For the socialized medicine bunch

[chuckakers 425]

Interesting. Even with a rise in the amount of folks having trouble with medical bills, it seems the truth is far from B.O.'s words. Anything to get "reform" accept by the lemmings, I guess.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenumbers/2009/03/medical-bankrup.html

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[dreamdancer 0]

if you don't want to have trouble with medical bills then get a national health service asap!

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[airdvr 210]

It doesn't what we want anymore. It's gonna happen so we might as well get used to it.

I wonder how all those docs with huge student loans are gonna repay them when the government controls their income.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[kbordson 8]

Quote

It doesn't what we want anymore. It's gonna happen so we might as well get used to it.

I wonder how all those docs with huge student loans are gonna repay them when the government controls their income.

[socialist whine]We're not. Why can't we get handouts like everybody else?[/socialist whine]

[dreamdancer 0]

Quote

It doesn't what we want anymore. It's gonna happen so we might as well get used to it.

you know it makes sense - nice big servings of national health service all round!

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[airdvr 210]

Quote

you know it makes sense - nice big servings of national health service all round!

Yep. Get in line for your helping comrade.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[chuckakers 425]

Quote

if you don't want to have trouble with medical bills then get a national health service asap!

Or give up the cable tv, $3K customs wheels, cigarettes, weekly visits to the mall and buy insurance instead.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[dreamdancer 0]

airdvr, are you calling me a banker?

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[airdvr 210]

Quote

airdvr, are you calling me a banker?

Nah...these days that would be a PA

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[dreamdancer 0]

Quote

Or give up the cable tv, $3K customs wheels, cigarettes, weekly visits to the mall and buy insurance instead.

you're confusing me, a living person, with the ridiculous stereotypes and cliches that clutter your head (and mostly get filtered out in real people)

a national health service works very well - for rich and poor alike (you'll like it!)

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[chuckakers 425]

Quote

Quote

Or give up the cable tv, $3K customs wheels, cigarettes, weekly visits to the mall and buy insurance instead.

you're confusing me, a living person, with the ridiculous stereotypes and cliches that clutter your head (and mostly get filtered out in real people)

a national health service works very well - for rich and poor alike (you'll like it!)

Sure, what could better than my government deciding what medical procedures I'm worth?

Too old? You don't get that liver transplant. Wouldn't listen to your assigned government "medical advisor" telling you to excersize more? No blood pressure medicine for you. Didn't vote democrat? We think you need a little mental "rehabilitation".

The lemmings never see the cliff coming.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

Didn't vote democrat? We think you need a little mental "rehabilitation".

Now yer talkin'.

Quote

The lemmings never see the cliff coming.

Actually, they do; some of them just have the foresight to wear a rig.

[lawrocket 3]

I will reoterate my argument of health care. There are 3 things you look for - policy wise - with health care:
1) High quality;
2) Inexpensive; and
3) Available on demand.

You can only get 100% of two of them. High quality and inexpensive care will be restrictively rationed. Hogh quality care available on demand (what we have now) is expensive. Inexpensive care available on demand will be low quality.

So, a national health care system that changes this will not do well for everyone. For me - who pays for premium for myself and my family - it will be worse because my priorities are different.

The present system DOES NOT work best for everyone. For people out there that have different priorities in their spending where health care is a lesser priority, the system sucks in the event of disaster.

There really are those who can't afford health insurance because they have 4 kids to feed on a minimum wage job. That they have 4 kids to feed on a minimum wage job, of course, says something about their thought processes.

And another thing:
What would happen to the true cost and availability of, say, gasoline if it was free at the pump and covered by taxes? Don't you think you'd see demand for gas skyrocket? Why would health care be any different?

So health care would be rationed.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[airdvr 210]

Quote

I will reoterate my argument of health care. There are 3 things you look for - policy wise - with health care:
1) High quality;
2) Inexpensive; and
3) Available on demand.

We won't need to look anymore. Come to the light. All are welcome...all are welcome.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[Andy9o8 2]

OK, so the European model has flaws. So let's consider that the "beta version" - sort of an R&D program for a better system than all or nothing. A reasonable system would be a hybrid of publicly funded and private supplement. The devil's just in the details.

One thing a lot of NHS systems have that I think is a good thing is some form of ongoing health coverage for people who get laid off and are unemployed - instead of the scary black hole which is pretty much what the US has now. Again, the devil's in the details.

Edit: oh yeah - that "pre-existing condition" racket sucks dog balls, too.

[shropshire 0]

Quote

The lemmings never see the cliff coming.

Of course Lemmings don't jump off cliffs... that's just another myth to go with you one about socialised medicine not working..... it's not always perfect but neither system is. We work with the best that we have.

How many people are refused insurance during to existing medical conditions?

How many people would be charged very high premiums because of existing medical conditions?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[millertime24 8]

I work in healthcare so I can rant on this one.

[Rant]Is healthcare a "RIGHT"? Im pretty sure (or at least to me anyway) it is a privalige. I think people quit realizing that a long time ago.[/Rant]

Muff #5048

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

I work in healthcare so I can rant on this one.

[Rant]Is healthcare a "RIGHT"? Im pretty sure (or at least to me anyway) it is a privalige. I think people quit realizing that a long time ago.[/Rant]

Simmer down. We already live in a society in which certain services are paid for with tax revenues, while others are not. It's just a debate over reasonable apportionment.

[airdvr 210]

Quote

Quote

The lemmings never see the cliff coming.

Of course Lemmings don't jump off cliffs... that's just another myth to go with you one about socialised medicine not working..... it's not always perfect but neither system is. We work with the best that we have.

How many people are refused insurance during to existing medical conditions?

How many people would be charged very high premiums because of existing medical conditions?

I understand your thought process. Now everyone will pay that person's premiums. Just like I get to pay my neighbor's mortgage.

The collective.

One of the principles of the framers of the constitution was the highest level of prosperity occurs when there is a free-market economy and a minimum of government regulations.

Prosperity depends upon a climate of wholesome stimulation with four basic freedoms in operation:

The Freedom to try.
The Freedom to buy.
The Freedom to sell.
The Freedom to fail.

I think it's a slippery slope we're on right now. Remove the freedom to fail and the other three will soon follow.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[millertime24 8]

I get that, but if we DIDN'T give away FREE healthcare to every Tom, Dick, and Pedro that showed up in the ER without and way of paying for it then it wouldn't cost nearly what it does today and maybe, just maybe more people COULD actually afford it without any type of government intervention.

Muff #5048

[chuckakers 425]

Quote

I will reoterate my argument of health care. There are 3 things you look for - policy wise - with health care:
1) High quality;
2) Inexpensive; and
3) Available on demand.

You can only get 100% of two of them. High quality and inexpensive care will be restrictively rationed. Hogh quality care available on demand (what we have now) is expensive. Inexpensive care available on demand will be low quality.

Nothing new here. That's the basic quality triangle of fast, cheap, and good. Choose any two you want.

So, a national health care system that changes this will not do well for everyone. For me - who pays for premium for myself and my family - it will be worse because my priorities are different.

The present system DOES NOT work best for everyone. For people out there that have different priorities in their spending where health care is a lesser priority, the system sucks in the event of disaster.

Different priorities? You mean people who CHOOSE not to buy healthcare coverage because they want to take an extra vacation every year or drive a Hummer instaed of a used Ford.

There really are those who can't afford health insurance because they have 4 kids to feed on a minimum wage job. That they have 4 kids to feed on a minimum wage job, of course, says something about their thought processes.

And there are already programs for those folks.

And another thing:
What would happen to the true cost and availability of, say, gasoline if it was free at the pump and covered by taxes? Don't you think you'd see demand for gas skyrocket? Why would health care be any different?

So health care would be rationed.

Bingo! Just as the emergency rooms are overflowing with non-insured types because they can't be turned away.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[shropshire 0]

I guess that we (in Europe) don't see being poorly as failing.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[chuckakers 425]

Quote

I guess that we (in Europe) don't see being poorly as failing.

We don't either. That's why we spend more money on health and human services than any other non-defense item in our budget. Unfortunately, our system has given so much to so many for so long, that some here want to just give everything to everyone....except those who suceed on their own, of course.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[jcd11235 0]

Quote

One of the principles of the framers of the constitution was the highest level of prosperity occurs when there is a free-market economy and a minimum of government regulations.

I've read the Constitution many times, from Preamble to Amendment XXVII, and there is no mention of a free market economy, nor are there any comparisons of different economic systems in there. Furthermore, there's no mention of the need to keep government regulations to a minimum. Have you ever even read the document?

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[shropshire 0]

I can see and understand your concerns, I just can't see an answer... where do you/we draw the line... We could take each case on it's merits but the admin' overhead would be costly.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome