falxori 0 #426 January 7, 2009 Quote First its not a card you actully have Jews only roads not all isrelis arab or jewish welcome but jews only roads. yes, in the west bank, roads leading to israeli villages. just like the roads to palestinian towns and the town itself is closed for me. and again, its not jewish or not jewish, its Israeli citizens Vs. palestinians. Quote Can Hamas even afford uniforms? Or do they have to chose between weapons to fight with or uniforms? thanks to your buddies in Iran they have enough funds, and yes, if they can affords tons of expolsives and thousands of rockets, they can afford uniforms. here's a new idea, instead of buying explosives, buy food and medical supplies... Quote And what would happen if they did have uniforms? Israel would kill them all. yes, that's what armies who are fighting do. the whole idea of uniforms and seperation is that soldiers get hurt and not civilians. you basically admit that Hamas uses civilians as shields. Quote You and other Zionists believe they have some magical claim to the land, no magical, well founded, proved and very real. Quote Those people were from all religions*** so is Israelis today, about 25% non jews (Muslim, Christians and Druze mostly). "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #427 January 7, 2009 Quote Quote So called innocents Kids are always innocents, there's no so called about it. Even the ones with the bomb belts? LinkMike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #428 January 7, 2009 Quote Quote So called innocents Kids are always innocents, there's no so called about it. Tell that to Omar Khadr. He has been in Gitmo since he was fifteen. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #429 January 7, 2009 Quote Quote So called innocents Kids are always innocents, there's no so called about it. Recall, we execute them here, especially in Texas. And rightfully so in many cases. Teenagers that commit adult crimes can and should be treated as adults. If you define kid as something like 10 and under, or 12 and under, I'm inclined to agree with you on innocence, but then their parents and their government bear responsibility, as I discussed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #430 January 7, 2009 Being in Gitmo proves he's guilty of fuck all. Gitmo is a travesty (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #431 January 7, 2009 Quote Quote Quote So called innocents Kids are always innocents, there's no so called about it. Even the ones with the bomb belts? Link Mike, those kids are being used... the tile says it all "THE ULTIMATE CHILD ABUSE". Evil people, truly evil people are responsible not the kids, surely you can see that? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #432 January 7, 2009 Quote Being in Gitmo proves he's guilty of fuck all. Gitmo is a travesty He is guilty (victim) of being a child soldier. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #433 January 7, 2009 This whole thread has become ridiculous. There needs to be a clear winner in this conflict. The sooner, the better.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,063 #434 January 8, 2009 >There needs to be a clear winner in this conflict. Then stop all aid to Israel. There will rapidly be a clear winner. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #435 January 8, 2009 Quote >There needs to be a clear winner in this conflict. Then stop all aid to Israel. There will rapidly be a clear winner. the cockroaches? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #436 January 8, 2009 Darius, I'd still like an answer: 1) What was Hamas trying to accomplish by launching those rockets in December? they must have known that eventually Israel would retaliate, so what was the logic behind it? Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #437 January 8, 2009 just in... Quote JERUSALEM (CNN) -- Four rockets struck northern Israel from Lebanon on Thursday, wounding two people, Israeli police and emergency medical services said. maybe Darius can justify this unprovoked attack from Lebanon? "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeryde13 0 #438 January 8, 2009 "Think how every move you make will effect your Family 7 generations from now" hagakure . On the surface it seems like we're( israelis by proxi ) sockin it to Hamas and everybody with high tech weapons and such .... In the game a chess the saying goes" when you see a good move, look for a better one". "You've never lived until you have something to die for" What if we are being played by our fear of death and comfort in our cushy lifestyle? we can push buttons and blow things up and reduce casualties on our side .... for 10-20 years more maybe ... but what's the end game? Turn off the tv , use your God given intellect, and evolve! I prey for us.... Peace to all_________________________________________ people see me as a challenge to their balance Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #439 January 8, 2009 Quote Then stop all aid to Israel. There will rapidly be a clear winner. At this point in time, that doesn't sound unreasonable to me.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #440 January 8, 2009 Quote This whole thread has become ridiculous... You Called?What's need NOW is for the UN to assemble a crack team of British Airport Baggage Handlers to insert into the region. We put handlers from Heathrow into the Gaza Tunnels and see how Hamas gets on after their munitions have been routed to Aberystwyth. Meanwhile, Prestwick Baggage Handlers get at the munitions being flown from US to Israel. They'll mix it up with the stuff Scots bring back from America and we get to watch a Gaza School being flattened with 2,000 cartons of Marlboro Lights. Just a thjought.Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #441 January 8, 2009 Doesn't sound unreasonable to me We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #442 January 8, 2009 Quote Quote First its not a card you actully have Jews only roads not all isrelis arab or jewish welcome but jews only roads. yes, in the west bank, roads leading to israeli villages illegal Israeli settlements. just like the roads to palestinian towns and the town itself is closed for me. and again, its not jewish or not jewish, its Israeli citizens settlers Vs. palestinians. Above edited for clarification. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #443 January 8, 2009 Quote illegal Israeli settlements. a matter of opinion. but, Darius' claim was that the reasoning was racial. my point is that there are places were Palestinians are not allowed and there are places where Israelis are not allowed, following lots and lots of terror attacks on these roads. debating again whether Israel has a right to settle in the west bank won't get us anywhere. my claim is that it has. although they (or most of) will probably be removed in a future agreement, like the ones in Gaza were (not that that helped in any way, as we can see now...) "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #444 January 8, 2009 Quote just in... Quote JERUSALEM (CNN) -- Four rockets struck northern Israel from Lebanon on Thursday, wounding two people, Israeli police and emergency medical services said. maybe Darius can justify this unprovoked attack from Lebanon? I'm not trying to justify the attack but if it came from Palestinians in Lebanon should it be considered "unprovoked"? Considering the heavy handed nature of the Israeli incursion into Gaza over the last couple of weeks, I think that it's awfully disingenuous to label attacks on Israel as "unprovoked". This goes to the heart of the problem that I have with this conflict. Israel facilitates a serious humanitarian crisis in Gaza after it pulls its settlers out and Hamas is elected. It continues the land grab in the West Bank (directly in opposition to International law and official US policy). The IDF turns a mostly blind eye to the settler violence against the WB Palestinians and is frequently a participant in such violence. Israel cripples both Gaza and West Bank agriculture and trade operations and occasionally steals financial aid meant for the Palestinians. And the IDF runs daily mock air raids over Lebanon, although I'm not certain that the last one is any longer a valid claim over the last year or so. In light of all that, the notion that any action against Israel could be considered "unprovoked" just simply makes no sense to me, regardless of how many times it's portrayed as such here in the US media. And again, for all of you with binary vision, I DO NOT approve of Hamas' tactics. My point is and has been that Israel is NOT an innocent victim. Both parties need to be held accountable. When we here in the US supply $billions in aid per year, espouse an official policy against certain Israeli actions, and then refuse to hold them accountable for breaching that policy, then I think we are doing nothing more than fanning the fires of the conflict. Humanitarian crisis aside, it's counterproductive for Israel's as well as our own security. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #445 January 8, 2009 Quote if it came from Palestinians in Lebanon should it be considered "unprovoked"? yes. Lebanon is a sovereign country. It has signed the cease fire agreement in 2006, promising that its army will take control of southern Lebanon (together with UN troops) so Hezbollah and the others would not be able to continue doing what caused the 2006 war (and yes, the killing and kidnapping of soldiers across the border and rocket attacks then were unprovoked as well). I dont care who fired these rockets. they came from a sovereign country's land and the goverenment there is responsible. "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #446 January 8, 2009 Quote Quote illegal Israeli settlements. a matter of opinion. And that's why there's a problem. And the West bank separation issue may not be simply race based, however it does meet the definition of apartheid when taken out of a South African context. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #447 January 8, 2009 Quote Quote if it came from Palestinians in Lebanon should it be considered "unprovoked"? yes. Lebanon is a sovereign country. It has signed the cease fire agreement in 2006, promising that its army will take control of southern Lebanon (together with UN troops) so Hezbollah and the others would not be able to continue doing what caused the 2006 war (and yes, the killing and kidnapping of soldiers across the border and rocket attacks then were unprovoked as well). I dont care who fired these rockets. they came from a sovereign country's land and the goverenment there is responsible. Whether or not a government is responsible for responding to the attacks is a separate issue from provocation. And I take issue with the half of the story you referenced regarding the war 2 years ago but that's already been expressed in this forum. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #448 January 8, 2009 Quote Quote Quote Bullcrap. Israel doesn't DELIBERATELY target civilians - Hamas does. Israel doesn't use innocents as human shields - Hamas does. Perspective That does not make my statement untrue. I stumbled across this one today and I thought I'd share it with you in case you missed it. Meanwhile, Amnesty International accused both sides of using civilians as human shields. "Israeli soldiers have entered and taken up positions in a number of Palestinian homes, forcing families to stay in a ground floor room while they use the rest of their house as a military base and sniper position," it said in a statement. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7817926.stm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #449 January 8, 2009 Quote Can Hamas even afford uniforms? Or do they have to chose between weapons to fight with or uniforms? And what would happen if they did have uniforms? Israel would kill them all. Israel has assassinated officials, and ignored the democratically elected hamas what do you expect Hamas to do? Now the bullshit is getting deep... That is the lamest excuse yet Darius..Of course if they wore uniforms they would get killed.. ITS A FUCKING WAR Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vortexring 0 #450 January 8, 2009 Quote 1) What was Hamas trying to accomplish by launching those rockets in December? they must have known that eventually Israel would retaliate, so what was the logic behind it? "It is true that Israel has put up with the rockets from Gaza for a long time. But it may have been able to stop the rockets another way. For it is not quite true that Israel’s only demand in respect of Gaza has been for quiet along the border. Israel has also been trying to undermine Hamas by clamping an economic blockade on Gaza, while boosting the economy of the West Bank, where the Palestinians’ more pliant secular movement, Fatah, holds sway. Even during the now-lapsed truce, Israel prevented all but a trickle of humanitarian aid from entering the strip. So although Israel was provoked, Hamas can claim that it was provoked too. If Israel had ended the blockade, Hamas may have renewed the truce. Indeed, on one reading of its motives, Hamas resumed fire to force Israel into a new truce on terms that would include opening the border." Source: The Economist 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.' Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
