Obama's Comments

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Why would a Christian say "...that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion...." Why put those in the same category? Most Christians I know "cling" to Christianity because we believe in it as a way of life, good times or bad. What do you think he means by "cling to guns.?" That they go out and shoot someone or commit gun crime? Those of you who say his remarks are the truth- I don't agree.

I believe it helps to remember his audience - San Francisco elite. "Latte Liberals" At some point in his speech, in order to pander for money, he had to bash religion and guns, and he picked a stupid way to do it.

He is proving himself an elitist, along the same lines as senator Kerry. More and more, though, he is proving himself a full blown Marxist.

I beleive you and I are on the same page. If I did not come across that way I am sorry.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[likearock 2]

Quote

Quote

What about the Rev Wright situation? Did that never concern you at all?

Never. You are allowed to have associations with people even if you don't agree with them. Besides, he can't be any worse of a fundie than Bush has been, and the very White Congress isn't going to let him do anything on such a platform.

Well, then you're not as much of an independent as I thought you were. The thing that most disturbs people who are outside of your two "camps" is not just the fact that his preacher uttered those bigoted statements and it's taken till now for Obama to resolutely condemn them. It's also the spectacle of all the people in the congregation who roundly cheered when he blamed all the world's troubles on white people and when he said 9/11 was "chickens coming home to roost". Sure, Obama has made it clear he condemns those remarks and would have spoken up had he been present during them. But up to now he has said very little about the sizable congregation who were there and were very much in favor of them.

That congregation was exhibiting the same kind of narrow-minded bigotry generated out of frustration as the bigotry Obama talks about in the disenfranchised areas of PA. And it's a fair perception on our part that if he only speaks out about the people affected by one wave of intolerance but not those affected by the other, Obama is condoning the bigotry he is quiet about.

I realize that the pundits have framed Obama's "clinging to religion" remarks as evidence of elitism and being out of touch. But there is a deeper reality to them that will have to be addressed at some point in time. By the way, he has just apologized for those remarks as I said he would.

It's not an easy message and he may not be able to get America's full confidence and attention until he's elected. But an open and honest debate on bigotry, free from the need to be politically correct, is essential if he's serious about healing the racial divide.

[TankBuster 0]

Quote

I beleive you and I are on the same page.

I know. My first post was pure sarcasm. I didn't realize the story was broken by Huffington. Good for them/her, but those comments would have been outed before long.

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[kallend 2,030]

Quote

Quote

I beleive you and I are on the same page.

I know.

"Dam"! There goes your credibility.

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors, grammatical errors, and gobbledygook you find on that page.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[nerdgirl 0]

Quote

Regardless of what you think, these are the kind of statements and positions that push MORE governemnt control. I believe if you are for freedoms you can not supprt these types of positions unles you are communist.

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN1131749320080411?feedType=RSS&feedName=politicsNews&rpc=22&sp=true

Quote

"Multimillion-dollar pay practices at the highest levels of corporate America have been an easy target for politicians as Americans reel from the mortgage and credit crises that have the U.S. economy teetering on the brink of an election-year recession.

"Clinton and Republican presidential candidate John McCain also have criticized big payouts for chief executive officers who benefit hugely even when their companies are struggling.

"'We've seen what happens when CEOs are paid for doing a job no matter how bad a job they're doing,' Obama said. 'We can't afford to postpone reform any longer.'

"The first-term Illinois senator has introduced 'say-on-pay' legislation that would give investors more of a voice in setting executive compensation packages.

.
.
.

"McCain spokesman Brian Rogers dismissed Obama's criticism, saying the legislation Obama was promoting was non-binding and would not cap or limit CEO pay and that 'it sounds like more typical Washington shenanigans than 'new politics of hope and change.'

"McCain, campaigning in Texas, said shareholders should be more active in determining executive pay but that the federal government should stay out of it."

Can anyone explain the potential impact(s) of “say-on-pay” requirements for corporate governance in a non-partisan (any side), non-pejorative way, including difference or similarities to current corporate governance regulations/laws/standards?

VR/Marg

[Edit to add: this appears to be another instance in which legislation, "Shareholder Act on Executive Compensation," has already passed the House (by 269-134 vote) and Sen Obama is sponsor of the Senate version.]

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

[TankBuster 0]

Kallend - are you saying I ever had any credibility with you? I'm almost flattered, in a very twisted way.

Quote

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors,...

And, because I love being a smartass, did you mis-spell "damn?"

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

I beleive you and I are on the same page.

I know. My first post was pure sarcasm. I didn't realize the story was broken by Huffington. Good for them/her, but those comments would have been outed before long.

I think she is a Clinton supporter

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

Quote

I beleive you and I are on the same page.

I know.

"Dam"! There goes your credibility.

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors, grammatical errors, and gobbledygook you find on that page.

Get to your bone cracker. You neck will feel better soon

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,030]

Quote

Kallend - are you saying I ever had any credibility with you? I'm almost flattered, in a very twisted way.

Quote

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors,...

And, because I love being a smartass, did you mis-spell "damn?"

You have NOT been paying attention, have you? You didn't notice the quotes ("") either.

Here's a hint.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Quote

Kallend - are you saying I ever had any credibility with you? I'm almost flattered, in a very twisted way.

Quote

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors,...

And, because I love being a smartass, did you mis-spell "damn?"

You have NOT been paying attention, have you? You didn't notice the quotes ("") either.

Here's a hint.

You are tuning into a stalker

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,030]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Kallend - are you saying I ever had any credibility with you? I'm almost flattered, in a very twisted way.

Quote

I hope you can deal with all the spelling errors,...

And, because I love being a smartass, did you mis-spell "damn?"

You have NOT been paying attention, have you? You didn't notice the quotes ("") either.

Here's a hint.

You are tuning into a stalker

Have you been taking malapropism lessons from G.W. Bush?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

.....then his opponents jump on him for being un-PC.

And aren't those the same people who typically cry out that they're sick of political correctness and how people need to be able to accept harsh truths?

[Channman 2]

Quote

Quote

Quote

FYI The definition of comunisim is government control.

You may want to consider refining your definition a bit. Our Founding Fathers felt the need to replace the Articles of Confederation because it did not give the central government sufficient control over the states. If we use your definition, the Constitution for The United States of America was written to usher in communism.

I'm reasonably certain that was not what you intended to imply.

He may want to refine it even more than that, given that a REAL communist society would have NO government. The definition of communism is nearly opposite that of government control. Makes me wonder who else might be suppressing communist tendencies.

linz

Tens of millions killed under communism. I say we give it another chance.

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Tens of millions killed under communism. I say we give it another chance.

tens of millions (perhaps hundreds) killed in WWII by facist/imperialist Germany and Japan. And if you don't want to label them as capitalist, then how about our muckings about in Latin America over the past few decades?

The commies don't have this area to themselves.

[SpeedRacer 1]

Fascism is a lot closer to socialism than to capitalism.

Speed Racer
--------------------------------------------------

[Amazon 7]

Except in the current usage in the 21st century.

[Zarkon 0]

I do think people 'cling' to their religion during a time of need, just the nature of things. I also agree that people often get bitter and blame others when they're in hard times. Of course his audience had something to do with it but IMO Obama is just keepin it real
Still doesn't have my vote though

[BikerBabe 0]

wow, a candidate that speaks truth and tells it like it is.

sounds like he's got another vote.

what a stupid bullshit thing to be arguing over. Stupid. Bullshit.

Never meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup!

[rehmwa 2]

He was pandering to an elitist crowd of those values.

What's surprising about that?

Put a politician in front of that crowd, and he'll nod and wink and make them feel superior by belittling the 'little' people. That's what they like.

Put him in front of a church crowd, and he'll talk about faith. That's what they like.

If he's talking to us, eventually he'll be praising the skydiving community and talking about how to support that. That's what we like.

I don't see anything different here than with Hillary or John or any of the batch of pres candidates in the last 20. Kerry was the worst at it, but they all did it to some extent.

It's nice to see Obama learning the ropes.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

Quote

wow, a candidate that speaks truth and tells it like it is.

sounds like he's got another vote.

what a stupid bullshit thing to be arguing over. Stupid. Bullshit.

Not sure where you are coming from but if this is your truth I feel sorry for you

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[idrankwhat 0]

I think your points are valid rehmwa but I'm still having trouble with the comments being considered "elitist". I don't see that at all. He was dead on accurate. I'm willing to bet that blue, light blue and many of the white collars that don't get dry cleaned every day are bitter and cynical at the current situation and are seeking refuge in whatever it is that makes them comfortable. Gas prices have tripled, food prices are up significantly, medical expenses are up, debt is up, equity is down, the stock market is spazzing out with each earning or expected earning report, we're in an expensive war with the wrong people which is straining our military and fiscal future, etc. There's not a lot of feel good news out there and people are going to rely on those things in their lives that give them comfort. For some it involves jumping out of planes (even at higher jump costs). For others it may involve mountain biking, unloading a few hundred rounds of ammunition on the weekends, going to church, or maybe just venting their angst in a public internet forum.
What I think is pathetic, but completely expected, is the feeding frenzy on the comments by Hillary and McCain. They're looking for any chink that they can exploit, hoping that it will be as vulnerable as an over driven microphone.
But one could argue that Hillary and McCain's comments are elitist. Obama is acknowledging the reality of the situation that most of us are in while the other two are simply trying to make the middle class folks feel good about themselves by giving them lip service praise on how important they are.
Politics is nasty stuff. I only hope that most people can see through the bullshit.

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

I think your points are valid rehmwa but I'm still having trouble with the comments being considered "elitist". ......

certainly that crowd is clinging to their need to feel superior to the little people by belittling their priorities - just because they are different - I'm sure it helps them get through their own little insecurities and gives them comfort

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

Quote

I think your points are valid rehmwa but I'm still having trouble with the comments being considered "elitist". ......

certainly that crowd is clinging to their need to feel superior to the little people by belittling their priorities - just because they are different - I'm sure it helps them get through their own little insecurities and gives them comfort

That description of "that crowd" sounds like a Nielsen profile of daytime TV watchers.

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

That description of "that crowd" sounds like a Nielsen profile of daytime TV watchers.

which crowd?

small town Americans?
effete liberal snobs?
environmentalists?
web posters?
daytime TV watchers?


I suspect Obama and the others VERY MUCH want to pander to that voting block also

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

which crowd?

small town Americans?
effete liberal snobs?
environmentalists?
web posters?
daytime TV watchers?

Yes, including elite conservative snobs and then some. I'd say that quite a few people out there cling "to their need to feel superior to the little people by belittling their priorities - just because they are different - I'm sure it helps them get through their own little insecurities and gives them comfort"

The only difference is in how "the little people" are defined.