Organs to be taken without consent

[JohnRich 4]

News:

Organs to be taken without consent

Gordon Brown has thrown his weight behind a move to allow hospitals to take organs from dead patients without explicit consent.

The Prime Minister says that such a facility would save thousands of lives and that he hopes such a system can start this year.

The proposals would mean consent for organ donation after death would be automatically presumed, unless individuals had opted out of the national register or family members objected...

Full story: Telegraph

Does someone awaiting an organ transplant have the right to take your organs when you die without your permission?

[jakee 1,501]

Sounds like a damn good idea to me. I'd imagine that most people who aren't registered donors don't have any particular objection to transplants - they just haven't bothered to opt in.

Changing the system to "opt out" instead of "opt in" will increase the number of of eligible donors while still letting those who have a particular objaction to having their organs used (selfish bastards) withdraw their consent.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Muenkel 0]

I don't think it's such a bad idea since a large percentage of the population say they wish to donate their organs, but a much smaller percentage actually get around to stating it on their licenses or whatever documents.

It's also clear that an individual can make their wishes known ahead of time if they wish to opt out. The next of kin also can opt out for them.

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Chris

[diablopilot 2]

And suddenly Larry Niven's writings are a prelude to the future rather than fiction.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[diablopilot 2]

I think it's a fucking retarded idea, and it's a small step towards human rights violations.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[jakee 1,501]

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I think it's a fucking retarded idea, and it's a small step towards human rights violations.

Explanation?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Muenkel 0]

jakee,

Our posts at the exact same time and in full agreement with eachother just freaked me out a bit.

_________________________________________
Chris

[jakee 1,501]

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jakee,

Our posts at the exact same time and in full agreement with eachother just freaked me out a bit.

You've just crossed over into.... the Twilight Zone!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[labrys 0]

I think that a person's organs and other body parts belong to them exclusively unless they have given explicit consent to donate them.

Taking them without permission is a huge violation of rights.

I do agree that it would be helpful if more people took the time to register as organ donors, but I totally disagree with the idea that just because there is a shortage, it's okay for the government to assume consent.

Owned by Remi #?

[jakee 1,501]

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I think that a person's organs and other body parts belong to them exclusively unless they have given explicit consent to donate them.

Taking them without permission is a huge violation of rights.

Explanation?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[labrys 0]

Quote

I think it's a fucking retarded idea, and it's a small step towards human rights violations.

I think it's more of a huge step.

Owned by Remi #?

[diablopilot 2]

How long after this becomes common practice, does it become acceptable to harvest organs from convicted criminals on death row? Then how long till the crimes that warrent such a penalty become more and more benign?

10 years? 50? 100?......

Read some Niven and believe it.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[labrys 0]

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Explanation?

Not sure what you want more of an explanation of, but I'll elaborate.

The state has no more right to someone's body after they die than they do before they die. Free citizens of a state should not be required to register if they don't want to release their organs to the state.

The state should assume that someone retains their rights unless they explicity give them up.

Owned by Remi #?

[labrys 0]

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How long after this becomes common practice, does it become acceptable to harvest organs from convicted criminals on death row? Then how long till the crimes that warrent such a penalty become more and more benign?

I can't remember which US State it was, but no too long ago someplace was considering offering criminals reduced or commuted sentences if they donated organs. I think that idea was shot down pretty quickly.

Owned by Remi #?

[jakee 1,501]

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How long after this becomes common practice, does it become acceptable to harvest organs from convicted criminals on death row? Then how long till the crimes that warrent such a penalty become more and more benign?

That's retarded. What the hell does death row have to do with dead people in a hospital?

Do you have any direct objection to the issue of implied consent?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,501]

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Not sure what you want more of an explanation of, but I'll elaborate.

I'm looking for an explanation of your position based on logic and reasoning rther than just an emotional reaction.

Why is it a violation of rights? No is going to be forced to give consent, and no-one will be unable to withhold their consent. No-one is going to have to do anything that they don't want to do.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[diablopilot 2]

"Implied consent?"
Sounds like a term a Frat guy would use to justify having sex with a unconscious drunken freshman......


What makes you think you or anyone else has a right to another person's body?

Or are you a "right to lifer".

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[shropshire 0]

<>

No they dont and the government has no right to allow them either.

That said, I carry a donnor card - that's my choice - noone elses.

This PROPOSED change has yet to be debated but I'm against it.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[jakee 1,501]

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What makes you think you or anyone else has a right to another person's body?

I don't. No-one anywhere is going to have to let anything happen to their vacant lump of flesh that they don't want to happen to it. No-one will be forced to donate. Those that have an objection to donation will simply withold their consent - the only people who will be affected are those that don't give enough of a toss either way to tick a box on a form.

What's wrong with that?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[lawrocket 3]

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The proposals would mean consent for organ donation after death would be automatically presumed, unless individuals had opted out of the national register or family members objected...

In this sense, the law doesn't seem that bad. Instead of organ donation being "opt in" it is 'opt out."

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[jakee 1,501]

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No they dont and the government has no right to allow them either.

That said, I carry a donnor card - that's my choice - noone elses.

This PROPOSED change has yet to be debated but I'm against it.

Why?

It is your choice to carry a donor card, just as under the proposed changes it will be your (and everyone else's) choice to not give consent if they wish. No-one will be forced to donate.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Andy_Copland 0]

How about everyone is free to chop up unless someone has a card saying they dont want to be harvested?

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[shropshire 0]

<>

It's about positive choice. The government has no right to make those sort of choices for us.

People may be forced to donate, if they do not get around to opting out... but at the moment it's all just supposition.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Shotgun 1]

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Does someone awaiting an organ transplant have the right to take your organs when you die without your permission?

If you haven't opted out (and assuming that you have been made aware that you will be a donor unless you opt out), then you have basically given your permission.

I think this is a better way to do things than the current way. I think a lot of people wouldn't mind to be donors, but they don't care enough to make the effort.

[labrys 0]

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I'm looking for an explanation of your position based on logic and reasoning rther than just an emotional reaction.

Why is it a violation of rights? No is going to be forced to give consent, and no-one will be unable to withhold their consent. No-one is going to have to do anything that they don't want to do.

Please explain to me why you think my response is emotion driven? You're making an assumption there that just because I disagree with you I haven't thought it through.

Tell me how you're going to make sure everyone has the opportunity to explicitly retain rights? Are you going to go door to door with the paperwork or are you going to give everyone a ride to the office that handles the consent forms?

Are you going to require everyone to carry a card around that lists their consent? Are you going to assume that someone who happens to end up dead in a hospital without their card should lose their rights?

Here's one example. What about the person who's out for a walk one night and is unlucky enough to be robbed and murdered. No ID. Organs have to be harvested quickly. If we assume consent we may be taking organs from a person with very strong religious objections to donating organs.

Is this person shit out of luck because they happened to die without having "I am not an organ donor" tattooed on their forhead?

Our rights to our bodies should be ours unless explicitly released. And that means that some people who wanted to donate won't donate. That's the way it should be.

It's sad that people die for lack of available organs, but that's the way it is. Everyone dies someday. Some earlier than others.

Owned by Remi #?