billvon 2,991 #76 August 13, 2009 >You don’t know that! I know there is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insurance." >NO ONE can honesty tell you that in the end that they can guarantee >that your insurance will be available. You're right! We should stick with a more reliable system like this one: =========================== Family sues insurer who denied teen transplant updated 3:00 p.m. PT, Fri., Dec . 21, 2007 GLENDALE, Calif. - The family of a 17-year-old girl who died hours after her health insurer reversed a decision and said it would pay for a liver transplant plans to sue the company, their attorney said Friday. Nataline Sarkisyan died Thursday at about 6 p.m. at the University of California, Los Angeles Medical Center. She had been in a vegetative state for weeks, said her mother, Hilda. Attorney Mark Geragos said he plans to ask the district attorney to press murder or manslaughter charges against Cigna HealthCare in the case. The insurer “maliciously killed her” because it did not want to bear the expense of her transplant and aftercare, Geragos said. ============================ Can't have girls like that surviving! Where's the profit in that? 100% private coverage is clearly superior to anything the government can come up with. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #77 August 13, 2009 Quote>You don’t know that! I know there is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insurance." >NO ONE can honesty tell you that in the end that they can guarantee >that your insurance will be available. You're right! We should stick with a more reliable system like this one: =========================== Family sues insurer who denied teen transplant updated 3:00 p.m. PT, Fri., Dec . 21, 2007 GLENDALE, Calif. - The family of a 17-year-old girl who died hours after her health insurer reversed a decision and said it would pay for a liver transplant plans to sue the company, their attorney said Friday. Nataline Sarkisyan died Thursday at about 6 p.m. at the University of California, Los Angeles Medical Center. She had been in a vegetative state for weeks, said her mother, Hilda. Attorney Mark Geragos said he plans to ask the district attorney to press murder or manslaughter charges against Cigna HealthCare in the case. The insurer “maliciously killed her” because it did not want to bear the expense of her transplant and aftercare, Geragos said. ============================ Can't have girls like that surviving! Where's the profit in that? 100% private coverage is clearly superior to anything the government can come up with. We were on Cigna for a while (employer plan, no option). It was just awful; I have no doubt this story is accurate. I see that a former Cigna exec is now a strong advocate for a public plan, citing the abuses he saw in the private insurance sector. www.youtube.com/watch?v=A03HyG3RGnQ... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #78 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteAnother lie. No one will take away your insurance.You don’t know that! How much do you want to bet that there will be people that lose their currant coverage? We have already been informed by both our actuary and carrier that our plan will change if the present proposed bill is passed. NO ONE can honesty tell you that in the end that they can guarantee that your insurance will be available. The great and might savior Obama with her deciple Pelosi can do no wrong. What the bill says (has been linked to in many threads) has no bearing on the reality or the truth. The glasses of (some stupid damn dumb color) will show you the truth and the way should you chose to believe. Author: billvon"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #79 August 13, 2009 QuoteI know there is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insuranceThen what you think you know is wrong. Directly from the bill " Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law." Now according to our actuary, attorneys and carrier this means that we no longer will be able to leave this employment and pick up an individual policy to continue the coverage. So yes, this bill will take away the right that I have now to continue my current insurance if I leave here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #80 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteI know there is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insuranceThen what you think you know is wrong. Directly from the bill " Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law." Now according to our actuary, attorneys and carrier this means that we no longer will be able to leave this employment and pick up an individual policy to continue the coverage. So yes, this bill will take away the right that I have now to continue my current insurance if I leave here. Shhhhhh You defile the great one........... bad juju...."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #81 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteI know there is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insuranceThen what you think you know is wrong. Directly from the bill " Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law." Now according to our actuary, attorneys and carrier this means that we no longer will be able to leave this employment and pick up an individual policy to continue the coverage. So yes, this bill will take away the right that I have now to continue my current insurance if I leave here. RED HERRING. That relates only to GRANDFATHERED plans as has already been explained several times. And if you "leave here" under existing circumstances, chances are very good your new employer won't give you the "current insurance", either. When I changed employer I was forced to change insurer.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #82 August 13, 2009 QuoteThat relates only to GRANDFATHERED plans as has already been explained several times. And if you "leave here" under existing circumstances, chances are very good your new employer won't give you the "current insurance", either. When I changed employer I was forced to change insurer.Bill made a blanket statement of fact that the proposed bill "can't take away your current insurance". That is not true and I stated the part of the bill that addressee it and an example of how the current coverage could be taken away. Also, I never addressed what a new employer would or could do; I stated the inability under the bill to continue the coverage under a private policy which I can do now. So the RED HERRING is back to you for trying to twist what was not said. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #83 August 13, 2009 [QuoteShhhhhh You defile the great one........... bad juju.... I understand that emotions and confusion are running high with this issue so pardon me if I feel this only contributes to the problem. Our health care system is in what I would call a survival mode in that it can't continue on this path and survive. Don't get me wrong, I have great insurance and really don't want it to change but I see both sides of it on a daily basis and have to deal with the patients, insurers, doctors etc. We need to make changes but I stand by my position that what is proposed is just as bad if not worse than what we have. As with almost anything, there are good proposals and bad within the bill and as I have stated before I think that trying to fix everything at once can only lead to further disaster. This is an issue where calm complete understanding by congress needs to occur before passing any proposed bill. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #84 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteThat relates only to GRANDFATHERED plans as has already been explained several times. And if you "leave here" under existing circumstances, chances are very good your new employer won't give you the "current insurance", either. When I changed employer I was forced to change insurer.Bill made a blanket statement of fact that the proposed bill "can't take away your current insurance". That is not true and I stated the part of the bill that addressee it and an example of how the current coverage could be taken away. Also, I never addressed what a new employer would or could do; I stated the inability under the bill to continue the coverage under a private policy which I can do now. So the RED HERRING is back to you for trying to twist what was not said. If you "pick up an individual policy" (your own words) you aren't, by definition, continuing your current insurance. You need to read 3 pages on to see about picking up a new individual policy, and it certainly isn't prohibited.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #85 August 13, 2009 QuoteIf you "pick up an individual policy" (your own words) you aren't, by definition, continuing your current insurance. You need to read 3 pages on to see about picking up a new individual policy, and it certainly isn't prohibited.Play what ever sophomoric word games you chose. The fact is right now I can transfer my existing employer provided policy to an individual policy with no lapse in coverage. This is not allowed upon passage of the existing proposed bill. This is according to our carrier that addressed this issue two days ago to our group. So go tell them that they will provide it, I need a good laugh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #86 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteIf you "pick up an individual policy" (your own words) you aren't, by definition, continuing your current insurance. You need to read 3 pages on to see about picking up a new individual policy, and it certainly isn't prohibited.Play what ever sophomoric word games you chose. The fact is right now I can transfer my existing employer provided policy to an individual policy with no lapse in coverage. This is not allowed upon passage of the existing proposed bill. This is according to our carrier that addressed this issue two days ago to our group. So go tell them that they will provide it, I need a good laugh. Perhaps you should just read the bill (which does, incidentally, consist of words that have meanings) instead of believing those with a clear and obvious axe to grind.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #87 August 13, 2009 QuotePerhaps you should just read the bill (which does, incidentally, consist of words that have meanings) instead of believing those with a clear and obvious axe to grind.Perhaps you should just read the post. Since I posted the applicable paragraph directly out of the bill I guess that I have been reading it (up to page 5XX so far) which is probably a lot more than some of congress has that are going to vote on it. Your right though, why should I even consider what the eight doctors in the practice, actuary, attorneys and carriers have to say since according to you we contract with them to tell us what we want to hear and not what we need to know. How about if you Bill and I agree on this, we all agree that something needs to be done. The difference is just what that is. How is that for a start? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #88 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteIf you "pick up an individual policy" (your own words) you aren't, by definition, continuing your current insurance. You need to read 3 pages on to see about picking up a new individual policy, and it certainly isn't prohibited.Play what ever sophomoric word games you chose. The fact is right now I can transfer my existing employer provided policy to an individual policy with no lapse in coverage. This is not allowed upon passage of the existing proposed bill. This is according to our carrier that addressed this issue two days ago to our group. So go tell them that they will provide it, I need a good laugh. And obviously your PRIVATE INSURANCE CORPORATION is totally unbiased and giving you completely neutral and well educated information...~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #89 August 13, 2009 QuoteAnd obviously your PRIVATE INSURANCE CORPORATION is totally unbiased and giving you completely neutral and well educated information...We deal with several company's (patients insurers) and all of the information has been consistent. Also, if you read any of the business reports you would know that the insurance companies have already positioned themselves and made sure that the bill is crafted so that they still will make millions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,991 #90 August 13, 2009 >Now according to our actuary, attorneys and carrier this means that we >no longer will be able to leave this employment and pick up an individual >policy to continue the coverage. So yes, this bill will take away the right >that I have now to continue my current insurance if I leave here. Incorrect. You can keep your current insurance. You can keep your current insurance if you leave your job. If you want to quit your job and buy private insurance from a different company (i.e. a "individual health insurance issuer") you will have to buy it through the insurance exchange, an exchange which has a few requirements for entry (like covering existing conditions.) There is no provision in the bill to "take away your current insurance." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrendaHupp 0 #91 August 13, 2009 EVERY professional out there that has stated otherwise is wrong, the quoted bill information does not exist and you are right.....got itBy the way, I never said anything about buying a policy from another company. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rivetgeek 0 #92 August 13, 2009 Quote EVERY professional out there that has stated otherwise is wrong, the quoted bill information does not exist and you are right.....got itBy the way, I never said anything about buying a policy from another company. I work with doctors and lawyers. The lawyers hate this bill, the doctors love it. Thats good enough for me.~Bones Knit, blood clots, glory is forever, and chicks dig scars.~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #93 August 13, 2009 Quote EVERY professional out there that has stated otherwise is wrong, the quoted bill information does not exist and you are right.....got itBy the way, I never said anything about buying a policy from another company. Would these be the same people that convinced you CARS.GOV would turn your computer into a government zombie?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #94 August 13, 2009 Quote>the big deal is that we won't be able to keep our currant coverage for very >long after the bill is signed. Another lie. No one will take away your insurance. QuoteI guess you still have not read page 16 & 17 of the bills. it doesn't say you will have it taken away but it does say you can not change any part of the policy, like adding a dependant, change the levels of coverage, and the company can not change the price without the comissioners aproval. that tells me that we wont be able to keep that policy for more than 1 year in most cases. just enough to cause a slow transition to government controlled insurance coverage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #95 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuote>the big deal is that we won't be able to keep our currant coverage for very >long after the bill is signed. Another lie. No one will take away your insurance. QuoteI guess you still have not read page 16 & 17 of the bills. it doesn't say you will have it taken away but it does say you can not change any part of the policy, like adding a dependant, change the levels of coverage, and the company can not change the price without the comissioners aproval. that tells me that we wont be able to keep that policy for more than 1 year in most cases. just enough to cause a slow transition to government controlled insurance coverage. You misread it, or more likely were misled about it.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #96 August 13, 2009 I not sure what doctors you are talking about, but all the ones I have talked to do not like obamacare Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #97 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuote>the big deal is that we won't be able to keep our currant coverage for very >long after the bill is signed. Another lie. No one will take away your insurance. QuoteI guess you still have not read page 16 & 17 of the bills. it doesn't say you will have it taken away but it does say you can not change any part of the policy, like adding a dependant, change the levels of coverage, and the company can not change the price without the comissioners aproval. that tells me that we wont be able to keep that policy for more than 1 year in most cases. just enough to cause a slow transition to government controlled insurance coverage. You misread it, or more likely were misled about it. Quotewhat part did I missread? I read the pages and understand english, what did I not understand? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #98 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote>the big deal is that we won't be able to keep our currant coverage for very >long after the bill is signed. Another lie. No one will take away your insurance. QuoteI guess you still have not read page 16 & 17 of the bills. it doesn't say you will have it taken away but it does say you can not change any part of the policy, like adding a dependant, change the levels of coverage, and the company can not change the price without the comissioners aproval. that tells me that we wont be able to keep that policy for more than 1 year in most cases. just enough to cause a slow transition to government controlled insurance coverage. You misread it, or more likely were misled about it. Quotewhat part did I missread? I read the pages and understand english, what did I not understand? You got 102-1(B) backwards, and misstated the meaning of 102-2 and 102-3.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #99 August 13, 2009 Ok so I did miss read the dependant coverage addition, but the terms and conditions cannot be altered and that means your insurance company cannot make adjustments to your coverage without loosing your currant policy. therefore you will have to go into the government pool at that point. As far as page 17, policy premiums can be changed but only "as specified by the commissioner". Last time I checked, a company will discontinue a product if it becomes not profitable, if the company cannot control pricing when that product base price increases it will become unprofitable and be dropped. Also remember that this is a guideline, the actual parameters will be set by a congressional panel. That means this is probably the best the situation will be and will probably get worse when the details get worked on. I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #100 August 13, 2009 Quote I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. I don't trust anyone over 30.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 4 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
kallend 2,027 #98 August 13, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote>the big deal is that we won't be able to keep our currant coverage for very >long after the bill is signed. Another lie. No one will take away your insurance. QuoteI guess you still have not read page 16 & 17 of the bills. it doesn't say you will have it taken away but it does say you can not change any part of the policy, like adding a dependant, change the levels of coverage, and the company can not change the price without the comissioners aproval. that tells me that we wont be able to keep that policy for more than 1 year in most cases. just enough to cause a slow transition to government controlled insurance coverage. You misread it, or more likely were misled about it. Quotewhat part did I missread? I read the pages and understand english, what did I not understand? You got 102-1(B) backwards, and misstated the meaning of 102-2 and 102-3.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #99 August 13, 2009 Ok so I did miss read the dependant coverage addition, but the terms and conditions cannot be altered and that means your insurance company cannot make adjustments to your coverage without loosing your currant policy. therefore you will have to go into the government pool at that point. As far as page 17, policy premiums can be changed but only "as specified by the commissioner". Last time I checked, a company will discontinue a product if it becomes not profitable, if the company cannot control pricing when that product base price increases it will become unprofitable and be dropped. Also remember that this is a guideline, the actual parameters will be set by a congressional panel. That means this is probably the best the situation will be and will probably get worse when the details get worked on. I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #100 August 13, 2009 Quote I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. I don't trust anyone over 30.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 4 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
marks2065 0 #99 August 13, 2009 Ok so I did miss read the dependant coverage addition, but the terms and conditions cannot be altered and that means your insurance company cannot make adjustments to your coverage without loosing your currant policy. therefore you will have to go into the government pool at that point. As far as page 17, policy premiums can be changed but only "as specified by the commissioner". Last time I checked, a company will discontinue a product if it becomes not profitable, if the company cannot control pricing when that product base price increases it will become unprofitable and be dropped. Also remember that this is a guideline, the actual parameters will be set by a congressional panel. That means this is probably the best the situation will be and will probably get worse when the details get worked on. I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #100 August 13, 2009 Quote I don't trust the government especially after the last few years. I don't trust anyone over 30.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
