America a dim-bulb nation

[lawrocket 3]

This article hits some pretty interesting points.

http://www.fresnobee.com/opinion/vision/story/433552.html

Set aside about 10 or 15 minutes to read it. In it, Susan Jacoby - the author of the new book "The Age of American Unreason" finds that American culture is anti-intellectual. That Americans, thanks to television and other entertainment opportunities, are becoming more dense.

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No wonder negative political ads work. "With text, it is even easy to keep track of differing levels of authority behind different pieces of information," the cultural critic Caleb Crain noted recently in the New Yorker. "A comparison of two video reports, on the other hand, is cumbersome. Forced to choose between conflicting stories on television, the viewer falls back on hunches, or on what he believed before he started watching."

And my favorite:

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That leads us to the third and final factor behind the new American dumbness: not lack of knowledge per se but arrogance about that lack of knowledge. The problem is not just the things we do not know (consider the one in five American adults who, according to the National Science Foundation, thinks the sun revolves around the Earth); it's the alarming number of Americans who have smugly concluded that they do not need to know such things in the first place. Call this anti-rationalism -- a syndrome that is particularly dangerous to our public institutions and discourse.

What she is saying is that Americans are ignorant about so many things that it is startling. Furthermore, we don't want to learn it because of our belief that it doesn't matter.

It's one of the reasons I like Speakers Corner. Guys like Billvon and Kallend provide explanations for things and a perspective that I did not see. I find myself wanting to figure out more about stuff that seemingly doesn't matter.

But it does.

Non-Euclidian geometry IS important. And you might want to just get an idea about how it works and why it is needed.

And, frankly, she's right. It is time to place a value on intellect and rationality.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Amazon 7]

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Set aside about 10 or 15 minutes to read it. In it, Susan Jacoby - the author of the new book "The Age of American Unreason" finds that American culture is anti-intellectual. That Americans, thanks to television and other entertainment opportunities, are becoming more dense.

Go rent the movie Idiocracy. It is where this nation is headed.

[kallend 2,030]

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The problem is not just the things we do not know (consider the one in five American adults who, according to the National Science Foundation, thinks the sun revolves around the Earth); it's the alarming number of Americans who have smugly concluded that they do not need to know such things in the first place. Call this anti-rationalism -- a syndrome that is particularly dangerous to our public institutions and discourse.

This is someting that bothers me increasingly; in my classes I see students who wish to become scientists and engineers, who have exactly that attitude towards knowledge that they see as not having a direct bearing on their career focus. As if anyone can predict now what scientific knowledge will be critical to society in 2030 when these people are in their forties. I don't recall seeing such an attitude to the same extent when I started teaching in the late '60s.

One of the best I've had was a student who tried to get out of a college writing class, claiming "I don't need it because I hate writing and I don't write well".

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[lawrocket 3]

Professor:

It's why I look back and say to myself, "I wish I would have taken a physics class." Or, "I wish that I had applied myself more in calculus."

There are so many things that I thought in the past were unimportant. EVERYTHING is important to somebody, and it'd be nice to know about that stuff.

I've told my wife that I would love to go back to school sometime and get an engineering degree - just to see if I could. Then I'd also consider myself to be more rounded.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[kschilk 0]

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I've told my wife that I would love to go back to school sometime and get an engineering degree - just to see if I could. Then I'd also consider myself to be more rounded.

Yeah, me too....I always wanted to drive a choo-choo, too! More meals at McDonalds, will take care of the "more rounded" part.

"T'was ever thus."

[kelpdiver 2]

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It's why I look back and say to myself, "I wish I would have taken a physics class." Or, "I wish that I had applied myself more in calculus."

There are so many things that I thought in the past were unimportant. EVERYTHING is important to somebody, and it'd be nice to know about that stuff.

I've told my wife that I would love to go back to school sometime and get an engineering degree - just to see if I could. Then I'd also consider myself to be more rounded.

hence the reason behind statements like youth is wasted. At the age you're supposed to be in college, you're still not mentally mature enough to fully benefit. The lessons from the writing class can take a few years to sink in - after you read a thousand crappy emails/memos and can't understand wtf was being said.

And at risk of letting the thread get rerailed, the GOP is driving this anti intellectualism right now. Bush dumbed himself down in 2000 to play the one of us outsiders, even as the son of Bush, a Yalie, and with no shortage of priviledge. Gore, otoh, was the smart ass know it all, following that hippie war protesting know it all, Clinton.

If Hillary manages to pull out the nomination, I suspect she would continue to be attacked from being the calculating cold thinking person, rather than a 'feeler.' McCain would be the seat of the pants guy acting on war honed instinct.

[KelliJ 0]

I think a lot of that can be traced back to the idea that people tend to write in a fashion that mimics what they read, i.e. trash in=trash out. A son of a friend of mine doesn't know a transient verb from a proper noun, yet he consistently gets perfect and near perfect scores on his college essays. I feel strongly that it is because he read a lot of the classics growing up and was kept away from tabloid crap.
With the advantages of computers comes the liability of easy entertainment. Kids are spend far too much time playing video games that do nothing more than challenge their adrenaline production (ok, so some may become ace pilots of unmanned aircraft someday). Add to that a culture that promotes poor language skills and you have a recipe for a knowledge base that is nonexistent. Without a good base in reading skills the ability to learn is only inhibited in all areas including mathematics. Without a good grasp of mathematics the sciences then become problematic. How can one expect a student to pass a basic physics class without so much as a passing comprehension of algebra and preferably calculus?
I know it will never happen, but keeping kids away from video games and tv until they reach the age of 10 or 12 would do wonders for the performance of our youth in higher education as well as when compared to their peers around the world.

[lawrocket 3]

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If Hillary manages to pull out the nomination, I suspect she would continue to be attacked from being the calculating cold thinking person, rather than a 'feeler.' McCain would be the seat of the pants guy acting on war honed instinct.

I can't see Hillary as the sort of person who would empower the intelligence of the people. The sense I get from her is, "Look. I know what is best for you. Not you. I won't waste my time explaining it."

Then you've got McCain, who will be on the lines of, "In my experience, this would be an error." Yes, a seat-of-his-pants tactician.

It was actually one of the things so endearing about Reagan. He was the "Great Communicator" because he explained himself to the American people.

FDR's "Fireside Chats" were the same thing. "Here's what's going on people."

Much of this takes some actual integrity. Bill Clinton was the master of the "trial balloon.

But the problem faced now by the real thinkers and explainers is "the soundbite." There's no way that Hillary Clinton can accurately explain what she wants to do in a soundbite. Ron Paul tried to explain, but he suffered the sin of Stockdale and Nixon - he looked bad on television.

This is why the interested people read about these things. But it takes time away from watching American Idol.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[ryoder 1,590]

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Ron Paul tried to explain, but he suffered the sin of Stockdale and Nixon - he looked bad on television.

Something interesting I've read more than once was that after the Nixon/Kennedy debates, the people who saw the debates believed Kennedy won, but the people who only heard the debates believed Nixon won.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[masterblaster72 0]

The American population is one of the most easily manipulated in the world. A big reason for that is because we're watching too much television, and taking what we see on there as gospel.

This thread has a similar theme.

Sad thing is, there's no change in sight.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[kallend 2,030]

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I know it will never happen, but keeping kids away from video games and tv until they reach the age of 10 or 12 would do wonders for the performance of our youth in higher education as well as when compared to their peers around the world.

Might help the obesity epidemic too!

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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Set aside about 10 or 15 minutes to read it.

Meh, I'll wait for the movie.

[skydyvr 0]

The results of liberal-minded education and parenting are upon us.

. . =(_8^(1)

[Zenister 0]

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There are so many things that I thought in the past were unimportant. EVERYTHING is important to somebody, and it'd be nice to know about that stuff.

despite the snears of many unenlightened, this is the value in a true 'liberal arts' education.

You are required to learn SOMETHING about EVERYTHING and then focus on whatever your specific field is...

the primary goal in education is/has always been to learn how to 'teach yourself' everything else you didn't learn while under direct tutelage.

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[Zenister 0]

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The results of liberal-minded education and parenting are upon us.

Wrong, the results of a lack of discipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason are upon us. "Liberal" does not mean what you believe it does, o matter how often the word is repeated in incorrect usage.

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[lawrocket 3]

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The results of liberal-minded education and parenting are upon us.

Wrong, the results of a lack of discipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason are upon us. "Liberal" does not mean what you believe it does, o matter how often the word is repeated in incorrect usage.

You may be wrong on this. Unfortunately, it takes on the meaning in its usage. "Discriminating" used to mean choosing, but now has a near universally negative connotation.

"Liberal" has been co-opted.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Zenister 0]

oh the terms (liberal and conservative) have certainly been degraded perhaps but the word he is looking for is

[ url http://www.answers.com/topic/liberalism]Liberalism[/url]
vs
Liberal

putting the political movement in place of the actual meaning is a sign of exactly what this article is complaining about..

I certainly would not want scientists who were trained in a strictly conservative manner or there would never be any progress at all.. and 5 out of 5 would still believe that the sun revolved around the earth...

'Discriminating' still means 'choosing', it is only through a myopic societal view that it has negative connotations. Which again is a sign of the declining ability in critical thought and education.

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[skydyvr 0]

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Wrong, the results of a lack of discipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason are upon us. "Liberal" does not mean what you believe it does, o matter how often the word is repeated in incorrect usage.

Well, I'll just be wrong in your eyes then.

To me, "liberal" describes the general political persuasion of the folks who've systematically removed "dicipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason" from our children's lives, both at home and at school.

. . =(_8^(1)

[Zenister 0]

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Wrong, the results of a lack of discipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason are upon us. "Liberal" does not mean what you believe it does, o matter how often the word is repeated in incorrect usage.

Well, I'll just be wrong in your eyes then.

To me, "liberal" describes the general political persuasion of the folks who've systematically removed "dicipline and respect for Rational Thought and Reason" from our children's lives, both at home and at school.

the irony is staggering...

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[skydyvr 0]

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putting the political movement in place of the actual meaning is a sign of exactly what this article is complaining about..

Nonsense. The meaning of words often change to fit the vernacular -- and that's among the least of our problems as a nation.

. . =(_8^(1)

[skydyvr 0]

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the irony is staggering...

And your punctuation still sucks.

Crappy punctuation just might be a sign of a dim-bulb nation.

. . =(_8^(1)

[Zenister 0]

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putting the political movement in place of the actual meaning is a sign of exactly what this article is complaining about..

Nonsense. The meaning of words often change to fit the vernacular -- and that's among the least of our problems as a nation.

using the wrong word and attempting to justify it as correct illustrates exactly what this article describes..

why bother to learn the correct terminology when repetition and arrogance will suffice?

the actual word you are looking for is "Liberalism" you even used it's definition in your defense of your incorrect usage of "Liberal" but hey keep proving the author's point for us, it is quite entertaining.

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That leads us to the third and final factor behind the new American dumbness: not lack of knowledge per se but arrogance about that lack of knowledge

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[Zenister 0]

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the irony is staggering...

And your punctuation still sucks.

Crappy punctuation just might be a sign of a dim-bulb nation.

actually I'm using the punctuation to amplify my meaning in a purely text based conversation.

Ellipsis are used to indicate that something is being left out, left unsaid. I could have expounded on exactly WHY your post was ironic however I tend to leave the deduction to the reader.

oh BTW reducing your rebuttal to an Ad Hominen attack indicates you have lost this argument.

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[skydyvr 0]

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the actual word you are looking for is "Liberalism"

I'm not looking for anything different than exactly what I wrote.

99.99% of the folks on this board will understand exactly the body of persons I'm pointing to when I use the term "liberal". Sorry you got a problem with it.

. . =(_8^(1)

[Zenister 0]

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the actual word you are looking for is "Liberalism"

I'm not looking for anything different than exactly what I wrote.

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That leads us to the third and final factor behind the new American dumbness: not lack of knowledge per se but arrogance about that lack of knowledge

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.