Palin Rejects 31% of Stimulus $$$

[mnealtx 0]

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I would not vote for a Governor that signed an anti-2nd bill . . .

Ah, OK. So if the Governor just said that he would sign such a bill, but the bill never actually made it to him to sign, then you would still consider voting for him because it was just words with no action?

Which is pretty relevant to Palin and the abortion situation. I think that since she can't even get a bill passed requiring parental consent for abortion in Alaska, she probably realizes that she's not going to get a law passed to make most abortions illegal.

Since when does a Governor/President create legislation? That comes from the State legislature/Congress.

Now, *if* such a bill came forward and it was signed by the Governor/President, that is a different story - hence the 'actions speak louder than words' that I've kept saying over and over.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rhys 0]

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Of all the things I listed at your request, you chose to focus on abortion...

I used that as an example, I did not focus on it but the subject has really seemed to be a focus now in the thread.
The conversation (for me) is about sarah palins policies and how they are hypocritical.

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If you believe in pro life then you should not believe in more funding for an aggressive, uncalculated military that kills living people left right and centre. If you believe in less regulation you should not believe in so call pro life (Anti choice)

Military members voluntarily choose to join. Invalid comparison.

Get a hold of the conveersation will you!?!?

sarah palin is supposed to be pro life and for added funding for the military, that is how this is relevant.

Enlisting is another subject. if you beleive in preserving life, you should not be for unjustified death!

Go back and read!

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If you're pro-choice, the choice to end life, then you should support any military's decision to use force. By your logic, opposing military action and being pro-choice is also hypocritical. I'll spare the capitalized cursing, though.

you really don't get it do you?, Yes I am pro choice, but I don't really see how that equates to me being having to be pro military. Can you elaborate on that please.

And to set the record straight i am not against military, it is unfortunately necessary, just as the police are.

But I do not like the unjustified use of mlitary force as it sets a precedent, if you don't like they way someone does something then you can attack them.

For example; (using the GWB admins rationale) Any country can justafiably attack the USA if they don't like the way things are done there and because the USA holds weapons of mass destruction.

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That is my opinion and I am entitled to it.

Absolutely. But I guess my opinion is just fucking stupid, right?

Well if you say you are pro life, but you support further funding for the military as the GWB admin set it up to be, then yes you are stupid. because you say you are pro life but you support unjustafied murder.

As sarah palin does.

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You believe in stronger funding for the US military by the same party that has wasted so many billions of dollars and thousands of lives.

For that you are condoning murder.

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As are you.

How?

from wiki

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Life cycle
A 10mm human embryo at 5 weeks

The human life cycle is similar to that of other placental mammals. The zygote divides inside the female's uterus to become an embryo, which over a period of thirty-eight weeks (9 months) of gestation becomes a human fetus. After this span of time, the fully grown fetus is birthed from the woman's body and breathes independently as an infant for the first time. At this point, most modern cultures recognize the baby as a person entitled to the full protection of the law, though some jurisdictions extend various levels of personhood earlier to human fetuses while they remain in the uterus.

We terminated an embryo not a fetus, so by law in all parts of the world we do init destry a human life, we merely stopped one from coming to be.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[Shotgun 1]

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Since when does a Governor/President create legislation? That comes from the State legislature/Congress.

Well, earlier you said:

"Palin HAS had the opportunity to enact law and has not, regardless of her opinion."

And I'm just pointing out that no, she hasn't had that opportunity because she doesn't create legislation. There has been anti-abortion legislation in Alaska since she has been Governor (which she has expressed her support for), but none of it has made it to her.

[billvon 2,998]

>I would not vote for a Governor that signed an anti-2nd bill or for a
>Senator that voted for an anti-2nd bill as a general rule.

Ah, so you're changing your story now! Now it's no longer "I would not vote for a politician that had implemented law banning guns" - it's "I would not vote for a senator that voted for an anti-2nd amendment bill." And that, of course, is very different (in your mind) from a governor that has backed anti-abortion bills. Because, in your mind, she's a respectful, moral, upstanding, pro-freedom-and-america republican and therefore OK, and Obama is a fascist-socalist gun grabbing democrat and therefore you must never, never admit you might support him on anything.

It would have been much easier if you'd just said that up front. You wouldn't have to waste your time changing your story so much.

(BTW still waiting for your example of a law that Obama implemented that banned guns. But given the change in your story above, I won't hold my breath.)

[mnealtx 0]

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Since when does a Governor/President create legislation? That comes from the State legislature/Congress.

Well, earlier you said:

"Palin HAS had the opportunity to enact law and has not, regardless of her opinion."

And I'm just pointing out that no, she hasn't had that opportunity because she doesn't create legislation. There has been anti-abortion legislation in Alaska since she has been Governor (which she has expressed her support for), but none of it has made it to her.

I was thinking there was some sort of abortion rider attached to an oil bill that she had stripped out, but I could be mistaken. If I *am* mistaken on that, then I apologize for the error and agree with your general point.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[mnealtx 0]

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>I would not vote for a Governor that signed an anti-2nd bill or for a
>Senator that voted for an anti-2nd bill as a general rule.

Ah, so you're changing your story now! Now it's no longer "I would not vote for a politician that had implemented law banning guns" - it's "I would not vote for a senator that voted for an anti-2nd amendment bill." And that, of course, is very different (in your mind) from a governor that has backed anti-abortion bills. Because, in your mind, she's a respectful, moral, upstanding, pro-freedom-and-america republican and therefore OK, and Obama is a fascist-socalist gun grabbing democrat and therefore you must never, never admit you might support him on anything.

It would have been much easier if you'd just said that up front. You wouldn't have to waste your time changing your story so much.

(BTW still waiting for your example of a law that Obama implemented that banned guns. But given the change in your story above, I won't hold my breath.)

I didn't "change" anything, I had to make my answer more and more detailed and explicit due to certain individuals deliberately playing stupid.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 2,998]

>I didn't "change" anything . . .

OK. Then please post the example of the law that Obama implemented that banned guns.

[mnealtx 0]

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>I didn't "change" anything . . .

OK. Then please post the example of the law that Obama implemented that banned guns.

Speaking of being deliberately obtuse...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 2,998]

OK, so you can't answer the question. Reading up before you make such statements might prevent such embarrassing errors in the future.

[mnealtx 0]

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OK, so you can't answer the question. Reading up before you make such statements might prevent such embarrassing errors in the future.

Reading my ENTIRE answer would have made it plain that I consider Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

Now, is that sufficiently clear for you, or are you going to continue to play semantics games?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rhys 0]

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Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

Good, too many violent assholes are allowed to have guns, i hope many of those papers get to his desk.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[Shotgun 1]

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. . . I consider Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

OK, now I know that Obama's not exactly pro-gun, but how does his voting record make you certain that he will sign ANY anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk? (Are you including extreme legislation such as making all guns illegal in the U.S.? Or are you making the assumption that that sort of thing wouldn't make it to his desk?)

[mnealtx 0]

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Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

Good, too many violent assholes conspiracy theorists are allowed to have guns internet access, i hope many of those papers get to his desk.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[mnealtx 0]

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. . . I consider Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

OK, now I know that Obama's not exactly pro-gun, but how does his voting record make you certain that he will sign ANY anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk? (Are you including extreme legislation such as making all guns illegal in the U.S.? Or are you making the assumption that that sort of thing wouldn't make it to his desk?)

I would *hope* that something like you describe would never make it to his desk - but, to answer the main point, I've not seen any evidence of him voting against any gun-control bills. If you can find any that he has voted against, let me know - I'd like to see them.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[jakee 1,500]

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So, take 4, and I'll be real clear this time: How would you feel if a state governor thinking of running for President said, in answer to a question about whether he/she would support a measure banning all guns, "I would. And you know, it's no secret that I'm anti-gun."? Would you give him a pass on that just because he hadn't banned guns completely in his own state?

I would not vote for a politician that had implemented law banning guns. Since Palin has not passed any laws restricting abortion, I would have no qualms about voting for her in your (extremely) hypothetical situation.

You are still wriggling Mike. Why are you so determined not to directly answer this question?

Take 5: How would you feel if a state governor thinking of running for President said, in answer to a question about whether he/she would support a measure banning all guns, "I would. And you know, it's no secret that I'm anti-gun."? Would you give him a pass on that just because he hadn't banned guns completely in his own state?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[mnealtx 0]

I've answered it over and over again, amplifying it again and again to try to make it clear. If you still can't understand my answer, I can't help you.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Shotgun 1]

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. . . I consider Obama's voting record ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk.

OK, now I know that Obama's not exactly pro-gun, but how does his voting record make you certain that he will sign ANY anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk? (Are you including extreme legislation such as making all guns illegal in the U.S.? Or are you making the assumption that that sort of thing wouldn't make it to his desk?)

I would *hope* that something like you describe would never make it to his desk - but, to answer the main point, I've not seen any evidence of him voting against any gun-control bills. If you can find any that he has voted against, let me know - I'd like to see them.

I'm not aware of any gun-control bills that he's voted against, but from what I've seen of his voting record, it is not "ample proof that he *will*, in fact, sign any anti-2nd legislation that makes it to his desk."

I can understand it being enough to make it a reason for you to not vote for him, but I think the above conclusion you make from it is a bit unfounded.

[jakee 1,500]

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I've answered it over and over again, amplifying it again and again to try to make it clear. If you still can't understand my answer, I can't help you.

No Mike, you haven't. You've said you wouldn't vote for Obama because you think his record is anti gun: that's not an answer to the question. You've said you wouldn't vote for anyone with a record of voting against guns: that's not an answer to the question. You've said that you think actions speak louder than words: that's not an answer to the question. You've said you wouldn't have a problem voting for Palin over her abortion stance: that sure as fuck isn't an answer to the question.

The one constant through all this is that you have consistently, studiously and very, very carefully avoided directly answering what I am asking you.

Take 6: If a state governor thinking of running for President said, in answer to a question about whether he/she would support a measure banning all guns, "I would. And you know, it's no secret that I'm anti-gun." would you give him a pass on that just because he hadn't banned guns completely in his own state?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[FallingOsh 0]

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and his faith teaches love towards all people. Just because he disagrees does not make him a bigot.

No, the fact that he calls their lifestyle sinful and wrong, calls them derogatory names and thinks they shouldn't be allowed near his family makes him a bigot.

He didn't called them names. He said queer, in the dictionary, means strange. You called them queers, then you brought in the 'dangerous' accusations.

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This is a huge, recurring theme in this thread.

Yeah, there is. You keep trying to spin bigotry into something noble.

I didn't say it was noble. I said his opinion is different than yours so you think he's a bigot. I don't agree with the homosexual lifestyl but have had several gay friends. I didn't hate them or call them names. I just didn't agree. I bet there are plenty of people who disagree with my life but don't hate me for it. Disagreement does not equal hate or bigotry.

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Stay positive and love your life.

[FallingOsh 0]

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You have not produced one AT ALL, despite being asked several times.

I posted a poll from a reliable source that supported my claim. You posted an old dizzy.com poll. If you have something remotely reliable to back your claimes then please post. I'd be happy to read it.

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Your "few circumstances" in the Gallup polls INCLUDE rape and incest.

Please copy and paste where it says that anywhere on the gallup poll page.

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Stay positive and love your life.

[jakee 1,500]

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He said queer, in the dictionary, means strange.

In order to defend the practice of calling gay people queer. "Hey man, nigger just means black, and he is."

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I said his opinion is different than yours so you think he's a bigot.

To repeat: No, the fact that he calls their lifestyle sinful and wrong, calls them derogatory names and thinks they shouldn't be allowed near his family makes him a bigot.

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Disagreement does not equal hate or bigotry.

Disagreement also does not equal "You can't come near my kids, you sinful queer."

Keep spinning dude, keep spinning.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[mnealtx 0]

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You've said you wouldn't vote for Obama because you think his record is anti gun: that's not an answer to the question.

No, I *know* his record is anti-gun. You don't get a 100% score from the Brady bunch by voting against gun-control bills.

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that sure as fuck isn't an answer to the question.

Then make the question fucking reflect reality. Palin hasn't signed any laws restricting abortion, because there have been no laws restricting abortion passed by the Alaska legislature (thank you, Shotgun, for the correction), so your 'because they haven't completely banned guns' is BULLSHIT. In point of fact, Palin *COULD* have have allowed two abortion bills to be introduced into a special session in 2008, but she did not, even though she agreed with the bills.

Conversely, Obama *has* voted for anti-2nd legislature as a Senator, so he's saying one thing and doing another (actions speak louder than words) - can you grasp the difference? Can you see how your question, as stated, applies to Obama and not Palin?

You've had all the answers you're going to get from me - don't bother asking the question yet again because you don't like the answer you get.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[mnealtx 0]

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He said queer, in the dictionary, means strange.

In order to defend the practice of calling gay people queer. "Hey man, nigger just means black, and he is."

If it doesn't, then why do black people use the term all the time?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rhys 0]

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why do black people use the term all the time?

Because they can, you could call yourself fat or stupid and it would not be an insult as you made the call yourself, but if someone else said it, it could be considered an insult!

You can decide whether you consider it humor or not but somebody else cannot make that decision for you!

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[Shotgun 1]

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In point of fact, Palin *COULD* have have allowed two abortion bills to be introduced into a special session in 2008, but she did not, even though she agreed with the bills.

There was a special session having to do with oil, and Palin didn't want to mix the two subjects.

From her website, here is some info:

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April 23, 2008, Anchorage, Alaska – In response to Senate President Lyda Green’s request to expand the call of the special session to include abortion bills, Governor Sarah Palin today outlined her willingness to consider a separate call if the Senate President can show a path to success.

House Bill 301, which prohibits the practice of partial-birth abortion, and House Bill 364, relating to parental consent, failed due to inaction by the Senate. The Governor expressed disappointment that Senate President Green did not exhaust every possible option during the regular session to move the legislation.

“Alaskans know I am pro-life and have never wavered in my belief in the sanctity of every human life,” Governor Palin said. “These issues are so important they shouldn't be diluted with oil and gas deliberations.”

Governor Palin called on Senate leadership to explain what they would do differently than last session to ensure that Alaskans will finally see a vote on both bills by the full Senate.

http://gov.state.ak.us/archive-3843.html