idrankwhat 0 #51 March 25, 2009 Quote What state of Palestine is this that you refer to? This one Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #52 March 25, 2009 QuoteQuote What state of Palestine is this that you refer to? This one "The Palestine Liberation Organization has enjoyed status as a non-member observer at the United Nations since 1974, and continues to represent "Palestine" there.[145] After the 1988 declaration of state, the State of Palestine was formally recognized by 117 United Nations member states." In other words, it's not recognized by the UN or the non partisan nations of the world as being real. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #53 March 25, 2009 Quote In other words, it's not recognized by the UN or the non partisan nations of the world as being real. The current State of Palestine has not been established. That's that "two state solution" thing that folks keep talking about. However, Israel was carved out of Palestine. It's neighbors, with one exception, also recognize the State of Palestine. But whatever you wish to call it, the "land of milk and honey", "levant" "Abrahamville", whatever, it's not Israel. And Israel continuing to take what is not theirs is why have a problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #54 March 25, 2009 dreamdancer ranted about the impending destruction of the state of Palestine. Per any of your definitions of what that means, clearly bullshit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #55 March 25, 2009 Quotedreamdancer ranted about the impending destruction of the state of Palestine. Per any of your definitions of what that means, clearly bullshit. is this bullshit... QuoteThe Promised Land Greater Israel occasionally refers to the Promised Land (defined in Genesis 15:18-21) or to the Land of Israel, and is also called Complete Land of Israel or "Entire Land of Israel" This is a more accurate translation than "Greater" Israel, which is used in English but has no real counterpart in Hebrew. The Bible contains three geographical definitions of the Land of Israel. The first, found in Genesis 15:18-21, is vague. It describes a large territory, "from the Nile to the Euphrates", comprising all of modern-day Israel, the Palestinian Territories, and Lebanon, as well as large parts of Syria, Jordan, and Egypt. The proportion of current Iraq, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey included in this territory is debatable. The other two definitions are found in Numbers 34:1-15 and Ezekiel 47:13-20 and describe a smaller territory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Israelstay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #56 March 25, 2009 QuoteIn other words, it's not recognized by the UN or the non partisan nations of the world as being real. if the un were to vote for the creation of a 'greater palestine' (and integrate israel within it) would that be 'the destruction of israel'?stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #57 April 2, 2009 QuoteAt a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing today, Gen. David Petraeus, the head of U.S. Central Command, said that Israel may take “preemptive military action” against Iran to prevent it from developing a nuclear bomb: Army General David Petraeus told Congress that “the Israeli government may ultimately see itself so threatened by the prospect of an Iranian nuclear weapon that it would take preemptive military action to derail or delay it.” While Iran insists its nuclear program is intended for peaceful power generation, Petraeus, the head of U.S. Central Command, said “Iranian officials have consistently failed to provide the assurances and transparency necessary for international acceptance and verification.” Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor declined to comment to Bloomberg on Petraeus’ comments, which come a day after the new Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, warned that President Obama “must stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons—and quickly—or an imperiled Israel may be forced to attack Iran’s nuclear facilities itself.” http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/petraeus%3A_israel_might_decide_to_attack_iran/#134590stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #58 April 2, 2009 And your point? It wouldn't be the first time Israel has used this language about at a nuclear facility, nor do I suspect it would be their last. I think if you Google it you'll find they make a statement like that roughly once a year.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #59 April 2, 2009 so it's just another bluff - phew stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #60 April 2, 2009 is assad bluffing as well... QuoteAssad: By war or peace, we will liberate the Golan Syrian President Bashar Assad is escalating his rhetoric against Israel, vowing that "the day in which we will be liberated [on the Golan] is at hand - by peace or war." Assad told the Qatari newspaper A-Sharq in an interview published on Thursday: "This enemy does not want peace. What is the alternative? The parallel route to the peace process is resistance. The Israeli will not come by his own will, so there is no alternative but for him to come from fear." http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1075930.htmlstay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #61 April 2, 2009 Quoteis assad bluffing as well... ***Assad: By war or peace, we will liberate the Golan That rhetoric was right after Israel's rampage in Gaza. I thought that this was a very interesting article. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #62 April 2, 2009 Quote It wouldn't be the first time Israel has used this language about at a nuclear facility, nor do I suspect it would be their last. I think if you Google it you'll find they make a statement like that roughly once a year. Though as Syria found out, Israel is still willing to destroy facilities. Of course, it's a much easier target than Iran. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #63 April 2, 2009 QuoteQuote It wouldn't be the first time Israel has used this language about at a nuclear facility, nor do I suspect it would be their last. I think if you Google it you'll find they make a statement like that roughly once a year. Though as Syria found out, Israel is still willing to destroy facilities. Of course, it's a much easier target than Iran. When there are no repercussions for braking countless international laws, they will continue to do as they wish, and that’s why I believe we need to cut all aid to Israel. We should not support any one who does not want to play by the rules.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #64 April 2, 2009 Quote When there are no repercussions for braking countless international laws, they will continue to do as they wish, and that’s why I believe we need to cut all aid to Israel. We should not support any one who does not want to play by the rules. Indeed. Syria was breaking the rules, and was punished for it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #65 April 2, 2009 QuoteQuote It wouldn't be the first time Israel has used this language about at a nuclear facility, nor do I suspect it would be their last. I think if you Google it you'll find they make a statement like that roughly once a year. Though as Syria found out, Israel is still willing to destroy facilities. Of course, it's a much easier target than Iran. I have no doubt in my mind that if Israel attempted to strike at an Iranian nuclear weapons facility they would be successful. That said, I highly doubt they'd do it unless they felt they were absolutely positive and it was the only thing they could do about it.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #66 April 2, 2009 Quote Quote When there are no repercussions for braking countless international laws, they will continue to do as they wish, and that’s why I believe we need to cut all aid to Israel. We should not support any one who does not want to play by the rules. Indeed. Syria was breaking the rules, and was punished for it. what rules Quote On 6 September 2007, Israel launched an air strike dubbed Operation Orchard against a target in the Deir ez-Zor region of Syria. While Israel refused to comment, unnamed US officials said Israel had shared intelligence with them that North Korea was cooperating with Syria on some sort of nuclear facility. Both Syria and North Korea denied the allegation and Syria filed a formal complaint with the United Nations. Journalist Seymour Hersh speculates that this air strike may have been intended as a trial run for striking alleged Iranian nuclear weapons facilities. On January 7, 2007 The Sunday Times reported that Israel had drawn up plans to destroy three Iranian nuclear facilities with low-yield nuclear bunker-busters that would be launched by aircraft through "tunnels" created by conventional laser-guided bombs. These tactical nuclear weapons would then explode underground to reduce radioactive fallout. Israel denied the specific allegation. However, its military leaders admit that it rules out no option. The death of the Iranian physicist Ardeshir Hassanpour, who may have been involved in the nuclear program, has been reported by the intelligence group Stratfor to have been a Mossad assassination. Iran is currently conducting atomic research that Israel fears is aimed at building a nuclear weapon. Israel has pressed for United Nations economic sanctions against Iran, and has repeatedly threatened to launch a military strike on Iran if the United States does not do so first. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_and_Israelstay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #67 April 2, 2009 Unfortunately as seen in the Gaza war crimes thread some here think Israel has the right to be judge, jury, and the executioner. At the same time they can brake international laws, but also punish other countries if they brake international laws. But don’t you ever call them hypocrites ok, that might be a PA I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #68 April 2, 2009 Quote I have no doubt in my mind that if Israel attempted to strike at an Iranian nuclear weapons facility they would be successful. Certainly, though it's unlikely to be so successful that Iran wouldn't even admit the bombing occurred, as Syria did, claiming only that the Israelis violated their airspace. Darius - you love to talk about law and rules when it applies to Israel, but everyone else gets a free pass. That leaves us with rule of the jungle, which you also reject because your side gets their ass kicked. Using schools to launch rockets - go right ahead! Develop nuclear arms despite being an NTP signee - no problemo! The evidence on the Syrian site was pretty clear cut, and confirmed by their denial that anything had even happened. They were caught with their hand in the cookie jar. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #69 April 2, 2009 Quote you love to talk about law and rules when it applies to Israe Last I checked Israel was a country, and our allies I expect the people we support to act better then a terrorist group. If they do not follow the rules as they have not I say don’t send them my money. I think I am ok with that. Also Israel is not the worlds hangman so where in the rules does it say Israel can be judge, jury , and executioner? Do they need to consult the UN or anyone else when they bomb a country or are they free to do any thing? Quote l, but everyone else gets a free pass. That leaves us with rule of the jungle, which you also reject because your side gets their ass kicked. My side? Which is my side. When the rule of the jungle means snipers shooting mothers and their babies yea I guess I am not ok with that. I am crazy like thatI'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #70 April 2, 2009 Quote you love to talk about law and rules when it applies to Israel, but everyone else gets a free pass. No, they/we don't. And I don't believe that he implied that they did. International law only works if it applied equally. Giving out passes for war crimes or NPT violations through "Jungle law" is one of the main reasons there are people willing to blow themselves up in order to disrupt our lives. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #71 April 2, 2009 QuoteQuote you love to talk about law and rules when it applies to Israel, but everyone else gets a free pass. No, they/we don't. And I don't believe that he implied that they did. International law only works if it applied equally. Giving out passes for war crimes or NPT violations through "Jungle law" is one of the main reasons there are people willing to blow themselves up in order to disrupt our lives. If you're going to bleat about international law, then you can't ignore the violations of your side (and Darius, it's beneath us all for you to ask "what side am I on") Israel can easily see how successful whining to the UN was with Iran and North Korea. It choose to take action. Since I believe the right to defense and self preservation trumps just about everything else, I fully support such action. Its opposition would like to use 'international law' and its allies in the UN to give it an advantage in this war. Nice try. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #72 April 2, 2009 Quote Quote Quote It wouldn't be the first time Israel has used this language about at a nuclear facility, nor do I suspect it would be their last. I think if you Google it you'll find they make a statement like that roughly once a year. Though as Syria found out, Israel is still willing to destroy facilities. Of course, it's a much easier target than Iran. I have no doubt in my mind that if Israel attempted to strike at an Iranian nuclear weapons facility they would be successful. That said, I highly doubt they'd do it unless they felt they were absolutely positive and it was the only thing they could do about it. there is zero chance of israel attacking iran - thank goodness israel is about to find out that a bankrupt 'big brother' has lost patience with it stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #73 April 2, 2009 Quote there is zero chance of israel attacking iran - thank goodness [:) It's good that you're making declarations of your own. But you're quite wrong here. The chance is definitely not zero, and with the incoming government there, has probably gotten much higher. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #74 April 2, 2009 there is no chance of israel attacking iran - and iran knows it israel had better make the best settlement it can while it still has a few cards left. a two state solution is about to be imposed stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonyhays 86 #75 April 2, 2009 Quotethere is no chance of israel attacking iran - and iran knows it Sure about that???“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
