You/your s/o's fetus tests positive for Down Syndrome - Do you abort?

[klingeme 1]

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What newborn baby can exist outside of the uterus without assistance (Food, water, shelter), and if this is the case, is throwing a newborn in a dumpster considered abortion?

Most of 'em can and do.

Are you saying that a (most) baby can survive without someone suppling it with food, shelter, and water?

[crozby 0]

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Out of all the millions of abortions that have been performed, I wonder how many lives we have snuffed out that would have contributed so much beauty to this world.

Conversely if there were a bunch more abortions maybe the world would not have had to suffer at the hands of Adolf Hitler or George Bush...

[chuteless 1]

First, let me tell you that no one has been praying for a Downs Syndrome baby. You are taking things out of context.

To be sure, a Downs baby IS a lot more work, and requires more care and attention. My Lindsay had open heart surgery before she was 6 months old. She has two large scars, one from her neck to her waist, and another from hip to hip. No doubt, they need much more attention, but the extra work and care is well worth it for the rewards one gets from such a child.

And yes, she has been teased by other children and terrible remarks made to her mother by adults.

My daughter Crystal said that if she knew that she was going to have a Downs baby, she would have one immediately. I understand where she is coming from, for the rewards of such a child are beyond measure.

For your average healthy child, they too can be a burden. They grow up eating fast foods and like the average American child, they become overweight, and are more likely to have major health problems.

A Downs child will almost for sure, never come home drunk, with a tattoo, or steal from a store. They are much less likely to follow the crowd and smoke, take drugs, and curse with a foul mouth like one sees from " adults" using these forums.

That says much for a Downs child. They are pure innocence, and full of love....more so that your average person. You cannot know how much unless you've been exposed to them.

I do not put her above my other grandchildren...because they have been taught to realize that Lindsay is special and needs special considerations. I love them all, but Lindsay gets priority because of her needs.

It is not MY ineptness in debating, but the intolerance of those who do not have any experience with a Downs child giving inlavlid information.

You too, have taken things out of context as I have just pointed out.

In my opinion, Lindsay is the most beautiful child ( person) I have ever known. She just lights up my life, and I am grateful to God for sending her along to be a part of my life.

[Lindsey 0]

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What newborn baby can exist outside of the uterus without assistance (Food, water, shelter), and if this is the case, is throwing a newborn in a dumpster considered abortion?

Most of 'em can and do.

Are you saying that a (most) baby can survive without someone suppling it with food, shelter, and water?

Being self-sufficient and being able to survive outside the uterus are very different. I'm talking about the latter while you're talking about the former. I doubt many people use "being able to provide for your own food, shelter, and clothing" as an acceptable benchmark for how far along in a pregnancy a woman should have the choice to terminate the pregnancy. But if that's the case in your mind, it only makes the whole issue less cut and dry.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[klingeme 1]

I was using your words in my analagy. You said "For some, whether there is ability to live on it own outside the mother's uterus. "

What newborn can meet this standard. by the sound of it, you can kill a 7 year old and it's still abortion.

[Nightingale 0]

I'm not going to tell anyone else what to do, but abortion isn't for me. I wouldn't have an abortion unless my life was in danger or the fetus was non-viable (anencephalic, etc...).

[Lindsey 0]

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I was using your words in my analagy. You said "For some, whether there is ability to live on it own outside the mother's uterus. "

What newborn can meet this standard. by the sound of it, you can kill a 7 year old and it's still abortion.

I'll try to be more specific in my wording in the future so as not to allow for these kinds of loopholes. I BET you weren't that confused about what I meant.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[klingeme 1]

OK , What about a child born premature that needs to spend a week or two on a ventilator ? Cutting them to pieces OK (because that is what an abortion is after all, tear em up and grab the vacuum cleaner)?


edited to clarify "tearing them to pieces"

[Lindsey 0]

My personal belief is that after the first trimester it's too late for an abortion.

BUT different people have different opinions about the issue. That's where the whole "there's a HUGE grey area" comment comes into play.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[peregrinerose 0]

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My daughter Crystal said that if she knew that she was going to have a Downs baby, she would have one immediately. I understand where she is coming from, for the rewards of such a child are beyond measure.

Words are easy to SAY. If she truly meant this, she'd be adopting a child with Downs out of the foster system... there are a LOT of them out there.

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[PLFXpert 0]

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If she truly meant this, she'd be adopting a child with Downs out of the foster system... there are a LOT of them out there.

Yes, someone start a "You/your s/o's fetus tests positive for Down Syndrome-Do you give up for adoption?" thread.

It'd be fun to examine the juxtaposition of abortion/adoption opinions for qualitative/quantitative analysis.

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[lisamariewillbe 1]

As far as the grey area I meant this perticular question, I think I know what I would have done but unless in this situation I dont know. I also understand that abortion is something I cant control in the rest of the world and that I have to have a level of acceptence and try to understand why others may feel that its best.

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[chuteless 1]

Pic 1: My Lindsay, the biggest blessing in my 76 years of life

Pic 2: Bampa and Lindsay

Pic 3: Lindsay gets several birthdays each year when she comes to Bampa's house. Her birthday is in March, but she enjoys them so much, Bampa keeps a wrapped present and buys a cake anytime she wants a birthday... so she gets several each year to make her happy.

Pic 4: Lindsay talks to Bampa on the phone, telling him her Aunt Crystal is a rascal. Its a little joke between us three, but Lindsay gets a real thrill in kidding her Aunt.

[Conundrum 1]

I can certainly appreciate your love for "your Lindsay", but you making it seem like she's more of a "blessing" than any other kid is getting old.

[chuteless 1]

If I can persuade one person not to abort a Downs child, then it been worth it.

Isnt that why you posted the thread inthe first place???

[Vallerina 2]

I probably would abort the fetus.

There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning

[mfrese 0]

***I can certainly appreciate your love for "your Lindsay", but you making it seem like she's more of a "blessing" than any other kid is getting old.***

I would never argue that one child is any more of a blessing than another, but "blessings" are sometimes hard to define.

My niece just turned 17. She was born with with a herniated diaphragm, and needed emergency surgery to correct it. She is developmentally disabled (aka: retarded), has very little hearing due to multiple congenital birth defects, nearly died from acute appendicitis three years ago, and has had roughly 25 surgeries to correct problems with her eyes, ears, and throat, and facial reconstruction surgery to correct jaw alignment. She suffers from Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, and has been raised most of her life by my elderly parents, who still have custody of her. My sister is back in her life after 10 years of sobriety.

I have spent most of the last 17 years helping raise her, and I'd have to say the biggest blessing for me has been the changes I went through. I used to be a short-tempered, suffer-no-fool-gladly asshole, and helping raise Tavara has given me a gift of patience and understanding that I would never have found without her in my life. She is smart (knows and remembers animals better than most zoology students, and that's a quote from a zoology student), funny, a huge San Jose Sharks fan, wants to marry a Jonas Brother (God help us all), and can swim and boogie board as well as her uncle. She and all of us may have been spared a lot of pain and suffering if they hadn't found that herniated diaphragm in time, but I'm pretty fucking glad they did. Her survival changed my life for the better, and all the love and caring we share is really just the icing on the cake after that.

Of course, the other nieces I have on my side of the family are: another 17-year-old on probation for drug possession and assault, and a 12-year-old who is so spoiled her unemployed dad borrows money from his dad to fly her cross-country for concerts and Disney tweener meet-n-greets. Maybe Tavara just seems cool by comparison.

Doctor I ain't gonna die,
Just write me an alibi! ---- Lemmy/Slash

[Conundrum 1]

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Isnt that why you posted the thread inthe first place???

To persuade people to not have abortions? No, that was not the purpose of this thread.

[chuteless 1]

Well done....I am so glad that you can see beauty and a blessing where many others don't.