those aren't necessarily the criteria by which the decision to make one legal and the other illegal for recreational use was made.

VR/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

[jakee 1,489]

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Alcohol is legal and a drug. We don't allow children to have it. That's a bit harder to do with an airborne drug, don't you think?

Hah! Are you seriously going to argue that the nicotine in cigarette smoke is either less addictive or less harmful than the THC in cannabis smoke?

Please, share with us how nicotine is just as harmful as THC. I'd love to here this.

How about it Jakee? You seem to think your so smart. Let's here about how nicotine is so harmful.

The mean lethal dose of THC is around 86 grams for an adult male. The mean lethal dose of Nicotine is around 60 milli-grams.

Nicotine evolved as a neurotoxin to stop plants being eaten. Nicotine has seen use as a pesticide. Niotine is, quite simply, incredibly fucking* toxic.

And I'm also smart enough to know the difference between hear and here. Twice.




*Token profanity thrown in so you can bitch about that instead of addressing the content of my post.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[NCclimber 0]

Thanks for the info.

[normiss 800]

any pothead I've ever seen would fall asleep long before lethal dose is acquired...

[Butters 0]

Tobacco and alcohol caused 520,000 deaths in 2000. Marijuana caused 0 deaths in 2000.

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(2000): "The leading causes of death in 2000 were tobacco (435,000 deaths; 18.1% of total US deaths), poor diet and physical inactivity (400,000 deaths; 16.6%), and alcohol consumption (85,000 deaths; 3.5%). Other actual causes of death were microbial agents (75,000), toxic agents (55,000), motor vehicle crashes (43,000), incidents involving firearms (29,000), sexual behaviors (20,000), and illicit use of drugs (17,000)."
(Note: According to a correction published by the Journal on Jan. 19, 2005, "On page 1240, in Table 2, '400,000 (16.6)' deaths for 'poor diet and physical inactivity' in 2000 should be '365,000 (15.2).' A dagger symbol should be added to 'alcohol consumption' in the body of the table and a dagger footnote should be added with 'in 1990 data, deaths from alcohol-related crashes are included in alcohol consumption deaths, but not in motor vehicle deaths. In 2000 data, 16,653 deaths from alcohol-related crashes are included in both alcohol consumption and motor vehicle death categories." Source: Journal of the American Medical Association, Jan. 19, 2005, Vol. 293, No. 3, p. 298.)

Source: Mokdad, Ali H., PhD, James S. Marks, MD, MPH, Donna F. Stroup, PhD, MSc, Julie L. Gerberding, MD, MPH, "Actual Causes of Death in the United States, 2000," Journal of the American Medical Association, March 10, 2004, Vol. 291, No. 10, pp. 1238, 1241.

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An exhaustive search of the literature finds no credible reports of deaths induced by marijuana. The US Drug Abuse Warning Network (DAWN) records instances of drug mentions in medical examiners' reports, and though marijuana is mentioned, it is usually in combination with alcohol or other drugs. Marijuana alone has not been shown to cause an overdose death.

Source: Drug Abuse Warning Network (DAWN), available on the web at http://www.samhsa.gov/; also see Janet E. Joy, Stanley J. Watson, Jr., and John A. Benson, Jr., "Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base," Division of Neuroscience and Behavioral Research, Institute of Medicine (Washington, DC: National Academy Press, 1999), available on the web at http://www.nap.edu/html/marimed/; and US Department of Justice, Drug Enforcement Administration, "In the Matter of Marijuana Rescheduling Petition" (Docket #86-22), September 6, 1988, p. 57.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[Royd 0]

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(If you do this, then I could see #2 above go away - it guarantees the idiots are doped up on their own time - so it's none of their employer's business except on issues that can be independently judged).

It had been years since I smoked, and even back then, pot was getting pretty strong.

I happened across some; imagine my surprise; and partook. My brain was still fuzzy 14 hr. later.

If an employer doesn't want his workers using it, a blood test would control that.

[rehmwa 2]

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(If you do this, then I could see #2 above go away - it guarantees the idiots are doped up on their own time - so it's none of their employer's business except on issues that can be independently judged).

It had been years since I smoked, and even back then, pot was getting pretty strong.

I happened across some; imagine my surprise; and partook. My brain was still fuzzy 14 hr. later.

I don't want a fuzzy employee. I don't much care about the why.

If an employer doesn't want his workers using it, a blood test would control that.

As I said, "independently judged" - if, 14 hours later the employee is "fuzzy" and not performing up to par, then he's fired for not being able to do his job. It could be because he's stoned, drunk, stupid, or lazy, I don't care.

But, as I said, an employer should be able to set most any conditions to employment, just like any person should be able to leave a job for any, or no reason. Both should have to live with the consequences of any unreasonable conditions they set.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[jakee 1,489]

I think we all learned a very important lesson about smugness today

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[pirana 0]

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Aside - ever notice that the Woodstock generation claims they have, and strongly stick to, a set of "convictions"? Funny, all these convictions, in the end, tie up to self gratification.

All convictions tie to self-gratification. No exceptions.

Everything we do, we do because we think it is the "right" thing to do.

Even Mother Theresa, who did what she did out of conviction, did it because she saw it as the right thing to do, and it made HER feel good to do the right thing.

I do not think altruism exists outside of the dictionary.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[rehmwa 2]

I'm surprised at the content, though not the cynicism of your post (I'm of the same cut)

But.... nonsense, one can feel good about an altruistic act - it isn't defined as purposeful self flagellation. That's another lefty myth, that self sacrifice has to be hurtful to the giver to be noble else it's automatically invalidated. Or, in your case, all altruistic actions are invalidated.

It depends solely on the motivation of the act. Mother T did what she did out of conviction and the satisfaction was: the primary motivator? or a nice bonus?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Gawain 0]

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Please, share with us how nicotine is just as harmful as THC. I'd love to here this.

A 60mg drop of nicotine can kill a human.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[Stumpy 284]

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I do not think altruism exists outside of the dictionary.

I agree - Richard Dawkins writes about this very compellingly in (I think) "The Selfish Gene" It is virtually impossible to find examples of true altruism in nature where there is NO benefit for the "giver"

I am in two minds about human altrusim - very difficult to prove either way.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[billvon 2,991]

>All convictions tie to self-gratification. No exceptions.

As people's convictions have led them to die painful and bloody deaths, that's not really true unless you redefine "self-gratification" as "anything you choose to do."

>Even Mother Theresa, who did what she did out of conviction, did
>it because she saw it as the right thing to do, and it made HER feel good
>to do the right thing.

I can't speak for her, but I have done things that made me feel bad because I thought they were the right thing to do.