marks2065 0 #26 March 4, 2009 Quote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. Those that employ and spend the most will be finding ways to show less income to reduce the tax burden and will save more of their money in tax free acounts rather than pay the increased tax. this alone will cause a huge problem in the working sector by reduction of goods bought and people employed. these things will cause Obama's plan to be temporary and ultimately fail and leave us with a huge debt to pay. Just as in FDR's new deal. And just because you get $13. a week back in tax relief doesn't mean you are saving. The cap and trade will greatly increase our cost of heat, electric, and gas far more than $13. a week. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Capt.Slog 0 #27 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Capt.Slog 0 #28 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #29 March 4, 2009 QuoteNew RNC chairman Michael Steele had the audacity of saying that Rush Limbaugh was just "an entertainer", for which he then almost immediately had to issue a public apology. Steele has now been publicly humiliated and emasculated by this. (Don't take my word for it - if you have any doubt, Google: "Steele + Limbaugh + ("humiliation" or "humiliated") [within past week]". I got about 8,550 hits. I also got 235 hits for "Steele + Limbaugh + ("emasculate" or "emasculated" or "emasculation") [within past week]". ) So the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party?[/reply Oh come on... lay off the GOP.... will ya. The Grand Ole Poofters are feeling the need for some love in their tight little closets..... Lush Rimjob is just the man for them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #30 March 4, 2009 >It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Yes. And indeed that is its purpose - to bring short term relief to the economy to shorten a depression. >Obama is working on raising taxes . . . Taxes, on average, are going down, by hundreds of billions of dollars. He may have a secret plan that only you are privy to, but somehow I doubt it. >Those that employ and spend the most will be finding ways to show less >income to reduce the tax burden and will save more of their money in tax free >acounts rather than pay the increased tax. Uh, they've been doing that for 50 years. > these things will cause Obama's plan to be temporary and ultimately fail >and leave us with a huge debt to pay. Yep. That's the problem with tax cuts, whether they are Bush's or Obama's. We are now seeing the huge debt that we have to pay back to pay for Bush's tax cuts - we will have a similar bill to pay for these. (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #31 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. I simply said I couldn't decide who it was. I'll tell you one thing, to me it's perfectly clear that SOMEBODY gave Steele a talking to. If it's not the PNAC, then it's certainly somebody else with a LOT of power somewhere in the background. Certainly somebody is pulling Steele's strings to where he's willing to castrate himself and bow to Limbaugh now.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #32 March 4, 2009 I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #33 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. The majority? How is that even possible if Democrats have about half of the country and the non-"conservative wing of the (Republican) party" has some other percentage greater than zero?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #34 March 4, 2009 (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote I don't think we need tax cuts right now we need everyone to pay a fair percentage, including those that make less than 50k a year. I don't believe in welfare and everyone needs to pay a percentage, not get back money they didn't pay in. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #35 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? QuoteI don't want to pay any but I am willing to pay as long as everyone, including those that make less than 50k pay a fair percentage also. If the people making less than 50k don't have to pay and get money sent to them in the form of welfare why do I have to pay?Who is being discriminated against now? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #36 March 4, 2009 the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #37 March 4, 2009 >I don't think we need tax cuts right now . . . Fair enough! >e need everyone to pay a fair percentage . . . I agree there. The question is - what's fair? If we did an equal income tax percentage across the board sufficient to pay our expenses, it would require everyone to pay about 42% of their total salary to the government. That, to me, would cripple the economy, and would result in a LOT of sub-$50K a year losing their homes. (Numbers - current tax bracket for family making $45k a year - 15% Flat tax percentage - 42% Difference per year - $12,150) So it makes sense to me to have those lower income people pay a lower percentage. Not because they deserve it or we should 'equalize' everyone but because we hit the economy too hard if we do the flat tax thing. (I do agree that they shouldn't go 'negative' and get money back via tax credits.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #38 March 4, 2009 QuoteConservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. It's just that you had said "the conservative wing of the party." And you were talking specifically about the Republicans at that time. Could you link the poll you're talking about?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #39 March 4, 2009 http://www.tarrance.com/bg.cfm"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #40 March 4, 2009 Yeah, I've been there. I can't find this "Question 28" you were talking about.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #41 March 4, 2009 I am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #42 March 4, 2009 Ok I am not sure why 28 stuck in my mind. After some looking is it qustion D3 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=Battleground+poll+D3"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #43 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #44 March 4, 2009 Quote Quote I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #45 March 4, 2009 Quote the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. Bah...you're just afraid to admit that a sizable portion of those 60% now consider the Democrats to be less liberal than the Republicans. Personally, I'd call myself somewhat conservative (moderate on some issues, quite conservative on others). I also voted for Obama. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #46 March 4, 2009 QuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #47 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms. Nothing new at all in his "speak". He is a treat to the libs because he can speak very well to the "principals" of the conservatism that has made this country great. That is why he is lied about so often. (this site is a great example of this) The left is trying to demonize the word. But basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. You sir are re-defining. The word in the political world has not changed. Just like liberal. And then there are the funniest two words ever, moderate and progressive. Those two words have been stolen to try and take the sting out of what liberalism and the label of being liberal are. And while on this. Do you happen to see the difference in the how Obama is being looked at in his first months vs Bush? The left and the media were mad because he did what he said he was going to do. Today, the left is mad because Obama seems to have lied to them. The uber left because he has moderated many of his positions and the conservative left, which think he is going too far. I see hope again. A few weeks ago I really wondered where we were headed. I still do wonder, but I am not nearly as worried....."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #48 March 4, 2009 QuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_Statesquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #49 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States wiki will change no mind......... and the US IS what we are talking about."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #50 March 4, 2009 I'm not suggesting you need to take a course in political science or anything, but it wouldn't hurt.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 2 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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Capt.Slog 0 #27 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Capt.Slog 0 #28 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #29 March 4, 2009 QuoteNew RNC chairman Michael Steele had the audacity of saying that Rush Limbaugh was just "an entertainer", for which he then almost immediately had to issue a public apology. Steele has now been publicly humiliated and emasculated by this. (Don't take my word for it - if you have any doubt, Google: "Steele + Limbaugh + ("humiliation" or "humiliated") [within past week]". I got about 8,550 hits. I also got 235 hits for "Steele + Limbaugh + ("emasculate" or "emasculated" or "emasculation") [within past week]". ) So the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party?[/reply Oh come on... lay off the GOP.... will ya. The Grand Ole Poofters are feeling the need for some love in their tight little closets..... Lush Rimjob is just the man for them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #30 March 4, 2009 >It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Yes. And indeed that is its purpose - to bring short term relief to the economy to shorten a depression. >Obama is working on raising taxes . . . Taxes, on average, are going down, by hundreds of billions of dollars. He may have a secret plan that only you are privy to, but somehow I doubt it. >Those that employ and spend the most will be finding ways to show less >income to reduce the tax burden and will save more of their money in tax free >acounts rather than pay the increased tax. Uh, they've been doing that for 50 years. > these things will cause Obama's plan to be temporary and ultimately fail >and leave us with a huge debt to pay. Yep. That's the problem with tax cuts, whether they are Bush's or Obama's. We are now seeing the huge debt that we have to pay back to pay for Bush's tax cuts - we will have a similar bill to pay for these. (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #31 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. I simply said I couldn't decide who it was. I'll tell you one thing, to me it's perfectly clear that SOMEBODY gave Steele a talking to. If it's not the PNAC, then it's certainly somebody else with a LOT of power somewhere in the background. Certainly somebody is pulling Steele's strings to where he's willing to castrate himself and bow to Limbaugh now.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #32 March 4, 2009 I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #33 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. The majority? How is that even possible if Democrats have about half of the country and the non-"conservative wing of the (Republican) party" has some other percentage greater than zero?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #34 March 4, 2009 (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote I don't think we need tax cuts right now we need everyone to pay a fair percentage, including those that make less than 50k a year. I don't believe in welfare and everyone needs to pay a percentage, not get back money they didn't pay in. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #35 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? QuoteI don't want to pay any but I am willing to pay as long as everyone, including those that make less than 50k pay a fair percentage also. If the people making less than 50k don't have to pay and get money sent to them in the form of welfare why do I have to pay?Who is being discriminated against now? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #36 March 4, 2009 the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #37 March 4, 2009 >I don't think we need tax cuts right now . . . Fair enough! >e need everyone to pay a fair percentage . . . I agree there. The question is - what's fair? If we did an equal income tax percentage across the board sufficient to pay our expenses, it would require everyone to pay about 42% of their total salary to the government. That, to me, would cripple the economy, and would result in a LOT of sub-$50K a year losing their homes. (Numbers - current tax bracket for family making $45k a year - 15% Flat tax percentage - 42% Difference per year - $12,150) So it makes sense to me to have those lower income people pay a lower percentage. Not because they deserve it or we should 'equalize' everyone but because we hit the economy too hard if we do the flat tax thing. (I do agree that they shouldn't go 'negative' and get money back via tax credits.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #38 March 4, 2009 QuoteConservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. It's just that you had said "the conservative wing of the party." And you were talking specifically about the Republicans at that time. Could you link the poll you're talking about?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #39 March 4, 2009 http://www.tarrance.com/bg.cfm"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #40 March 4, 2009 Yeah, I've been there. I can't find this "Question 28" you were talking about.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #41 March 4, 2009 I am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #42 March 4, 2009 Ok I am not sure why 28 stuck in my mind. After some looking is it qustion D3 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=Battleground+poll+D3"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #43 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #44 March 4, 2009 Quote Quote I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #45 March 4, 2009 Quote the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. Bah...you're just afraid to admit that a sizable portion of those 60% now consider the Democrats to be less liberal than the Republicans. Personally, I'd call myself somewhat conservative (moderate on some issues, quite conservative on others). I also voted for Obama. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #46 March 4, 2009 QuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #47 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms. Nothing new at all in his "speak". He is a treat to the libs because he can speak very well to the "principals" of the conservatism that has made this country great. That is why he is lied about so often. (this site is a great example of this) The left is trying to demonize the word. But basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. You sir are re-defining. The word in the political world has not changed. Just like liberal. And then there are the funniest two words ever, moderate and progressive. Those two words have been stolen to try and take the sting out of what liberalism and the label of being liberal are. And while on this. Do you happen to see the difference in the how Obama is being looked at in his first months vs Bush? The left and the media were mad because he did what he said he was going to do. Today, the left is mad because Obama seems to have lied to them. The uber left because he has moderated many of his positions and the conservative left, which think he is going too far. I see hope again. A few weeks ago I really wondered where we were headed. I still do wonder, but I am not nearly as worried....."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #48 March 4, 2009 QuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_Statesquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #49 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States wiki will change no mind......... and the US IS what we are talking about."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #50 March 4, 2009 I'm not suggesting you need to take a course in political science or anything, but it wouldn't hurt.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 2 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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Amazon 7 #29 March 4, 2009 QuoteNew RNC chairman Michael Steele had the audacity of saying that Rush Limbaugh was just "an entertainer", for which he then almost immediately had to issue a public apology. Steele has now been publicly humiliated and emasculated by this. (Don't take my word for it - if you have any doubt, Google: "Steele + Limbaugh + ("humiliation" or "humiliated") [within past week]". I got about 8,550 hits. I also got 235 hits for "Steele + Limbaugh + ("emasculate" or "emasculated" or "emasculation") [within past week]". ) So the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party?[/reply Oh come on... lay off the GOP.... will ya. The Grand Ole Poofters are feeling the need for some love in their tight little closets..... Lush Rimjob is just the man for them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #30 March 4, 2009 >It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Yes. And indeed that is its purpose - to bring short term relief to the economy to shorten a depression. >Obama is working on raising taxes . . . Taxes, on average, are going down, by hundreds of billions of dollars. He may have a secret plan that only you are privy to, but somehow I doubt it. >Those that employ and spend the most will be finding ways to show less >income to reduce the tax burden and will save more of their money in tax free >acounts rather than pay the increased tax. Uh, they've been doing that for 50 years. > these things will cause Obama's plan to be temporary and ultimately fail >and leave us with a huge debt to pay. Yep. That's the problem with tax cuts, whether they are Bush's or Obama's. We are now seeing the huge debt that we have to pay back to pay for Bush's tax cuts - we will have a similar bill to pay for these. (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #31 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. I simply said I couldn't decide who it was. I'll tell you one thing, to me it's perfectly clear that SOMEBODY gave Steele a talking to. If it's not the PNAC, then it's certainly somebody else with a LOT of power somewhere in the background. Certainly somebody is pulling Steele's strings to where he's willing to castrate himself and bow to Limbaugh now.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #32 March 4, 2009 I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #33 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. The majority? How is that even possible if Democrats have about half of the country and the non-"conservative wing of the (Republican) party" has some other percentage greater than zero?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #34 March 4, 2009 (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote I don't think we need tax cuts right now we need everyone to pay a fair percentage, including those that make less than 50k a year. I don't believe in welfare and everyone needs to pay a percentage, not get back money they didn't pay in. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #35 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? QuoteI don't want to pay any but I am willing to pay as long as everyone, including those that make less than 50k pay a fair percentage also. If the people making less than 50k don't have to pay and get money sent to them in the form of welfare why do I have to pay?Who is being discriminated against now? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #36 March 4, 2009 the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #37 March 4, 2009 >I don't think we need tax cuts right now . . . Fair enough! >e need everyone to pay a fair percentage . . . I agree there. The question is - what's fair? If we did an equal income tax percentage across the board sufficient to pay our expenses, it would require everyone to pay about 42% of their total salary to the government. That, to me, would cripple the economy, and would result in a LOT of sub-$50K a year losing their homes. (Numbers - current tax bracket for family making $45k a year - 15% Flat tax percentage - 42% Difference per year - $12,150) So it makes sense to me to have those lower income people pay a lower percentage. Not because they deserve it or we should 'equalize' everyone but because we hit the economy too hard if we do the flat tax thing. (I do agree that they shouldn't go 'negative' and get money back via tax credits.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #38 March 4, 2009 QuoteConservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. It's just that you had said "the conservative wing of the party." And you were talking specifically about the Republicans at that time. Could you link the poll you're talking about?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #39 March 4, 2009 http://www.tarrance.com/bg.cfm"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #40 March 4, 2009 Yeah, I've been there. I can't find this "Question 28" you were talking about.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #41 March 4, 2009 I am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #42 March 4, 2009 Ok I am not sure why 28 stuck in my mind. After some looking is it qustion D3 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=Battleground+poll+D3"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #43 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #44 March 4, 2009 Quote Quote I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #45 March 4, 2009 Quote the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. Bah...you're just afraid to admit that a sizable portion of those 60% now consider the Democrats to be less liberal than the Republicans. Personally, I'd call myself somewhat conservative (moderate on some issues, quite conservative on others). I also voted for Obama. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #46 March 4, 2009 QuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #47 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms. Nothing new at all in his "speak". He is a treat to the libs because he can speak very well to the "principals" of the conservatism that has made this country great. That is why he is lied about so often. (this site is a great example of this) The left is trying to demonize the word. But basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. You sir are re-defining. The word in the political world has not changed. Just like liberal. And then there are the funniest two words ever, moderate and progressive. Those two words have been stolen to try and take the sting out of what liberalism and the label of being liberal are. And while on this. Do you happen to see the difference in the how Obama is being looked at in his first months vs Bush? The left and the media were mad because he did what he said he was going to do. Today, the left is mad because Obama seems to have lied to them. The uber left because he has moderated many of his positions and the conservative left, which think he is going too far. I see hope again. A few weeks ago I really wondered where we were headed. I still do wonder, but I am not nearly as worried....."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #48 March 4, 2009 QuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_Statesquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #49 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States wiki will change no mind......... and the US IS what we are talking about."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #50 March 4, 2009 I'm not suggesting you need to take a course in political science or anything, but it wouldn't hurt.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 2 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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billvon 2,998 #30 March 4, 2009 >It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Yes. And indeed that is its purpose - to bring short term relief to the economy to shorten a depression. >Obama is working on raising taxes . . . Taxes, on average, are going down, by hundreds of billions of dollars. He may have a secret plan that only you are privy to, but somehow I doubt it. >Those that employ and spend the most will be finding ways to show less >income to reduce the tax burden and will save more of their money in tax free >acounts rather than pay the increased tax. Uh, they've been doing that for 50 years. > these things will cause Obama's plan to be temporary and ultimately fail >and leave us with a huge debt to pay. Yep. That's the problem with tax cuts, whether they are Bush's or Obama's. We are now seeing the huge debt that we have to pay back to pay for Bush's tax cuts - we will have a similar bill to pay for these. (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #31 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteSo the question is: who is/are the REAL leadership of the GOP today? And what does it mean for the Republican Party? I can't decide if the PNAC is still "in charge" or not. Certainly it's not actually Limbaugh, but clearly there is some sort of struggle going on at the very top between the wealthy backers of the Republican Party and the people that want to be the "face" of it. I respectfully disagree. There is no clear Republican vision right now, and no obvious leader EXCEPT the talk show hosts, of which Rush is the clear leader. That Rush is an entertainer and a joke (unlike Reagan who was an entertainer but not a joke) says a lot about the state of the party. PNAC is no longer in charge, and deserves most of the blame for the dismal state of the GOP. I simply said I couldn't decide who it was. I'll tell you one thing, to me it's perfectly clear that SOMEBODY gave Steele a talking to. If it's not the PNAC, then it's certainly somebody else with a LOT of power somewhere in the background. Certainly somebody is pulling Steele's strings to where he's willing to castrate himself and bow to Limbaugh now.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #32 March 4, 2009 I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #33 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. The majority? How is that even possible if Democrats have about half of the country and the non-"conservative wing of the (Republican) party" has some other percentage greater than zero?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #34 March 4, 2009 (Careful, though! You are getting dangerously close to objecting to tax cuts. They take away your GOP card if you do that!) Quote I don't think we need tax cuts right now we need everyone to pay a fair percentage, including those that make less than 50k a year. I don't believe in welfare and everyone needs to pay a percentage, not get back money they didn't pay in. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #35 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuote>I want the US to grow and prosper, but this bill will not help us and alot of >Americans know this. The bill will almost certainly reduce the time it takes the economy to recover. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending will put more money into the consumer economy, and we are primarily a consumer economy. Quote It will give a very short and a very small amount of relief. Obama is working on raising taxes on the ones that already pay more than their fair share and they are cutting back already by lay offs, reduced benifits to employees, and less donations because of the economy. . Who said that only business owners are the ones that pay their fair share (as your statement clearly implies)? How is "fair" defined? By how much YOU want to pay? QuoteI don't want to pay any but I am willing to pay as long as everyone, including those that make less than 50k pay a fair percentage also. If the people making less than 50k don't have to pay and get money sent to them in the form of welfare why do I have to pay?Who is being discriminated against now? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #36 March 4, 2009 the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,998 #37 March 4, 2009 >I don't think we need tax cuts right now . . . Fair enough! >e need everyone to pay a fair percentage . . . I agree there. The question is - what's fair? If we did an equal income tax percentage across the board sufficient to pay our expenses, it would require everyone to pay about 42% of their total salary to the government. That, to me, would cripple the economy, and would result in a LOT of sub-$50K a year losing their homes. (Numbers - current tax bracket for family making $45k a year - 15% Flat tax percentage - 42% Difference per year - $12,150) So it makes sense to me to have those lower income people pay a lower percentage. Not because they deserve it or we should 'equalize' everyone but because we hit the economy too hard if we do the flat tax thing. (I do agree that they shouldn't go 'negative' and get money back via tax credits.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #38 March 4, 2009 QuoteConservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. It's just that you had said "the conservative wing of the party." And you were talking specifically about the Republicans at that time. Could you link the poll you're talking about?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #39 March 4, 2009 http://www.tarrance.com/bg.cfm"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #40 March 4, 2009 Yeah, I've been there. I can't find this "Question 28" you were talking about.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #41 March 4, 2009 I am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #42 March 4, 2009 Ok I am not sure why 28 stuck in my mind. After some looking is it qustion D3 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=Battleground+poll+D3"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #43 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #44 March 4, 2009 Quote Quote I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #45 March 4, 2009 Quote the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. Bah...you're just afraid to admit that a sizable portion of those 60% now consider the Democrats to be less liberal than the Republicans. Personally, I'd call myself somewhat conservative (moderate on some issues, quite conservative on others). I also voted for Obama. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #46 March 4, 2009 QuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #47 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms. Nothing new at all in his "speak". He is a treat to the libs because he can speak very well to the "principals" of the conservatism that has made this country great. That is why he is lied about so often. (this site is a great example of this) The left is trying to demonize the word. But basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. You sir are re-defining. The word in the political world has not changed. Just like liberal. And then there are the funniest two words ever, moderate and progressive. Those two words have been stolen to try and take the sting out of what liberalism and the label of being liberal are. And while on this. Do you happen to see the difference in the how Obama is being looked at in his first months vs Bush? The left and the media were mad because he did what he said he was going to do. Today, the left is mad because Obama seems to have lied to them. The uber left because he has moderated many of his positions and the conservative left, which think he is going too far. I see hope again. A few weeks ago I really wondered where we were headed. I still do wonder, but I am not nearly as worried....."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #48 March 4, 2009 QuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_Statesquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rushmc 23 #49 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States wiki will change no mind......... and the US IS what we are talking about."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #50 March 4, 2009 I'm not suggesting you need to take a course in political science or anything, but it wouldn't hurt.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 2 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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rushmc 23 #36 March 4, 2009 the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,998 #37 March 4, 2009 >I don't think we need tax cuts right now . . . Fair enough! >e need everyone to pay a fair percentage . . . I agree there. The question is - what's fair? If we did an equal income tax percentage across the board sufficient to pay our expenses, it would require everyone to pay about 42% of their total salary to the government. That, to me, would cripple the economy, and would result in a LOT of sub-$50K a year losing their homes. (Numbers - current tax bracket for family making $45k a year - 15% Flat tax percentage - 42% Difference per year - $12,150) So it makes sense to me to have those lower income people pay a lower percentage. Not because they deserve it or we should 'equalize' everyone but because we hit the economy too hard if we do the flat tax thing. (I do agree that they shouldn't go 'negative' and get money back via tax credits.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #38 March 4, 2009 QuoteConservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. It's just that you had said "the conservative wing of the party." And you were talking specifically about the Republicans at that time. Could you link the poll you're talking about?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #39 March 4, 2009 http://www.tarrance.com/bg.cfm"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #40 March 4, 2009 Yeah, I've been there. I can't find this "Question 28" you were talking about.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #41 March 4, 2009 I am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #42 March 4, 2009 Ok I am not sure why 28 stuck in my mind. After some looking is it qustion D3 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=Battleground+poll+D3"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #43 March 4, 2009 QuoteI wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #44 March 4, 2009 Quote Quote I wish he was. But no, he is not. He is however energizing (with Obama/Emanuel help) the conservative wing of the party. The majority of this country. Rush doesn't lead the conservatives, he leads those who live soundbite to soundbite. Those who think for themselves recognize him for what he is, an entertaining blowhard. The same is true of Coulter and Franken. Blues, Dave "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #45 March 4, 2009 Quote the Battle Ground Poll, question 28. Go back as far as that poll has been run and look at the results. Not talking about voting or anything like that. This group only comes out for trully great leaders like one president did a while back. Should another one come forward, they will be elected with number setting records as did the last one.... Conservatives. not repbulicans, are the the majority group in this conuntry. Bah...you're just afraid to admit that a sizable portion of those 60% now consider the Democrats to be less liberal than the Republicans. Personally, I'd call myself somewhat conservative (moderate on some issues, quite conservative on others). I also voted for Obama. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #46 March 4, 2009 QuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #47 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteI am still looking for the question by question but until one of us finds it... http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_battleground_poll_60_of_americans_describe_themselves_as_conservative/ And do you think that, getting back to the topic of this thread, you believe that the people that call themselves "conservative Democrats" are represented by the ideals talked about by say "conservative Republicans"? I think the question, as discussed in the article (not poll) you linked is far too broad. I think that the word "conservative" means different things to different people and the word "liberal" has been maligned so much, specifically by Limbaugh, it too has lost its traditional meaning. I would go so far as to say that Limbaugh has reached the "new speak" goal of redefining the language here and that most people have no idea what they're actually talking about when they use the terms. Nothing new at all in his "speak". He is a treat to the libs because he can speak very well to the "principals" of the conservatism that has made this country great. That is why he is lied about so often. (this site is a great example of this) The left is trying to demonize the word. But basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. You sir are re-defining. The word in the political world has not changed. Just like liberal. And then there are the funniest two words ever, moderate and progressive. Those two words have been stolen to try and take the sting out of what liberalism and the label of being liberal are. And while on this. Do you happen to see the difference in the how Obama is being looked at in his first months vs Bush? The left and the media were mad because he did what he said he was going to do. Today, the left is mad because Obama seems to have lied to them. The uber left because he has moderated many of his positions and the conservative left, which think he is going too far. I see hope again. A few weeks ago I really wondered where we were headed. I still do wonder, but I am not nearly as worried....."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #48 March 4, 2009 QuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_Statesquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #49 March 4, 2009 QuoteQuoteBut basicaly a conservative is someone who beleive more in the people and less in the government. Which means smaller government. less regulation, less taxation, more self reliance, being responcible for your actions and on and on. No. It doesn't. Not even if you just limit the discusion to what the word means in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States wiki will change no mind......... and the US IS what we are talking about."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #50 March 4, 2009 I'm not suggesting you need to take a course in political science or anything, but it wouldn't hurt.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
