Suicide attack kills 48 at Pakistani mosque

[Darius11 12]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090327/ap_on_re_as/as_pakistan

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PESHAWAR, Pakistan – A suicide bomber demolished a mosque packed with hundreds of worshippers attending Friday prayers near the Afghan border, killing at least 48 people and injuring scores more, in the bloodiest attack in Pakistan this year. The bomber struck at the climax of the service, as the mosque leader was starting the communal prayer, witnesses said.

"As the prayer leader said 'God is Great', the bomb went off with a big bang," said Nadir Shah, a local paramilitary solider attending the mosque. "I felt it was the end of everything. Sometime later when I opened my eyes, I was lying among dead bodies."

The blast in the fabled Khyber Pass came hours before President Barack Obama unveiled a revised strategy to "disrupt, defeat and dismantle" the al-Qaida terrorist organization and the Taliban operating in Afghanistan and Pakistan's northwest.

A government official accused Islamist militants of carrying out the bombing in revenge for a recent offensive aimed in part at protecting the major supply route for NATO and U.S. troops in Afghanistan that passes in front of the mosque. Several of the dead were local security officers who were praying there, officials said.

"Residents of this area had cooperated and helped us a lot. These infidels had warned that they will take revenge," said Tariq Hayat, the top administrator of the Khyber tribal region. "They are the enemy of Pakistan. They are the enemy of Islam."

Rising violence in Pakistan is fueling doubts about the pro-Western government's ability to counter Taliban and al-Qaida militants also blamed for attacks on Western troops in Afghanistan.

The bomber hit the mosque, a popular stop for travelers motoring between Pakistan and Afghanistan, when about 250 people were attending Friday prayers, said Hayat.

Television footage showed scores of residents and police officers digging frantically with their hands through the ruins of the white-walled mosque, whose roof collapsed in the explosion.

Rescuers hauled bodies covered in dust and blood on blankets and scarves toward ambulances and private cars waiting to take them to hospital. Crowds of anguished women waited in the background, hoping for news of loved-ones.

Hayat said rescuers had pulled 48 bodies from the rubble and predicted the toll would likely rise further. Another 80 people were injured, he said. Several police officers who had been manning a nearby checkpoint were reportedly among the victims.

The mosque in a rocky valley near the town of Jamrud lies on the main road along which trucks carry vital supplies to the expanding U.S.-led force in Afghanistan.

Suspected Taliban militants have carried out a string of attacks on both trucks and transport depots along the route in recent months, destroying scores of military vehicles, including Humvees, and raising doubts about the reliability of the supply line.

The area has also been beset by feuds between rival tribal and militant groups — some loosely allied with the government, others close to the Taliban — which have included suicide bombings and attacks on mosques, though none so deadly as Friday's blast.

Frustrated at Pakistan's failure to gain control of the border belt, the U.S. has carried out an intense campaign of missile strikes into the region since last year.

President Asif Ali Zardari on Friday reiterated Pakistan's opposition to the strikes, apparently carried out by unmanned CIA aircraft. The government says the attacks feed anti-American feeling and undermine its own effort to isolate extremists.

"We hope Obama is a name for change," Zardari told reporters in the southwestern province of Baluchistan, a region that some have speculated will be the next target of the drone attacks.

Zardari also urged Obama to take a "regional approach" as part of his new strategy for tackling extremism and terrorism, a change Pakistani officials hope would leave them shouldering less of the blame for the Taliban's resurgence.

The Afghan intelligence chief on Thursday accused Pakistan's powerful military spy service of secretly aiding the militants_ a charge vehemently denied in Islamabad.

Weary of rising violence inside their own borders, Pakistani authorities have struck peace deals in some Taliban-dominated areas, an approach Western officials complain lets militants step up the war in Afghanistan.

Three key Taliban commanders in Pakistan recently announced a new alliance to fight "infidels" led by "Obama, Zardari and (Afghan President Hamid) Karzai."

The commanders — Hafiz Gul Bahadur, Baitullah Mehsud and Maulvi Nazir — are based in the North and South Waziristan regions, the main focus of the U.S. missile strikes. The three are divided on tribal lines and have feuded in the past.

Their statement last month didn't say where the Ittehad-ul-Mujahideen, or Union of Holy Warriors, would focus its efforts.

Just for the ones who always seem to miss it.

Muslims killed by al-Qaida scum.

There is nothing good that comes out of the death Innocent people. Lets at least use this as another example of the separation that exists between devote Muslims, and crazy fuck that every culture religion, and race has.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[falxori 0]

I'm sure whoever did it felt oppressed, wronged or victimized somehow
how come you don't "understand" them like you do when an Israeli bus/restaurant/nightclub is blown up by Palestinians?

I just wonder how a suicide bomber is one place is understandable and in another place its "scum"

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Darius11 12]

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how come you don't "understand" them like you do when an Israeli bus/restaurant/nightclub is blown up by Palestinians?

Well if the suicide bomber was removed from his home, put in too a camp where the very people who took his home hold all the keys, if he has seen his family members murdered or has had close family murdered by the IDF as most kids in Gaza do, or if his house was bulldozed without any due process by the same people who kicked him out in the first place, and had seen the same for all his life done to him and all his people i would say every one of those reasons is enough to bread hate that can be understood.

Is the action a good one no, killing Innocent people never is. But is their a difference between someone who has all those reasons, and a person who want me to convert or die? For me there is a big difference, and i am sorry if you don't see it.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[champu 1]

ugh...

As usual for acts by AQ and/or TB, this is horrible. But also in this particular case... really really... REALLY really stupid... I hate to say it, but I thought more of them.

People have been pissed off by the missile strikes in Pakistan because they thought it was America's war with the Taliban drifting into their country. Well... guess what...

[falxori 0]

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Well if the suicide bomber was removed from his home, put in too a camp where the very people who took his home hold all the keys,

My family was kicked out of their home in Hebron.
My aunt was forced out of Persia as a kid and walked all the way from Iran to Israel. several of her family members didnt make it.
my 2 best friends' families were kicked out of their houses in Iraq and Egypt.

all of the above lived for several years in refugee camps.

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if he has seen his family members murdered or has had close family murdered

my uncle was murdered when a bus in Tel-Aviv blew up in 1996.
pretty much everyone in Israel has a family member or a friend who was hit by terrorism.

so according to your logic, I should be blowing up some civilians? after all, I have all of the reasons you've mentioned...

and to keep the thread on topic, I'm pretty sure whoever blew up this mosque in Pakistan will name the same reasons (i.e his way of life was destroyed, some of his extremist buddies or family members were killed, etc.)

the difference is not in the reasons. with you, its with the identity of the victims...

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Darius11 12]

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My aunt was forced out of Persia as a kid and walked all the way from Iran to Israel. several of her family members didnt make it.

Because he was Jewish? Or because of political issues? The reason I ask is we still have friends who are Jewish and live free in Iran.

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the difference is not in the reasons. with you, its with the identity of the victims...

Well that’s your assumption and I am sure of a few others, but you are simply not logical on the issue.

We were not comparing your family and OBL.

We were talking about what drives a Palestinian suicide bomber, and a member of Al-Qaeda. I think anyone can logically look at Al-Qaeda and see that they want you to convert or die. They view every one who is not one of them as infidels.

The Palestinians have history with the Israelis, The Israelis moved on their land and their homes. Now I understand that many Jews including your family have been trough a lot, but you actually making my point for me here. You are trying to use the excuses of the horrors Jews have been trough in the past to justify the horrors they inflict on others.

Do you really not see a difference?

If your that angry about the past move to Germany and seek revenge.

Honestly Ori if you can not see the difference between OBL, and Hamas then that’s your vision that has become cloudy. You mentioning pervious family problems that have nothing to do with the Palestinians is a good sign that you are losing your grip on logic.

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so according to your logic, I should be blowing up some civilians? after all, I have all of the reasons you've mentioned...

According to my logic, if you find a German guy who in WWII killed someone you love and kill him. I can understand that more then if you killed someone who has done nothing to you other then suffer by your hand.

Sorry you don’t get it, or want to get it.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[falxori 0]

nowhere in my post did I refer to Germany or WWII.
the incident I mentioned were cause by Arabs/Palestinians/Iranians, all very relevant and none has anything to do with the Holocaust or Nazi Germany.

so, should I go around killing Palestinians because they took my family house?
should my aunt go kill Persians because they've kicked her out of her homeland?


and yes, if you ask Al-Qaeda, they will say the Russians and then the Americans invaded their homeland. they will say the current Pakistani government is good enough of a reason to blow up a mosque, so yeah, i don't see a huge difference between them and Hamas.

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Darius11 12]

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so, should I go around killing Palestinians because they took my family house?
should my aunt go kill Persians because they've kicked her out of her homeland

You seem to always conveniently forget that there was no Israel until 48, as for ancestors who lived there it was not just the Jews who lived their but people of all religions, and before that people of no religion or ancient ones. Israel was made because of the horrors that the Jews suffered during WWII you might not want to talk about it but that is the reason Israel was made. So the Jews would have a homeland.

You seem to really try hard not to get that when you kick people of their land, and do all the things that have been done to the Palestinians they might have a reason for anger.

OBL is not from Afghanistan, or Pakistan. He believes that all the people who do not believe and do as he does are infidels.

HUGE difference which I believe is not convenient for you to see.

It is ridiculous to think the Palestinians have no legitimate reason to be angry, or to compare them to Al-quadia.

One is fighting for their land, freedom, dignity, and againts oppression. The other is a violent group that wants all to convert to their way or die.

Yep same thing

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[falxori 0]

in order to stick to the original subject...
let me just say this:
yes, the Palestinians have a legitimate reason to be angry. do they have a legitimate reason to blow people up? you say yes. I say no.

in the same way, AQ has a legitimate reason (in their eyes) to be angry because their Pakistani neighbours were not relegious enough (or whatever) and corrupted their way of life.

we always talk about different points of view....
I don't see the logic in Palestinians blowing up busses, you do.
you don't see the logic in AQ blowing up a mosque, but I'm sure it makes perfect sense to them.

"convert or die" might not be logical to you (good for you) but its their logic and they seem to believe it enough to blow up a mosque full of people...

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[Darius11 12]

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yes, the Palestinians have a legitimate reason to be angry. do they have a legitimate reason to blow people up? you say yes. I say no.

Actuly I have repeatedly said that the loss of any inocent life no matter who it is is always a sad occurrence. I have also called their actions counter productive.
All I said and am still saying is I can understand why the Palestinians have the anger and use the methods they do. I can see why they have anger, and I can see why they use suicide bombers.
It is mainly anger, and desperation.

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I don't see the logic in Palestinians blowing up busses, you do.
you don't see the logic in AQ blowing up a mosque, but I'm sure it makes perfect sense to them.

I think the big difference is this.

Most people can justify someone’s anger when their family or loved ones have been killed, or their home has been takin from them by force etc.

However I believe most of us agree that convert or die is not logical, and can easily say that they are the bad guys, and they are the ones who have got it all wrong.


One is trying to force you to believe as they do or be killed, the other is fighting for their home, or some are angry because they seek revenge.

AGAIN: NOT SAYING ITS OK TO KILL INOCENT PEOPLE< JUST SAYING WHEN THE PALESTININS DO IT I CAN SEE WHY, AND BELIVE MOST PEOPLE CAN AT LEAST JUSTFY THEIR ANGER.

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"convert or die" might not be logical to you (good for you) but its their logic and they seem to believe it enough to blow up a mosque full of people...

Is not logical to most people.

fighting for your home, and the people that you love is. Its something we can all relate to.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Amazon 7]

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Israel was made because of the horrors that the Jews suffered during WWII you might not want to talk about it but that is the reason Israel was made. So the Jews would have a homeland.

Forgetting a couple thousand years of history again Darius??????????

That seems popular in the muslim world.

I seem to remember all these guys that came after Abraham... for more than a thousand years....

[Darius11 12]

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Forgetting a couple thousand years of history again Darius

No I am not the forgetful one on here.

If you go back far enough there was no religion, as mentioned in this thread if you actually took the time to read before posting stock replay.

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That seems popular in the muslim world

From every post you have ever made about Muslims it is obvious you have no knowledge of the Muslim world other then what you learn on episodes of 24.

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I seem to remember all these guys that came after Abraham... for more than a thousand years....

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH


Again if you had takin the time to actually read the thread, you would see that the argument that started was because Ori said that all “terrorist” are the same.

And he could not understand why I call some scum but others like HAMAS I can understand their actions.

I think both him and I have realized the time argument is ridiculous, as each person can just choose which fits his or her argument. As stated before you can go back far enough before there was any religions or ancient ones.

But again what I was saying is there is a difference between a terrorist who wants you to convert to his way or die like OBL.

And a “terrorist” that is fighting to take back the land they were kicked of, or in desperation because of over 60 years of opperation.

To me the difference seems obvious to some not so much.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[falxori 0]

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because Ori said that all “terrorist” are the same.

that's not what I said.
I said that one could understand the reasons of AQ just as you understand the reasons of Hamas.

AQ is not all about "convert or die" as you say. otherwise how would you explain that most of its victims are muslims?
they fight for their way of life and control over the land there. they became violent when foreign nations were present in the area, risking what they believed to be the right way.

so no, in my eyes, Hamas and AQ are not the same, but they are not so different either.

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as each person can just choose which fits his or her argument

yet you keep saying the Palestinians were kicked out of their land. don't you set a timeline that fits your view? isn't this land "liberated" if you set the starting date differently?

so no, the who was here first debate is useless as both of us are here now. but "being angry" and blowing things up is not justified. by your logic, I have every right to blow some palestinians up as well.

"Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero."

[tbrown 26]

"As the prayer leader said 'God is Great', the bomb went off with a big bang,"

[Amazon 7]

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And a “terrorist” that is fighting to take back the land they were kicked of, or in desperation because of over 60 years of opperation.

To me the difference seems obvious to some not so much.

And the apologist extraordinaire rolls on.... and on... and on....


The HISTORY of the area is VERY long.. and you and your fellow travellers.. wisht that would just go away... IT DOES MAKE A DIFFERENCE


Anything that does not agree with your hate Israel mantra.. just does not exist

Personally I am of the mind that if they are unwilling to make peace.....I think its time to just kill all of the morons in Gaza and settle it once and for all... let your version of god sort them out.