Neighbor Guns Down Robbers with Shotgun while on with 911

[Channman 2]

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House burglary is dangerous in Texas.

As it should be.

[labrys 0]

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Now how does the burglary of an unoccupied home presents a threat of bodily injury to anyone?

What the guy did was act as judge, jury, and executioner over a burglary. What if he had been mistaken about what he was seeing, and in fact what was actually happening was a neighbor breaking into his own house because he lost his keys? At night, that could easily happen.

Self-defense law is intended to excuse a violent act when it is necessary to protect life and limb. What I read in this article was vigilantism.

I agree with this 100 percent. There's no way an outsider can claim anything close to self defense or defending property in a case like this. If someone is on my property uninvited and I feel threatened and shoot, so be it. I can't make that choice for the house next door. For all I know the neighbor called a friend and said they needed something from the house and just break in the kitchen window if the door is locked....

This guy called 911 for "permission" to go off half cocked and start shooting and when the dispatcher told him it was a bad idea he ignored them and played Rambo. He should be charged.

Owned by Remi #?

[akarunway 1]

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Shotguns are a better choice than handguns for home defense, IMO.

Depends on the situation. I have both.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[akarunway 1]

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it appears you live in a country where you can kill people for simply doing wrong..... doesn't make it right though

That's the way it was done in the old west. Maybe Texas is still lagging behind the rest of the US in proper justice...

But yeah, I think the neighbor pumping buckshot into lethal locations on the two poor bastards was over doing it. Why not just shoot them in the lower legs? They're not going anywhere after that.

So you shoot the guys in the legs and they pull their guns and kill YOU. NOT. You shoot to KILL

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[akarunway 1]

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Shotguns are a better choice than handguns for home defense, IMO.

How do you know, just assume the snivel position on the floor and maybe your neighbors will call 911.

Yeah. And wait fo 2 hrs. for the cops. Last time I called I got a busy signal and the next time was put on hold. Thank You. I'll defend myself

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[ryoder 1,590]

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Why not just shoot them in the lower legs? They're not going anywhere after that.

So you shoot the guys in the legs and they pull their guns and kill YOU. NOT. You shoot to KILL

You are both wrong. You don't shoot to wound, and you don't shoot to kill. You shoot to stop an attack. As soon as the attack has stopped, you stop shooting. You always aim for the center of mass.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[LouDiamond 1]

I'm not 100% up to speed on this incident but speaking from past incidents that I know happened in Texas and from having lived there, that guy will probably be found innocent if they even take it to court. The difference in Texas( I'm not a lawyer but I saw a show) is the perp doesn't have to be in the house for you to be within your rights to shoot him, just on your property. There was a case a while back in Texas where a guy heard someone out side his house trying to steal his vehicle during hours of darkness. Dude walked out of his house and shotgunned the perp. Turns out the perp was the repo man, taking jethros vehicle back for the bank. Long story short, dude was found innocent.

Of course some peope got upset over this and it was in the papers/TV for awhile but a vast majority supported the courts decission. That "Don't mess with Texas" saying isn't just about littering

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[akarunway 1]

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Why not just shoot them in the lower legs? They're not going anywhere after that.

So you shoot the guys in the legs and they pull their guns and kill YOU. NOT. You shoot to KILL

You are both wrong. You don't shoot to wound, and you don't shoot to kill. You shoot to stop an attack. As soon as the attack has stopped, you stop shooting. You always aim for the center of mass.

You're fuckin A center of mass. W/ 12 ga. 00 buck. And in case they're wearing body armor the second shot is to the head.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[Flacid_Monk 0]

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I'm not 100% up to speed on this incident but speaking from past incidents that I know happened in Texas and from having lived there, that guy will probably be found innocent if they even take it to court. The difference in Texas( I'm not a lawyer but I saw a show) is the perp doesn't have to be in the house for you to be within your rights to shoot him, just on your property. There was a case a while back in Texas where a guy heard someone out side his house trying to steal his vehicle during hours of darkness. Dude walked out of his house and shotgunned the perp. Turns out the perp was the repo man, taking jethros vehicle back for the bank. Long story short, dude was found innocent.

Of course some peope got upset over this and it was in the papers/TV for awhile but a vast majority supported the courts decission. That "Don't mess with Texas" saying isn't just about littering

Bizzare in the extreme

[kelpdiver 2]

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After hearing the actual 911 call on the news a couple of days ago it was appearant that this bozo was just itching to kill someone.The guy sounded like a nutcase when he says "Boom, your dead".
This guy went outside to do only one thing and that was to kill someone who was not a threat to him. He had only one thing in mind and that was to murder someone. He planned his action before he stepped out the door and then executed that action by pulling the trigger. He committed first degree murder.

It can't be first degree murder - the thief started the sequence of events.

But your overall sense - I tend to agree that it looks like he was looking for the opportunity. However, what happened when the confrontation began is still important. If he went to confront them and they made a move at the 61yo geezer, he had cause to fire. If they just said "fuck you old man" and he fired, no.

[kallend 2,106]

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Shotguns are a better choice than handguns for home defense, IMO.

How do you know,

Same way as I know the number of "chapters" (sic) in the US Constitution.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[1969912 0]

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Shotguns are a better choice than handguns for home defense, IMO.

Yep. They can be safer as well.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[freethefly 6]

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It can't be first degree murder - the thief started the sequence of events.

I would agree if the the old man was outside to begin with and was confronted by the dirtbag thief but, he wasn't.
Some years back when I was younger, stronger, bigger and dumber, I got into a confrontation with some guy at a stoplight. Long story short, he pulled a gun and said he was going to blow my head off. The light goes green and he drives off. Could had ended there but, like a moron, I follow him to the next light and got out to kick his ass. The guy freaked and wouldn't get out of his car so I kicked in his window and jumped halfway in and beat the crap out of him. Later that night the police showed up at my girlfriend's house (I was driving her car) as his girlfriend took down the plate number on Kelly's car. I explained my part of the story and was told that by getting out of my car changed everything and thus made me the aggressor. Had I stayed in my car and just took down his plate number and called it in it would had been a different story and I would not had got tossed in jail for the night.
He confronted them with violence. Not the other way around. Had he never stepped through the door, there would had been no confrontation. He forced the confrontation thus making himself the aggressor. He should had never gone outside.
Reading some of the blogs on this, I wonder if he would had done the samething had some kid been giving the neighbor a lawn job.
Actions such as his does not make our society any safer. He started out doing the right thing but he quickly turned it around. The sequence of events would had been burglary, Mr. Horn calls 911 with discription (maybe a plate number) and then let the police do their job. Horn altered the sequence by his own actions thus creating his own sequence of events that otherwise would not had occured.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[Zipp0 1]

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WTF

So it's ok to kill people for burglary now is it?

If you come into my house you will face the business end of an AK. So I say yes, in most cases it is OK. Many burglaries turn into rapes and murders and you never know when that can happen.

--------------------------
Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

[Channman 2]

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Shotguns are a better choice than handguns for home defense, IMO.

Depends on the situation. I have both.

I think I would have to agree with Kallend that a shotgun is the preferred weapon of choice when defending your home from the inside.

The right type of shell to use would be the question.

If you are defending, say your bedroom and you have taken a position on the otherside of your bed with the gun aimed at the door, buck shot or maybe a 4 shot would be ideal.

However if you have an intruder in the open with small children located in bedrooms on a opposite wall buck shot might not only kill the intruder but possibly one of the kids.

So I would choose a #4 shot for home defence for stoping power, but not enough power to plow through a wall with sheet rock on both sides, and if any pillets managed to travel through, hopefully have slowed enough not to cause serious injury.

A pistal on the other hand, can be deadly to family members in other rooms if the user misses.

[rehmwa 2]

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If you come into my house you will face the business end of an AK. So I say yes, in most cases it is OK. Many burglaries turn into rapes and murders and you never know when that can happen.

anyone that assumes a break in is solely for the purpose of stealing with no intent to harm - and NOT for the purpose of killing and raping your family - is not doing their loved ones any good

they break in, you HAVE to assume the worst and take deadly action to protect your family - if someone breaks into my home, at that moment, I'm defending the life of my daughter.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[pirana 0]

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Under Texas law, people may use deadly force to protect their own property or to stop arson, burglary, robbery, theft or criminal mischief at night.

Criminal mischief? Has anyone the foggiest idea what that mean?

In Texas? It probably means you can kill non-white people at will if they piss you off for any reason.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[normiss 851]

again...statements to remember:

"I was in fear for the life of my family and myself"
"I saw the person make a threatening move toward us"
"I fired in the direction of the threat"



Although I support Texas law...I think defending someone else's property a real stretch from defending someone else's life.

[rehmwa 2]

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In Texas? It probably means you can kill non-white people at will if they piss you off for any reason.

Do you not really feel like trying today?
That's weak, even for you.

(we are skiing this year. slopes to open a week or two after Thanksgiving)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rehmwa 2]

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again...statements to remember:

"I was in fear for the life of my family and myself"
"I saw the person make a threatening move toward us"
"I fired in the direction of the threat"

no winky icon needed - by the very act of criminally breaking into the house, these 3 are very true and real - though I do believe the 2nd 2 need to be more directly observe to take action. But how do you know he's not hiding a weapon and that waiting for "a threatening move" will just get your family killed while you watch..

"Firing in the direction of the threat" that's a really crappy statement. Like we were so hopelessly terrified that we covered our eyes and blindly shot in his general direction.

He broke in and I was in fear for my life and my family. He was threatening us. I did not fire in his direction - I CHOSE to fire directly at him to protect us from death or harm.


You comment about defending the neighbor's property is a good one, but tricky. My neighbor is a cop - if he sees someone breaking in my house - how is he to know if my house is empty or not. I'd hope he would act as if we were in the house and threatened.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[pirana 0]

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WTF

So it's ok to kill people for burglary now is it?

If you come into my house you will face the business end of an AK. So I say yes, in most cases it is OK. Many burglaries turn into rapes and murders and you never know when that can happen.

I got the impression they were running away well before he fired shots. He didn't shoot them because he was threatened - he shot them to keep them from getting away.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[pirana 0]

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In Texas? It probably means you can kill non-white people at will if they piss you off for any reason.

Do you not really feel like trying today?
That's weak, even for you.

(we are skiing this year. slopes to open a week or two after Thanksgiving)

It was a weak attempt, at humor.

EDIT: I think I heard on the radio, at least a week ago, that Taylor's Falls was already open. I know Trollhaugen was open last weekend - though I won't go there again.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[mnealtx 0]

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Under Texas law, people may use deadly force to protect their own property or to stop arson, burglary, robbery, theft or criminal mischief at night.

Criminal mischief? Has anyone the foggiest idea what that mean?

In Texas? It probably means you can kill non-white people at will if they piss you off for any reason.

Don't project YOUR fantasies on someone else, m'kay?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rehmwa 2]

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EDIT: I think I heard on the radio, at least a week ago, that Taylor's Falls was already open. I know Trollhaugen was open last weekend - though I won't go there again.

Welch installed full snowmaking capability. You know, due to global warming. We have memberships this year.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[freethefly 6]

Link to the 911 call.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/chronicle/5303222.html

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young