shropshire 0 #76 April 20, 2008 QuoteQuote If God was real, I'd find out after I died. Why would he care at all if I think he exists while I'm alive? Am I hurting him in some way?*** Yes, Your spirit was created with a free will to commune with God. What? 2nd'd ...... WHAT? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #77 April 20, 2008 Quote ... Yes, Your spirit was created with a free will to commune with God. How would that work? Until today, such communication was a bit too unidirectional - I'm waiting for answers since I was a kid - or is that just a waiting loop I'm in?? dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #78 April 20, 2008 All of our Gods are busy at the moment. Please hold... your call is important to us..... (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #79 April 20, 2008 Quote All of our Gods are busy at the moment. Please hold... your call is important to us..... Right now I start to understand Vortexring a bit more, I owe him an exculpation dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tkhayes 348 #80 April 20, 2008 QuoteIf reality was that simplistic... who said anything about simplistic? Science makes no such claim Quotebut is has by no means even scratched the surface of the human spirit... take a look at anyone with a brain injury that has emotional/cognitive/rational/other changes because of it. It is science, not spirituality, which explains it. And yes, science too has a long way to go, I expect it is an endless search for knowledge since the deeper we dig, the more there will be to be explored. Science has done a pretty good job so far. religion is dogma that has been around for 2000 years, rarely changing even when the facts are obvious (the world is flat, you're a heretic, molesting young boys, crusades, corruption from obscene power, fear mongering). And you can be spiritual without being religious - or even Christian. You can have meaning in your life, and lead with moral and ethical values without ever having a religious/Christian/spiritual thought ever enter your brain. I have constructed a reality, as you say, without the slightest bit of input from "God's Word" TK Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #81 April 20, 2008 Quote Quote All of our Gods are busy at the moment. Please hold... your call is important to us..... Right now I start to understand Vortexring a bit more, I owe him an exculpation What can I say? Apart from "toadyer!" 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #82 April 20, 2008 Theology makes for interesting discussions. If anything can be taken from this, then for me it wouldn't be so much the problems organized religions have caused; but more the good that's came from them. I sometimes wonder if everything is becoming shit these days because people now chose to ignore the moral templates religions give to a society. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,500 #83 April 20, 2008 QuoteIf anything can be taken from this, then for me it wouldn't be so much the problems organized religions have caused; but more the good that's came from them. Like? QuoteI sometimes wonder if everything is becoming shit these days because people now chose to ignore the moral templates religions give to a society. No.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #84 April 20, 2008 Like the moral template the 10 commandments provide. It's moral guidance whether you're a Christian or not. If it's lack of religion causing society to take a downward turn then what's the primary cause/s? For the record, I think there are far more aspects to societies continual downward trends than religion. But I still believe it's a factor. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #85 April 20, 2008 But isn't that exactly what religion is about... Control. Now, get rid of the magic crap and you have a decent modern framework. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #86 April 20, 2008 Yeah, but that's where man has been wrong in his application of religion, it doesn't necessarily mean all religion is 'wrong'. Misused, certainly. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #87 April 20, 2008 I can't go with that because Religion is defined by the belief in a supernatural power... which to my mind, at least, is bollocks. QuoteBelief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #88 April 20, 2008 Well, fair enough mate, I've certainly had doubts myself. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #89 April 20, 2008 But I do like the holidays and Christmas cake 'n' stuff. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,500 #90 April 20, 2008 QuoteLike the moral template the 10 commandments provide. It's moral guidance whether you're a Christian or not. Leaving aside the fact that the first four are completely pointless and the final one sounds like advocating lack of ambition, d'you really think that people wouldn't know that the others are wrong if a bloke in a hat didn't tell them so? "Well I was about to run you over, fuck your wife and steal your TV, but the vicar told me not to." QuoteIf it's lack of religion causing society to take a downward turn then what's the primary cause/s? Eh? It's your hypothesis, you tell me.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #91 April 20, 2008 Nonetheless it still provides a moral template whilst your normal Christianity helps and tries to prevent the continual demoralisation we see in Britian today. I have little critiscism for organisations which are geared towards preventing social breakdown. Which are ultimately geared towards bringing about the common good. So it's a bit more than your example of people simply needing a bloke in a hat to tell them simple things are wrong. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 2 #92 April 20, 2008 QuoteQuoteThen why wouldn't he be nice to you regardless of whether or not you are convinced by his book? If I continue to keep bailing one of my children out of jail for breaking laws, then WHAT is it that I am teaching that child? If we continue to act, speak out that He does not EXSIST, then how is He suppose to be a Father to us, as a teacher, a guide in our lives. How can HE be "nice" to me if I or others do not or will not believe in He? Why not? Lots of human benefactors prefer to remain anonymous. Are you suggesting that God is not up to their level of selflessness? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,030 #93 April 20, 2008 Quote It isn't my goal in this thread to make a case for the existence of God. That's good, because no proof exists, you'd be wasting your time.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,030 #94 April 20, 2008 Quote If God was real, I'd find out after I died. Why would he care at all if I think he exists while I'm alive? Am I hurting him in some way?*** Yes, Your spirit was created with a free will to commune with God. _______________________________ Which one? So much choice! And the objective evidence for the existence of any one of them is identical to the evidence for the Judeo-Christian god, which is to say, zero. Aphrodite Apollo Ares Artemis Athena Demeter Dionysus Hephaestus Hera Hermes Poseidon Zeus LOKI ODIN THOR FREYA RAGNAROK BALDUR ASGARD TYR HEL Maheshwara Siva, Sankara, Nataraja, Rudra, Parameshwara, Ishwara, Hara, Shambhu Vishnu Narayana, Hari, Narasimha, Narahari, Vittala, Panduranga, Venkateshwara Krishna Keshav, Madhava, Govinda, Sridhar, Vasudeva, Shyam, Murari, Giridhar, Gopal, Murali, Venu, Giridhar Vinayaka Ganapati, Vighneshwara, Ganesha, Gajanana Shanmukha Muruga, Subrahmanya, Kumaraswami Parvati Uma, Chandi, Kali, Durga, Bhavani, Annapurna, Shakti, Jagadamba, Ishwari, Shyamala Personally I find Loki rather compelling.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #95 April 20, 2008 Quote Quote Quote All of our Gods are busy at the moment. Please hold... your call is important to us..... Right now I start to understand Vortexring a bit more, I owe him an exculpation What can I say? Apart from "toadyer!" What? Toady? Me? Never. . . . (Tea, Sir, as usual at 5 o'clock? Served along with the cucumber sandwich and the Financial Times?....and a wee dram a bit later?) dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #96 April 20, 2008 Quote Which one? So much choice! .... LOKI ODIN THOR FREYA RAGNAROK BALDUR ASGARD TYR HEL ..... Why are all the Nordics in capital letters? dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #97 April 20, 2008 In fact; might be more appropriate. I meant 'toadyer' as a slang term for 'told you'. Figured that one would have you scurrying off to the dictionary.Sorry! 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,030 #98 April 20, 2008 Quote Quote Which one? So much choice! .... LOKI ODIN THOR FREYA RAGNAROK BALDUR ASGARD TYR HEL ..... Why are all the Nordics in capital letters? Well, you definitely don't want to get on the wrong side of those guys.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #99 April 20, 2008 Quote And you can be spiritual without being religious - or even Christian. You can have meaning in your life, and lead with moral and ethical values without ever having a religious/Christian/spiritual thought ever enter your brain. EXACTLY !!! Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #100 April 20, 2008 No worries - learning something new on dizzidotcom keeps my old brain coils fresh and lissom ..... dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
