Channman 2 #1 February 6, 2008 February 6, 2008 -- RUNNING as a conservative, John McCain rolled up huge victories last night in New York, New Jersey and beyond. But if history is any guide, the McCain we've seen of late on the campaign trail is the most conservative McCain we'll ever see. He has taken a commanding lead in the GOP primary by packaging himself as the "true conservative" committed to limited government, to slashed federal spending and to an avowedly conservative Supreme Court. He claims the mantle of Ronald Reagan. He even claims the mantle of Barry Goldwater, conservatism's crack version of Reagan. But as McCain clinches the GOP nomination, he will begin his usual leftward lurch. He will return to his lifelong positions as soft on illegal immigration, skeptical of tax cuts and favoring strong federal control over things like campaign financing. McCain's appeal to independents and even the left is what makes him such a powerhouse in the general election. It is also precisely what has so many in the Republican base so wildly fearful of handing him the keys to the kingdom. If the Republican Party expands "because we have a candidate who's going out trying to attract liberals by being like them, then the party's going to be around but you won't recognize it," thundered radio king Rush Limbaugh. The Republican Party will "be over as it exists now," he warns. To understand just how McCain has managed to limp to the front of the GOP field, look no further than the outcome of yesterday's West Virginia Republican Convention. At the outset, victory was in the air for Mitt Romney, the flip-flopping former Massachusetts governor. He is universally loathed by all the other GOP candidates, who banded together to give all their votes to Mike Huckabee - simply to deny Romney a win. The depressing GOP field that has paved a path to victory for McCain also gave surprising wins last night to Huckabee in Georgia, Alabama and Tennessee, as well as in his home state of Arkansas. Still, McCain has so radicalized key conservatives that some have vowed to turn themselves into suicide voters next November by pulling the lever for Hillary Rodham Clinton over him. This last-minute blitz against McCain by Limbaugh and others, however, comes far too late. But if those conservatives sit out the general election, they will help Democrats make history by electing either the first black president or the first female president next November. churt@nypost.com Note: As a former Texas Delegate I never thought I would see the day John McCain would receive the Republican Nomination for President. I've even said so many times within this forum. After watching last nights primary returns and seeing that the Dems base is fired up with turn out almost 3 to 1 when compared to the Republicans, left me laughing to myself. I said to myself, "Self", do I sit this one out or do I commit VOTER SUICIDE and cast a vote for Hillary. Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS History is in the making, Three Liberals Running for the presidency, (1) posing as a Rep. conservative, the other two most likely being the First Black man or Woman to represent the Free World. Cheers, This has been truely an amazing election period, that I can remember. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #2 February 6, 2008 "Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. I will vote for the Democrat and see if they can bring about all this "change" they have been promising.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Douva 0 #3 February 6, 2008 Quote February 6, 2008 -- RUNNING as a conservative, John McCain rolled up huge victories last night in New York, New Jersey and beyond. But if history is any guide, the McCain we've seen of late on the campaign trail is the most conservative McCain we'll ever see. He has taken a commanding lead in the GOP primary by packaging himself as the "true conservative" committed to limited government, to slashed federal spending and to an avowedly conservative Supreme Court. He claims the mantle of Ronald Reagan. He even claims the mantle of Barry Goldwater, conservatism's crack version of Reagan. But as McCain clinches the GOP nomination, he will begin his usual leftward lurch. He will return to his lifelong positions as soft on illegal immigration, skeptical of tax cuts and favoring strong federal control over things like campaign financing. McCain's appeal to independents and even the left is what makes him such a powerhouse in the general election. It is also precisely what has so many in the Republican base so wildly fearful of handing him the keys to the kingdom. If the Republican Party expands "because we have a candidate who's going out trying to attract liberals by being like them, then the party's going to be around but you won't recognize it," thundered radio king Rush Limbaugh. The Republican Party will "be over as it exists now," he warns. To understand just how McCain has managed to limp to the front of the GOP field, look no further than the outcome of yesterday's West Virginia Republican Convention. At the outset, victory was in the air for Mitt Romney, the flip-flopping former Massachusetts governor. He is universally loathed by all the other GOP candidates, who banded together to give all their votes to Mike Huckabee - simply to deny Romney a win. The depressing GOP field that has paved a path to victory for McCain also gave surprising wins last night to Huckabee in Georgia, Alabama and Tennessee, as well as in his home state of Arkansas. Still, McCain has so radicalized key conservatives that some have vowed to turn themselves into suicide voters next November by pulling the lever for Hillary Rodham Clinton over him. This last-minute blitz against McCain by Limbaugh and others, however, comes far too late. But if those conservatives sit out the general election, they will help Democrats make history by electing either the first black president or the first female president next November. churt@nypost.com Note: As a former Texas Delegate I never thought I would see the day John McCain would receive the Republican Nomination for President. I've even said so many times within this forum. After watching last nights primary returns and seeing that the Dems base is fired up with turn out almost 3 to 1 when compared to the Republicans, left me laughing to myself. I said to myself, "Self", do I sit this one out or do I commit VOTER SUICIDE and cast a vote for Hillary. Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBSHistory is in the making, Three Liberals Running for the presidency, (1) posing as a Rep. conservative, the other two most likely being the First Black man or Woman to represent the Free World. Cheers, This has been truely an amazing election period, that I can remember. As a former Texas Republican delegate alternate, I think the Republicans are going to get what they deserve for letting themselves get caught up in this anti-McCain fervor. They've let the neoconservative pundits make them so afraid of electing a moderate that they're going to elect an ultra-liberal instead. And who knows--Maybe that will be the best thing for everyone. Maybe electing the first black president or the first female president is an important enough step that we should all suck it up and endure four to eight years of an ultra-liberal administration. Heaven knows Obama or Clinton couldn't do any worse than than the fiscally irresponsible, socially neconservative Texas governor we elected seven years ago.I don't have an M.D. or a law degree. I have bachelor's in kicking ass and taking names. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #4 February 6, 2008 Quote"Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. I will vote for the Democrat and see if they can bring about all this "change" they have been promising. Don't think there aren't traditional Democrats who will similarly cross over to vote for McCain rather than vote for Hillary. Bush-Clinton-Clinton-Bush-Bush-Clinton is NOT "change". Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #5 February 6, 2008 QuoteQuote"Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. I will vote for the Democrat and see if they can bring about all this "change" they have been promising. Don't think there aren't traditional Democrats who will similarly cross over to vote for McCain rather than vote for Hillary. Bush-Clinton-Clinton-Bush-Bush-Clinton is NOT "change". Blues, Dave I agree with you. And when push came to shove I don't think I could vote for Hillary. I couldn't sleep at night if I did. Obama - maybe. I have never been a fan of McCain and I don't care for Huckabee either. I think Romney would have done a good job. He has been successful in the real world but he comes across as arrogant and many people shy away because of his religion, like it matters what religion any president is.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #6 February 6, 2008 the fiscally irresponsible, socially neconservative Texas governor we elected seven years ago. Yes, Bush is a disappointment on many levels. Spending being one of the primary ones in my book. Newt was someone I would have hoped would have run. This election feels as if Dole is running again. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #7 February 6, 2008 I'm hoping Paul runs as an indy...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #8 February 6, 2008 QuoteI'm hoping Paul runs as an indy... Ditto. Though I was a bit disheartened by the email I got a couple days ago asking me to contribute to his congressional re-election campaign as a "just in case". Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterblaster72 0 #9 February 6, 2008 Quote Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS As I was reading this post, I was thinking this, and then you said it yourself. Says a lot about you as a voter...you'll vote based on your hatred of liberals rather than make a compromise for someone who has a clear conservative record with some issues that you may disagree with. I see many posters here calling McCain a liberal, with nothing to back it up. Other than some of his bipartisan initiatives, what makes him so liberal? I have yet to see or hear a valid explanation. Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #10 February 6, 2008 With all the Dems who wont vote for Clinton and the Repubs who wont vote for McCain it is certainly looking like an interesting election. I think this really puts into relief just how divided the country really is. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #11 February 6, 2008 The comment was made to stir things up a bit. As for me voting for Hillary can't turely see myself tapping the button. But as a Conservative, can't tap the button for McCain, but I can tap out while crying UNCLE!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterblaster72 0 #12 February 6, 2008 QuoteBut as a Conservative, can't tap the button for McCain, but I can tap out while crying UNCLE!! Okay. I still have yet to see any valid explanation of how McCain is so far left as you and other "conservatives" say he is. Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #13 February 6, 2008 Quote The comment was made to stir things up a bit. As for me voting for Hillary can't turely see myself tapping the button. My guess is this is the same sentiment of Limbaugh and Coulter. I'm obviously politically-strategically naive as I just don't see the point. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #14 February 6, 2008 Quote Quote But as a Conservative, can't tap the button for McCain, but I can tap out while crying UNCLE!! Okay. I still have yet to see any valid explanation of how McCain is so far left as you and other "conservatives" say he is. Well let me get back to you on that because I've got to go and get some lunch and a Texas Lic Sticky Thing for my daughter's car. "Maybe it's because he looks Demish to me, could that be it....nonono that can't be it. Need to listen to RUSH more to find out what to say, yea he can lead me in the right direction" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #15 February 6, 2008 Quote Quote The comment was made to stir things up a bit. As for me voting for Hillary can't turely see myself tapping the button. My guess is this is the same sentiment of Limbaugh and Coulter. I'm obviously politically-strategically naive as I just don't see the point. Because if McCain wins, the soft-right faction of the GOP will regain lost prominence; if he loses the conservative right will likely clamp things down even further. The cynic would say he places health of the party the above health of the nation. This is a common affliction with those who live and breath partisan politics. The apologist would say he feels that in the long run, the country's health is directly linked with his version of party health. This attitude toward evangelical Christianity is easily transferred to evangelical Republicanism. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,106 #16 February 6, 2008 Quote"Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative . I bet you're proud of the things a conservative administration has done during the last 7 years. Record budget deficits, record trade deficit, spying on citizens without a warrant, imprisonment without trial, ruining the nation's image among our traditional allies, gagging government scientists, leading us into a quagmire of a war under false pretenses. IF I were "very conservative" (gag on the thought) I wouldn't advertise it on the internet.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #17 February 6, 2008 Quote I still have yet to see any valid explanation of how McCain is so far left as you and other "conservatives" say he is. Its a function of the Right.. being SO FAR to the RIGHT.. that anyone whi is not in lockstep with them is a...{OMG} SATANIC DAWN of the DEAD LIBERAL in their mind Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #18 February 6, 2008 QuoteQuote"Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative . I bet you're proud of the things a conservative administration has done during the last 7 years. Record budget deficits, record trade deficit, spying on citizens without a warrant, imprisonment without trial, ruining the nation's image among our traditional allies, gagging government scientists, leading us into a quagmire of a war under false pretenses. IF I were "very conservative" (gag on the thought) I wouldn't advertise it on the internet. Why not. Are you gonna beat me up? Just because Bush has been a disapponitment doesn't make me any less conservative. His performance has not impressed me and I am the first to admit it. Unlike some, I can admit when I have made a mistake. Im sure you have no first hand knowledge of those since perfection excludes you from such shortcomings.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #19 February 6, 2008 QuoteQuote"Casting a Vote for Hillary, seems to me the only answer, at least if everything goes to hell, I can blame it on the LIBS." I feel the same way. I am very conservative . I bet you're proud of the things a conservative administration has done during the last 7 years. Record budget deficits, record trade deficit, spying on citizens without a warrant, imprisonment without trial, ruining the nation's image among our traditional allies, gagging government scientists, leading us into a quagmire of a war under false pretenses. IF I were "very conservative" (gag on the thought) I wouldn't advertise it on the internet. What has Bush done that qualifies as "conservative"? Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterblaster72 0 #20 February 6, 2008 QuoteI am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. What is it about McCain that disqualifies him from your vote should he get the nomination? Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #21 February 6, 2008 QuoteQuoteI am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. What is it about McCain that disqualifies him from your vote should he get the nomination? 1. McCain - Feingold: nonsense legislation that prohibits free speech during campaigns. 2. His immigration policy which is basically non-existent. 3. His core beliefs change with the wind. In 1999 he was pro-choice and then that changed to pro-life in 2000. 4. In the past he called Roberts and Falwell agents of intolerance but now he is getting cozy with them so he can get support from the religious right. 5. He is just too moderate for my tastes. I also think he will leave the troops in Iraq. They need to be brought home. Iraq is turning into another Vietnam. There is no winning. The Iraqis need to get there house in order. We can't do it for them.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterblaster72 0 #22 February 6, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteI am very conservative but I will not vote for McCain if he gets the nomination. What is it about McCain that disqualifies him from your vote should he get the nomination? 1. McCain - Feingold: nonsense legislation that prohibits free speech during campaigns. 2. His immigration policy which is basically non-existent. 3. His core beliefs change with the wind. In 1999 he was pro-choice and then that changed to pro-life in 2000. 4. In the past he called Roberts and Falwell agents of intolerance but now he is getting cozy with them so he can get support from the religious right. 5. He is just too moderate for my tastes. I also think he will leave the troops in Iraq. They need to be brought home. Iraq is turning into another Vietnam. There is no winning. The Iraqis need to get there house in order. We can't do it for them. Thanks for your input. I think you summed it up best with your first sentence in item #5. Also, I find it interesting that you would follow up on that sentence with a rather moderate opinion on the Iraq war. I'd still like to hear from the other conservative die-hards why they consider McCain a liberal. Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 9 #23 February 6, 2008 QuoteWhat has Bush done that qualifies as "conservative"? Yeah, I agree. I thought the whole idea of Big, no, HUGE government was traditionally a Liberal idea? I'm a good conservative, and Frankly I think Bush is one of the bigger disappointments in my life.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #24 February 6, 2008 Quote I thought the whole idea of Big, no, HUGE government was traditionally a Liberal idea? Not any more - it's both a Democrat and Republican ideal. Just pick which set of predetermined social agendas you want someone else to pay for and vigorously and loudly support that side. Liberal and Conservative have no real meaning today. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ExAFO 0 #25 February 6, 2008 Here is the info needed to solve this dispute...Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
