Yet more buffoooooonery.

[juanesky 0]

Really Wendy, have you ever been there? Have you seen their "public hospitals"? People with good pockets can afford to go there, to the private clinics they have to feed this notion, but the ordinary citizen can't even get an aspirin.

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[dreamdancer 0]

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Really Wendy, have you ever been there? Have you seen their "public hospitals"? People with good pockets can afford to go there, to the private clinics they have to feed this notion, but the ordinary citizen can't even get an aspirin.

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When Fidel Castro came to power, Cuba's mortality rates matched many other places in the developing world, with a life expectancy of 48 for men and 54 for women. Now it rivals anywhere in Europe or the US.

Male life expectancy is 74 - the same as in the UK. Women can expect to live to 76 years old (79 in the UK) and infant mortality is 7.1 per 100,000 births - not much higher than ours.

However, one major difference between Cuba's health statistics and ours has caught the attention of officials: here, healthcare costs £750 a head annually. In Cuba it costs £7.

Among those who went on the Cuban trip earlier this year were the principal medical officer of the Department of Health, Phillip Leach, the eminent academic Sir Brian Jarman and the president of the Royal College of GPs, Sir Dennis Pereira Gray.

Patrick Pietroni, a dean of postgraduate general practice at London University, who led the visit, said: "What we can learn is how they have managed to produce these healthcare statistics which are sometimes better than ours at 1% of the expenditure. They have more family doctors, who are better trained than our GPs.

"When we went to Cuba what was so impressive were the three-storey buildings called consultorio. The ground floor was the practice, the first floor was the doctor's flat and the second floor was the nurse's flat. No Cuban lives more than 20 minutes or so from one of these."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2000/oct/02/NHS.futureofthenhs

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[wmw999 2,447]

No, I haven't been there. But a friend's wife has been there (she's a doctor), and she said that while the facilities are poor, the doctors are quite good.

My main point here is to say that just about everything has more than one side. Even Cuba has nice people in it, some good doctors, and there are probably people who like it there.

While Fidel Castro is not a nice man , Batista wasn't a whole lot better by the end of his time -- ties to organized crime, violence against those who disagreed with him, etc. He got into power via a coup, not an election. Even the US had decided to stop sending aid.

Communism is not our system. But don't give it more power by ascribing feelings or innate qualities to it -- there is some good potential in there, just as there is bad potential in unfettered capitalism. The good far outweighs the bad for capitalism for me (and most people).

But if someone wanted to live in a communistic society with like-minded others, would you forciblly stop them?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[juanesky 0]

Well you should, and I have, not only visited there but also have many cuban friends. It is not the same rosy picture you want to believe on how great the healthcare is in Cuba.

People from the party, military, some police and people with means (read foreigners with money) are the ones that can get medication.

If they would open the borders, as they did in the early 80's the exodus will be as big.

You try to make it about the "cuban people", I am referring to the Cuban regime, and its treatment of its people.

Do you know how many "doctors" are exiles in Miami. Almost 40% of the exiles I have known have told me they are doctors or engineers, there still only one that proved me wrong.

I would not forcibilly stop anyone from doing anything that is related to only them. But I see that no one dares to get by any means to Cuba, the traffic is only one way from there. Outbound.

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[dreamdancer 0]

as well as good health cuba also has lots of good fishing and diving

stay away from moving propellers - they bite
blue skies from thai sky adventures
good solid response-provoking keyboarding

[TankBuster 0]

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Male life expectancy is 74 - the same as in the UK. Women can expect to live to 76 years old (79 in the UK)

Unless, of course, you happen to disagree with the government, or want to leave the island. At that point life expectancy can be calculated by adding 2 or 3 hours to current age.

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[TomAiello 26]

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I'm sure you understand the ability to distinguish necessary government functions (ie those required to preserve individual liberty), and nanny state spending, (ie forced savings, forced charity, etc.)

Actually, I think that's what the political debate in this country is primarily about: where to draw the line. If it were as obvious as you think it is, we would have no need for Speakers Corner.

That's not true at all. The political debate is about the need for the "nanny state" spending, not where the line is drawn.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 26]

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But if someone wanted to live in a communistic society with like-minded others, would you forciblly stop them?

No.

But what if he was forcing other people to do so, and they didn't want to? Would you forcibly rescue them?

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[DanG 1]

Only if you think that everyone agrees what constitutes "nanny state" spending.

You have a reputation of being very libertarian in your views, which I respect. I have a feeling that spending you believe is "nanny state", many other people would see as a normal and necessary function of government.

It's all about where to draw the line.

- Dan G

[Darius11 12]

***Rush Limbaugh ***


You lost me at Rush Limbaugh.

To simply ignore that he has been on a mission to find anything negative or to make it up as he goes is dishonest at best.
Not to mention for a person who has called others traitor I don’t find any thing more disgusting then him hoping for the failure of our nation. He uses people’s ignorance to line his pockets. In other words FUCK RUSH LIMBAUGH and anyone who wants this country to fail.

You lost the race get over it. You also fucked the country up more then any terrorist ever could when you elected dumbass for the 2nd time, and the rep. were in charge.

Why do we even humor them? NO ONE FUCKED THIS COUNTRY MORE THEN THE REPUBLICANS IN THE PAST 8 YEARS.
So why should anyone with a functioning brain even listen to them any more? Key words being functioning brain.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[TomAiello 26]

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NO ONE FUCKED THIS COUNTRY MORE THEN THE REPUBLICANS IN THE PAST 8 YEARS.

So, we should hand everything over to the other party, which was complicit in that fuck-overing?

Just because I don't like a lot of things that were done does not mean I have to accept whatever is offered as the only alternative.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TankBuster 0]

Wow. Touched a nerve, huh? Rush is out to make money, I agree, but my point is he predicted the race card on policy issues. You can't deny that.

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I don’t find any thing more disgusting then him hoping for the failure of our nation.

Show me where he said that, and I too will toss him under the bus, Obama style.

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FUCK RUSH LIMBAUGH

You go ahead. He's to old and fat for me.

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Key words being functioning brain.

Is yours functioning in a rational manner? You do remember that the Democrats held the majority of both houses in the two years preceeding the recession?

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[kelpdiver 2]

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However, one major difference between Cuba's health statistics and ours has caught the attention of officials: here, healthcare costs £750 a head annually. In Cuba it costs £7.

Anyone believe either number to be accurate?

Health care at $10-11/person annually (ie, a copay on a single doctor visit) sounds much like the annual wheat harvest figures coming from the USSR.

[Darius11 12]

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So, we should hand everything over to the other party, which was complicit in that fuck-overing?

You mean in the 200 days? or are you forgetting they were the minoraty before?
Who would you blame more the people with less power screaming your wrong or the ones with most of the power who drove us in the ditch.


Here is what I expect. When your wrong admit it and change your approach. What’s that saying the definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over but expecting different results. That to me is the republicans. They fucked this country with their bull-shit beliefs and ass hats like Rush Limfuck and the idiot sheep that listen to these ass holes like their god.

When we were screaming that GWB did this and that (too many fuck ups to list) guess what we were right. He was they were.

But whats the right doing? Death panels?

Sorry but i am insulted that every american is not smart enough to be insulted with such BS.

When they keep on shouting crap it makes me lose respect for them and the people who act as if the BS is real reasons.



[

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Darius11 12]

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Wow. Touched a nerve, huh? Rush is out to make money, I agree, but my point is he predicted the race card on policy issues. You can't deny that.

I am a bit touchy. I feel we have spent too much time being nice to the stupid and we need to be more aggressive to fix our country. I am sick of just hearing from the insane and I am sick of hypocrisy.
200 days too 8 years. It seems now days we are arguing about things that should not be up for debate. Obama did not fuck this country up he inherited it, and for so many to just look past this HUGE point is ridiculous to me.

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Show me where he said that, and I too will toss him under the bus

"I hope he fails"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNAFfBrYcvw

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[TankBuster 0]

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When they keep on shouting crap it makes me lose respect for them and the people who act as if the BS is real reasons.

Just as we will for you if you keep shouting crap/fuck/ asshat/limfuck etc rather than making a rational argument.

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[rushmc 23]

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Wow. Touched a nerve, huh? Rush is out to make money, I agree, but my point is he predicted the race card on policy issues. You can't deny that.

I am a bit touchy. I feel we have spent too much time being nice to the stupid and we need to be more aggressive to fix our country. I am sick of just hearing from the insane and I am sick of hypocrisy.
200 days too 8 years. It seems now days we are arguing about things that should not be up for debate. Obama did not fuck this country up he inherited it, and for so many to just look past this HUGE point is ridiculous to me.

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Show me where he said that, and I too will toss him under the bus

"I hope he fails"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNAFfBrYcvw

I cant see youtube here but, if it is the complete quote in context, you just defeated your own point



And the reason your are so pissy is because your man is looking real bad as of late with no change in site.

NO president, in the history of the type of polls used today, has lost more points, faster this early than Obama. And Obama has only himself and his in your face arogance to blame

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[TomAiello 26]

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Who would you blame more the people with less power screaming your wrong or the ones with most of the power who drove us in the ditch.

What I'd like is someone who isn't headed for the same ditch over and over again. The Republicans crashed us into a huge mess. The Democrats idea of getting out of it appears to be "just keep driving in the same direction."

How about we pull the car out of the ditch, turn around, and head in the other direction. Just jamming the accelerator down while the front end is in the ditch doesn't appear to be accomplishing much, aside, perhaps from driving us deeper into the same ditch we're already in.

Where's the choice?

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TankBuster 0]

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"I hope he fails"

Well, I guess Rush is safe for now.

The forecast is mostly sunny with occasional beer.

[turtlespeed 220]

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I'm sure you understand the ability to distinguish necessary government functions (ie those required to preserve individual liberty), and nanny state spending, (ie forced savings, forced charity, etc.)

Actually, I think that's what the political debate in this country is primarily about: where to draw the line. If it were as obvious as you think it is, we would have no need for Speakers Corner.

If Obama has his way, there won't be a different opinion other than his, and Carl's. There will be no more political debate needed.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[DanG 1]

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If Obama has his way, there won't be a different opinion other than his, and Carl's. There will be no more political debate needed.

I agree that Carl's Jr. makes a tasty burger, but why do you think they should run the country?

- Dan G

[turtlespeed 220]

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If Obama has his way, there won't be a different opinion other than his, and Carl's. There will be no more political debate needed.

I agree that Carl's Jr. makes a tasty burger, but why do you think they should run the country?

I like In & Out myself Sorry you missed the innundo that Obama might be leaning a little to the Carl MARX side of things.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[DanG 1]

Oh, you mean Karl.

Why didn't you say so?

- Dan G

[turtlespeed 220]

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Oh, you mean Karl.

Why didn't you say so?

My "K" is broken

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[kelpdiver 2]

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I like In & Out myself Sorry you missed the innundo that Obama might be leaning a little to the Carl MARX side of things.

Karl Max was against religion. Obama was castigated for being too close to religious figures.