shropshire 0 #26 March 26, 2008 Are you trying to ban the Builders Uniform? How can one lay bricks without displaying the Builders Bum? You'll have the Unions after yous. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #27 March 26, 2008 Quote Quote And why are parents hands tied ... laws. And yet you want the government to pass another law. The goverment has taken virtually all parents rights away from them. So we have to turn to someone for help, because they have made it to where we cant help ourselves or take care of our own... Exactly, the government is trying to take control. We need to take control back. We don't do this buy letting the government create more laws ..."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mamajumps 0 #28 March 26, 2008 Quote Quote Quote And why are parents hands tied ... laws. And yet you want the government to pass another law. The goverment has taken virtually all parents rights away from them. So we have to turn to someone for help, because they have made it to where we cant help ourselves or take care of our own... Exactly, the government is trying to take control. We need to take control back. We don't do this buy letting the government create more laws ... Touche' So what do we do? I would love to get on the wagon to help get some of our rights back...but how? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #29 March 26, 2008 We could start by :- Ensuring that parents take control of their kids. Allow anyone to chastise kids without fear of prosecution. Teach and expect respect... don't let things slide - 0 tolerance on bad manners. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #30 March 26, 2008 QuoteEver think about respecting their freedom of expression? Probably not. Hopefully, you don't have kids yourself. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #31 March 26, 2008 QuoteQuoteEver think about respecting their freedom of expression? Probably not. Hopefully, you don't have kids yourself. Why?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #32 March 26, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteEver think about respecting their freedom of expression? Probably not. Hopefully, you don't have kids yourself. Why? Correct me if I'm wrong -- you believe parents should respect their kid's right to express themselves in the form of wearing saggy pants? . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mamajumps 0 #33 March 26, 2008 Quote We could start by :- Ensuring that parents take control of their kids. Allow anyone to chastise kids without fear of prosecution. Teach and expect respect... don't let things slide - 0 tolerance on bad manners. That is one of the things I am very consistant on. I always get compliments when I take them out in public on how well behaved they are... Im so proud of that! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #34 March 26, 2008 How would like to adopt 1.5 million British kids? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #35 March 26, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteEver think about respecting their freedom of expression? Probably not. Hopefully, you don't have kids yourself. Why? Correct me if I'm wrong -- you believe parents should respect their kid's right to express themselves in the form of wearing saggy pants? You're correct. What is wrong with wearing saggy pants? I believe that parents should focus less on a childs attire and more on a childs behaviour ..."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #36 March 26, 2008 Quote Quote Quote And why are parents hands tied ... laws. And yet you want the government to pass another law. The goverment has taken virtually all parents rights away from them. So we have to turn to someone for help, because they have made it to where we cant help ourselves or take care of our own... Exactly, the government is trying to take control. We need to take control back. We don't do this by letting the government create more laws ... The Libertarian argument in a nutshell! The same thing is true with economic matters: Metaphor: The government will break your legs, then hand you crutches & say "If it wasn't for us, you wouldn't be able to walk!" Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #37 March 26, 2008 I made this point in a similar thread about 4 or 5 months ago. If some lame brain is wearing baggy pants with his boxers hanging out police should be allowed to administer "tear inducing wedgies." The person receiving the wedgie is not allowed to resist. If he does he gets hauled in. I know this would never happen but it sure would be funny as hell and effective IMO. Who wnats to get a "tear inducing wedgie" in front of their posse?The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #38 March 26, 2008 Quote What is wrong with wearing saggy pants? Absolutely nothing if you enjoy waddling like a duck to keep them up along with telling the world "I'm an idiot". I do not think there should be laws against it, but definitely should not be allowed in public schools. Having said that, I think it's bad parenting to allow it at all because it may mean the kid is either in or courting the wrong crowd, although I'll admit that the phenomenon has become more "mainstream" now. My fiance is a director at a "boot camp" diversion program for kids -- last chance before jail -- so through her I've got an eye into just who's entering the program. Guess what, virtually all of them come from the saggy pants/exposed butt floss crowd! Every kid will find ways to say "I'm different" -- it's a normal part of establishing one's identity. But saggy pant syndrome is NOT a positive way to do that. Successful parents do not allow their kids to express themselves in negative ways -- or at least discourage it depending on the age of the kid. Quote I believe that parents should focus less on a childs attire and more on a childs behaviour ... In the case of saggy pants (and colors), the attire and the behavior seem to be very much intertwined. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mamajumps 0 #39 March 26, 2008 Quote Quote What is wrong with wearing saggy pants? Absolutely nothing if you enjoy waddling like a duck to keep them up along with telling the world "I'm an idiot". I do not think there should be laws against it, but definitely should not be allowed in public schools. Having said that, I think it's bad parenting to allow it at all because it may mean the kid is either in or courting the wrong crowd, although I'll admit that the phenomenon has become more "mainstream" now. My fiance is a director at a "boot camp" diversion program for kids -- last chance before jail -- so through her I've got an eye into just who's entering the program. Guess what, virtually all of them come from the saggy pants/exposed butt floss crowd! Every kid will find ways to say "I'm different" -- it's a normal part of establishing one's identity. But saggy pant syndrome is NOT a positive way to do that. Successful parents do not allow their kids to express themselves in negative ways -- or at least discourage it depending on the age of the kid. Quote I believe that parents should focus less on a childs attire and more on a childs behaviour ... In the case of saggy pants (and colors), the attire and the behavior seem to be very much intertwined. Well said!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #40 March 26, 2008 QuoteMy biggest problem with it, is the vast majority of older teens and young adults who dress that way, have the "gangsta" attitude and are the ones you see on the nightly news for breaking laws. I have to disagree. The simple fact is that it is fashion; it's been popular for too long to even consider it a fad. Personally, I think it looks terrible, and prefer my clothing to fit properly. However, I would be a fool to believe that the "vast majority" of the thousands of students I see on campus who can't seem to remember their waist size have a gangsta attitude or are going to end up "on the nightly news for breaking laws." I wonder what percentage of people under 25 who are arrested are arrested while wearing Nike shoes. I bet it's a significant proportion, although perhaps not a majority. Should we pass a law banning Nike shoes?Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #41 March 26, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteHopefully, you don't have kids yourself. Why? Correct me if I'm wrong -- you believe parents should respect their kid's right to express themselves in the form of wearing saggy pants? Parents have a limited number of battles they can fight with their kids. Beyond that, they lose credibility. That's not to say that parents have limited potential to influence their kids, just that there are only so many times "My way or the highway" is going to result in "My way." I have to question the parenting skills of someone who would waste a battle over fashion. It won't make any difference in ten years what a kid finds fashionable in high school, but making a big issue of it can create animosity between parent and child which only serves to make it more difficult to be a good parent when something that's actually important enough to take an active stand against comes up.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #42 March 26, 2008 QuoteMy biggest problem with it, is the vast majority of older teens and young adults who dress that way, have the "gangsta" attitude and are the ones you see on the nightly news for breaking laws. If it can be stopped in schools, so my younger kids can't look at it and think its cool then that is one less battle as a parent I have to fight. So, do you think a dress code will reduce crime? Different pants will lead to a lowered desire to be a punk? Secondly, you want the government to make your parenting job easier? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #43 March 26, 2008 QuoteI have to disagree. The simple fact is that it is fashion; it's been popular for too long to even consider it a fad. Personally, I think it looks terrible, and prefer my clothing to fit properly. However, I would be a fool to believe that the "vast majority" of the thousands of students I see on campus who can't seem to remember their waist size have a gangsta attitude or are going to end up "on the nightly news for breaking laws." I agree. I see lots of young guys at my school wearing the baggy pants, and I don't get the impression that most of them have a gangsta attitude. I took a tutor training class, and there was a guy in there whose butt was hanging out of his pants every day. He was a smart guy, 4.0 GPA, polite... But at my school I see a lot more female butt cracks and thongs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #44 March 26, 2008 QuoteParents have a limited number of battles they can fight with their kids. Beyond that, they lose credibility. That's not to say that parents have limited potential to influence their kids, just that there are only so many times "My way or the highway" is going to result in "My way." I read your other post on the subject too, and your points aren't invalid, but it really depends on the age of the kid. Prior to high school, a parent can and should "lay down the law" often. But once a certain age is reached, you're right -- the proper parenting role turns more towards guidance and support. We'll have to disagree that saggy pants syndrome is merely fashion. I see a LOT of high school kids in my area, and few of them display saggy pants. The ones that do also exhibit other troublesome behavior. But yea, for the majority, it's probably just a phase, but that doesn't mean parents shouldn't discourage it. I think overall, it IS a battle worth fighting from the parenting point of view. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #45 March 26, 2008 Quote Parents have a limited number of battles they can fight with their kids. Beyond that, they lose credibility. That's not to say that parents have limited potential to influence their kids, just that there are only so many times "My way or the highway" is going to result in "My way." I have to question the parenting skills of someone who would waste a battle over fashion. It won't make any difference in ten years what a kid finds fashionable in high school, but making a big issue of it can create animosity between parent and child which only serves to make it more difficult to be a good parent when something that's actually important enough to take an active stand against comes up. Three cheers!!! That was the best posting yet in this thread!!!"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,058 #46 March 26, 2008 > I would love to get on the wagon to help get some of our rights back...but how? Allow corporal punishment by parents. Rescind "zero tolerance" school laws. Involve parents directly in any disciplinary actions. Require their direct intervention with problem students. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,515 #47 March 26, 2008 Quote you believe parents should respect their kid's right to express themselves in the form of wearing saggy pants? My son is 24 now. He wore saggy pants, so saggy that he fell down when he tried to reach the bottom of his pocket once (funny ). He had a mohawk that he spiked a couple of times (had to sit sideways in the car -- more funny ). He wanted to dye his hair blue, and get a tattoo. His parents (that would be me and my ex-husband) talked about him regularly, and set limits that we were willing to have him challenge, so that he could learn the consequences naturally, instead of just taking our word for it. His experience is a stronger teacher than ours. We didn't expect him to be the same as either of us. He's 24 now. Gainfully employed, a college graduate with no college loans, and paying his car off at more than the loan rate. He paid for college himself (an annuity for the first 4 years that he stretched, and work the last couple -- scenic route). I couldn't be prouder of him. And yet he wore baggy pants. His T-shirts had holes in them. What did we do about the hair? Told him he had to try the temporary dye before he could bleach his hair for the stark color. Never got around to it. Tattoo/piercing? "As soon as you're 18 you're free to get one for yourself." Treat your kid with respect for their ability to learn, and give them the experiences and tools to make good decisions. That means practice making bad decisions sometimes. I don't think 1967 was either better or worse, just different. And I got sent home from school for wearing a maxi-skirt in 1969 (the school wasn't exactly fashion-forward). I think laws about clothing are stupid. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #48 March 26, 2008 I have to agree that we do not need the government telling us which fashions we can wear.. The real solution here would be to REPEAL whatever law it is that says we cant go up to said gangster wannabe and Staple his pants in place.(Actually it doesn’t really bother me. I kind of like it when Idiots make themselves so readily visible.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #49 March 26, 2008 "Here's my sign!" Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #50 March 26, 2008 Well, there ya go busting me for screetching too loudly in one way or the other, as usual. I realize the saggy pants thing isn't an automatic death sentence for a kid, but I do not like it. Maybe it's a regional thing, but where I am it's just not as common as it seems to be in other places, and like I said, the kids coming into my fiance's boot camp are mostly all saggy pants/exposed butt floss fans. It's the wierdest fad I've ever seen, and I wonder if it's been done before like the more common long hair/short hair or skirt length cycles. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
