GOP is Sinking into Irrelevancy

[mpohl 1]

Please discuss.

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Speaking as a conservative, though not party-affiliated, I would be sorry to see the GOP sink into irrelevancy, which is where they're heading at present. We need new ideas, and alternatives from the right, but not extremist ideology, which at present, defines the GOP. McCain lost the moment he picked Sarah Palin, an intellectual light-weight, no economist, little experience, a peppered record, but a self-proclaimed "Pit Bull with lipstick." Other than belittling their opponent, the GOP ticket had no proposals for the economy, a sane conclusion to the war in Iraq, energy independence, the environment, or education. They even supported privatizing Social Security, ending employer-sponsored, group health coverage, so that we'd be dependent upon insurers (like AIG) whom we had to bail out. Under McCain's healthcare proposal, he'd never be able to get medical coverage at any cost (given his age and medical history), and the costs to individual families would soar (average healthcare insurance for a family is nearly $12,000 annually, far less than the proposed $5,000 tax credit).

The party of Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, has been hijacked by extremists, bigots, and those committed only to protecting and further enriching the wealthiest, while the rest of Americans suffer. While they praise laissez-faire, trickle-down, and "free" market principles, we have seen the wretched affects of such policies, back in the 80's (bailing out the S&L's) and now (bailing out the banks and Wall St.). During the years of the Reagan-Bush-Bush tax cuts, unemployment rose, purchasing power and wages declined, and the economy shrank. In the mean time, funding for public education has declined, we've become far more energy-dependent, and our infrastructure has crumbled due to neglect.

The GOP betrayed their fiscal responsibility and role as conservators of the public treasury, as they've betrayed their principles of limited government. During Reagan-Bush-Bush, tax cuts with expanded spending (mostly on defense and wars-of-choice), have taken this nation to nearly a $12 trillion debt, huge deficits, and far more expansive government programs, benefitting private no-bid contractors, profiteers, and predators in the investment markets.

If the GOP wants to become viable and relevant, they'll need to stop pandering to the extremist wings of their base, and look towards the middle, as by far, most Americans are centrist and pragmatic, wanting to forge the common good, rather than the elite, savvy, well-connected few.
— Tina, California

[kbordson 8]

I think Tina has her opinion.

I have mine.

I think the entire system (BOTH MAJOR PARTIES - and more) needs significant re-structuring.

[1969912 0]

Yes, the GOP is sinking into irrelevancy. Ignore them. Please.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[FallingOsh 0]

I don't think they're sinking into irrelevancy. I just think the left likes to circle jerk themselves into thinking their ideas are the only correct ones.

While I agree the GOP needs a new leader and a new conservative direction, most of that article is a steaming pile of shit.

McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin. He lost it when the economy crashed and his campaign turned into mud slinging.

The bitching about bailouts is funny since it's clearly continued right into the new administration. She's right the GOP shouldn't have done it last year.

The comment about the GOP betraying their fiscal ideals of small government is valid. The follow up complaint about Reagan-Bush-Bush deficits is laughable at this point. All three were recently trumped.

The last paragraph about needing to look towards the middle is what got the GOP where they are. The Bush handouts and extreme growth of government are more centrists than a typical Republican President. A true conservative leader that doesn't pander to the left is the only thing that will save the GOP.

--------------------------------------------------
Stay positive and love your life.

[jerryzflies 0]

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I think Tina has her opinion.

I have mine.

I think the entire system (BOTH MAJOR PARTIES - and more) needs significant re-structuring.

What motive have the Dems to restructure? Just 3 months ago they won the WH and Congress, and the GOP is imploding.

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[quade 4]

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McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin.

Because of the overwhelming dislike of the previous Administration, the election was the Democrats to lose from day one. As long as they didn't make any bone headed moves they were going to win. Even with a few bone head moves by the Democrats, McCain needed to have a perfect election in order to win. Palin was not the perfect pick.

Any time your VP candidate is getting more coverage than your Presidential one, there's something fundamentally wrong with the decision. She was not only getting more coverage than McCain, she was getting all the wrong type of coverage; Is she qualified? Is she really the mother of her child? WHO the F IS she?

She was a poor choice.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[sfc 1]

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Please discuss.

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Speaking as a conservative, though not party-affiliated, I would be sorry to see the GOP sink into irrelevancy, which is where they're heading at present. We need new ideas, and alternatives from the right, but not extremist ideology, which at present, defines the GOP. McCain lost the moment he picked Sarah Palin, an intellectual light-weight, no economist, little experience, a peppered record, but a self-proclaimed "Pit Bull with lipstick." Other than belittling their opponent, the GOP ticket had no proposals for the economy, a sane conclusion to the war in Iraq, energy independence, the environment, or education. They even supported privatizing Social Security, ending employer-sponsored, group health coverage, so that we'd be dependent upon insurers (like AIG) whom we had to bail out. Under McCain's healthcare proposal, he'd never be able to get medical coverage at any cost (given his age and medical history), and the costs to individual families would soar (average healthcare insurance for a family is nearly $12,000 annually, far less than the proposed $5,000 tax credit).

The party of Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, has been hijacked by extremists, bigots, and those committed only to protecting and further enriching the wealthiest, while the rest of Americans suffer. While they praise laissez-faire, trickle-down, and "free" market principles, we have seen the wretched affects of such policies, back in the 80's (bailing out the S&L's) and now (bailing out the banks and Wall St.). During the years of the Reagan-Bush-Bush tax cuts, unemployment rose, purchasing power and wages declined, and the economy shrank. In the mean time, funding for public education has declined, we've become far more energy-dependent, and our infrastructure has crumbled due to neglect.

The GOP betrayed their fiscal responsibility and role as conservators of the public treasury, as they've betrayed their principles of limited government. During Reagan-Bush-Bush, tax cuts with expanded spending (mostly on defense and wars-of-choice), have taken this nation to nearly a $12 trillion debt, huge deficits, and far more expansive government programs, benefitting private no-bid contractors, profiteers, and predators in the investment markets.

If the GOP wants to become viable and relevant, they'll need to stop pandering to the extremist wings of their base, and look towards the middle, as by far, most Americans are centrist and pragmatic, wanting to forge the common good, rather than the elite, savvy, well-connected few.
— Tina, California

GOP? who? Are they still a party?
Grumpy Old Pharts, mostly old white men with nothing better to do

[Andy9o8 2]

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McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin.

Yes, he did. My dad was absolutely, positively going to vote for McCain. It was Palin's deportment during the campaign that got him to take a deeeeeep breath and vote for Obama. And Dad voted in a battleground state.

[Andy9o8 2]

Anyhow, no, the GOP is not irrelevant. But parties can marginalize themselves for awhile. The Democrats did so in the 90's when they lost both houses of Congress, and then failed to win them back, over and over. The Dems didn't regenerate until they finally fired the tired, old coaching staff and got a new, fresh one on board. The GOP is now in that position - it has marginalized itself. And as long as it keeps "fighting the last war" with tired, old tactics, it will keep losing at the polls.

[kbordson 8]

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I think Tina has her opinion.

I have mine.

I think the entire system (BOTH MAJOR PARTIES - and more) needs significant re-structuring.

What motive have the Dems to restructure? Just 3 months ago they won the WH and Congress, and the GOP is imploding.

Wait and see.

The "Dems" are going to get themselves into some serious trouble in the next few years.

And just because one girl named Tina thinks that they are imploding doesn't mean the party is going away.

You can (and obviously DO) agree with her. But I don't.

[jerryzflies 0]

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I think Tina has her opinion.

I have mine.

I think the entire system (BOTH MAJOR PARTIES - and more) needs significant re-structuring.

What motive have the Dems to restructure? Just 3 months ago they won the WH and Congress, and the GOP is imploding.

Wait and see.

The "Dems" are going to get themselves into some serious trouble in the next few years.

And just because one girl named Tina thinks that they are imploding doesn't mean the party is going away.

You can (and obviously DO) agree with her. But I don't.

The latest NBC/Wall St. Journal Poll has some VERY bad news for the GOP. The party's approval rating is 26%, some 30 points behind the Dems. The American public apparently believes the GOP deserves the blame for the economy, and is just playing politics in its opposition to Obama over the recovery package.

Unless it gets its house in order very soon,the GOP WILL be quite irrelevant. The fiasco over Limbaugh is just making matters worse.

msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/MSNBC/Sections/090303_NBC-WSJ_poll.pdf

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[timmyfitz 0]

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McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin.

Yes, he did. My dad was absolutely, positively going to vote for McCain. It was Palin's deportment during the campaign that got him to take a deeeeeep breath and vote for Obama. And Dad voted in a battleground state.

That's all the proof I need. One person's decision to change there vote shows causation. It must be true.

[nerdgirl 0]

Other than [FallingOsh], who seemed to respond earnestly and non-reactively, do any of the conservative leaning folks (including those who self-identify as moderate libertarians) see any validity in the *content* of the critique?

I don't know who "Tina" is or if there is even a real "Tina."

I do know former Rep Mickey Edwards (R-OK), who is one of my favorite Republicans – & there are quite few favorites “The Republican Party long stood for the principles at the heart of the American Constitution, including a belief in the wonderful possibilities of self-government (instead of the anti-government rhetoric it has since embraced). It celebrated ideas instead of the rabid anti-intellectualism it has come to cherish.

"It celebrated diversity (Barry Goldwater argued that there was no such thing as a merely common man) rather than demanding sameness in religion, values, and beliefs. The Republican Party does not need to re-invent itself — it merely needs to remember what it once was.”[/url]
Excerpts from Rep Edwards appearance on Bill Moyers Journal in July 2008:

“The Republican Party is not healthy. The Republican Party is not healthy at all. I mean, it's, I think, it's lost the confidence of the American people. It's lost the confidence of most Republicans. You know, it has, you know, you'd be amazed, Bill, how many people I talk to every day who have been lifelong Republicans who just can't support the party anymore.

“We used to be a party that prided itself on being the party of small business. You know, we were for entrepreneurs, and we were for free enterprise. And more and more we seem to have become a party that idolizes big business, that supports big business in every way it can.

“What capitalism promotes is that if you are going willing to invest your time and money into a particular service where you're providing a service, a benefit, a product that is useful, you're going to get a reward for it, you know, and that's going to cause you to do more. And you're going to create jobs and so forth. We have allowed the system to grow to where we it has nothing to do with free trade, you know? So we support people like Ivan Boesky and Boone Pickens and, you know, these predators, you know- … people who aren't producing goods or services. They're just producing money.

“… one of the things conservatives used to insist on in the platform, in the national platform, was separation of church and state. That we were the ones who insisted on it. We are a very religious people. Tocqueville found that long ago. We the American people tend to be religious. But we live within a secular governmental structure.

“I'm longing for adherence to the Constitution of the United States 'cause when we talk about American exceptionalism, that's what it is. It's not our wealth. It's not our military. What makes us exceptional is our form of self-government, you know, that keeps most of the major powers over whether to go to war, what our tax policies ought to be, how much we spend, keeps it in the hands of the people through their representatives.”

For those inclined, I highly recommend Rep Edward's book “Reclaiming Conservatism: How a Great American Political Movement Got Lost–And How It Can Find Its Way Back.”

If you prefer listening over reading, one can also listen to him speak at the Library of Congress last March. To paraphrase Rep Edwards, being thoughtful, reflective, and educated should not be characterized as a ‘bad’ thing.

/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

[Andy9o8 2]

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McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin.

Yes, he did. My dad was absolutely, positively going to vote for McCain. It was Palin's deportment during the campaign that got him to take a deeeeeep breath and vote for Obama. And Dad voted in a battleground state.

That's all the proof I need. One person's decision to change there their vote shows causation. It must be true.

I figured somebody would say that. So know this: the candidate my Dad voted for has won every single presidential election since 1952 (except 1968). Respect the power.

Of course, you're deliberately evading my point: that my dad was an example of the trend, not an aberration. But whatever.

[Erroll 80]

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..One person's decision to change there their his vote shows causation.

[TheAnvil 0]

Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism. Which is not synonymous with religious fundamentalism or evangelical Christianity. If anything, it should welcome their votes should they choose to give them, but openly discount their advocacy of government intervention into the social fabric of the nation - in all regards.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[1969912 0]

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Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism. Which is not synonymous with religious fundamentalism or evangelical Christianity. If anything, it should welcome their votes should they choose to give them, but openly discount their advocacy of government intervention into the social fabric of the nation - in all regards.

Tina's a BullDyke who's jealous of Mrs. Palin.

Agree with your second paragraph....

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[Andy9o8 2]

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Tina's a BullDyke

Really? What part of the copied post reflected the author's sexuality?

[Amazon 7]

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Tina's a BullDyke

Really? What part of the copied post reflected the author's sexuality?

Didn't you get the memo... to get called that all you need is to be female and disagree with the rabid righties on here.

[jerryzflies 0]

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Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism.

I'm not sure Abraham Lincoln would agree with you. The Republican party was very progressive when it was founded. It's only recently it got bogged down.

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[FallingOsh 0]

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Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism.

I'm not sure Abraham Lincoln would agree with you. The Republican party was very progressive when it was founded. It's only recently it got bogged down.

~140 years later, the GOP is the conservative party. I'm confident you knew what he meant and are just being argumentative for the sake of increasing your post #s total.

--------------------------------------------------
Stay positive and love your life.

[jerryzflies 0]

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Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism.

I'm not sure Abraham Lincoln would agree with you. The Republican party was very progressive when it was founded. It's only recently it got bogged down.

~140 years later, the GOP is the conservative party. I'm confident you knew what he meant and are just being argumentative for the sake of increasing your post #s total.

You do understand what roots are? Maybe not.

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[timmyfitz 0]

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McCain didn't lose the election when he selected Palin.

Yes, he did. My dad was absolutely, positively going to vote for McCain. It was Palin's deportment during the campaign that got him to take a deeeeeep breath and vote for Obama. And Dad voted in a battleground state.

That's all the proof I need. One person's decision to change there their vote shows causation. It must be true.

I figured somebody would say that. So know this: the candidate my Dad voted for has won every single presidential election since 1952 (except 1968). Respect the power.

Of course, you're deliberately evading my point: that my dad was an example of the trend, not an aberration. But whatever.

Like I said, this is all the proof we need. No need for further discussions.

Respect the power. LOL

[livendive 8]

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Tina's quite the dumbfuck. Unfamiliar with McCain's platform in most regards.

The GOP needs to get back to its roots - conservatism. Which is not synonymous with religious fundamentalism or evangelical Christianity. If anything, it should welcome their votes should they choose to give them, but openly discount their advocacy of government intervention into the social fabric of the nation - in all regards.

If the GOP was actually the party of fiscal conservatism and individual responsibility, they'd get far more of my votes than the Dems. However I've yet to see them actually demonstrate that they stand for such things.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[rehmwa 2]

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If the GOP was actually the party of fiscal conservatism and individual responsibility, they'd get far more of my votes than the Dems. However I've yet to see them actually demonstrate that they stand for such things.

+1

Now, how do I express this by NOT voting for people of either party?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants