Political Warfare-Will there be a civil war based on ideological lines?

[rushmc 23]

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Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Good point. I am sure we were called 'insurgents' by King George at some point. Lets clear up some of your so called "points"

To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government. for non-citizens

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)for non-citizens or battle feild prisoners

3. Withdrew from the Geneva Conventions (CIA Torture policy)your interpitation

4. Worked very hard to repeal Row vs. Wade Really? When and where?

5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act)again for non-citizens with plenty of help from your chozen party

6. Repealed the Posse Comitatus Act, which allowed him to use the military in law enforcement activities on American soil, expressly against the constitution. Really?

And then we have tax cuts for the top 1% of the uber-rich, giveouts to big oil and corporations on the taxpayer dime, the outsourcing of American jobs to India and China, the 500 billion dollar trade deficit, 150 dollar a barrel oil, raping the social security trust fund, reduction of worker rights and busting up of unions, the deliberate lies told by the administration in the runup to the Iraq war... This is just damn funny. Thanks

Did I miss anything? Most all of it

And that's just the stuff we know about...

So far the democrats have told the justice department that they are going to respect the rights of the states to set drug policy and not prosecute individuals that are in compliance with state law, a right that was not bestowed to individuals in the Bush administration. Ah, none of the shit you listed (even though distorted at best) could have been done without Many dems

So, we have the democrats adding rights, and Bush trashing the constitution/bill of rights every chance he got... So is it the democrats or the republicans that are trying to "stifle your rights?"

What planet did you get this all from?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kelpdiver 2]

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Well some others have posted that they believe that a war is looming on the horizon. Apparently they believe the conservatives are going to start civil unrest and follow up with shootings.

Uh, examples? Aside from the 9/11 conspiracy nuts.

[marks2065 0]

yep all you said I agree with except that Americans would stand up and fight if the situation did come to that

[Lucky... 0]

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Personally I do not think it would happen, at least not by the conservatives hand.

Why? Don't most radicals come from that side?

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Of course that does not mean they would not finish it.

Right, because they're the toughest

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Revolting against politics in a violent fashion has long been the turf of the ideological zealot liberal.

Exactly, those liberal people who kill abortion doctors; you're so right And what does let's say PETA do? They might throw paint on a fur coat, tear up an animal lab or protest on a ship like Greenpeace. Libs ruin property, conservs kill people.

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They embrace Fidel, Che Guevara, Mao, Chavez, and a few others as well.

Pls show me which American liberals embrace those and in which fashion.

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It seems to be that even the POTUS wanted to foment fear of the conservatives when he exclaimed that people cling to their guns and religion.

He ws simply illustrating the ignrant redneck who is scared and w/o HC or a job grabbing their gun and toting a bible to justify it.

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I was listening to our Bishop who holds several PhD s.

That explains the above.

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He was speaking of the parallels of Germany in 1932 and what we are seeing in the USA now.

Did he measn 1933? Let me teach a bible thumper a few things:

- Hilter took office early 1933
- He soon after set up concentration camps to house these people:
-Liberal Democrats
-Socialists
-Communists
-Homosexuals
-Anyone not in-line with fascist Nazi ideals

He would have sewn triangles on their jumpsuits to identify their pref from the above list.

So educate us as to how Obama is like that. Pls try to stay in this solar system.

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Why is it that at every turn we see this administration and it's rapid followers to embrace stripping others of their freedoms/rights because they do not agree with them?

Which freedoms/rts?

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If you do not believe in the 2nd Amendment, why do you think the others should have that right removed?

How has Obama done anything to remove or limit that?

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If yo do not believe in religion or god, why do you want others from believing or practicing their faith?

How has Obama done that? Also, freedom of religion also means freedom from religion. I don't think you get that.

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If you believe in free speech why do you want others stifled?

How has he done that?

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I do not want to practice homosexual behavior, but I think if someone else wants to without infringing upon another go for it.

So what's your beef? Who's 'shoving it' down your throat?

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I do not think everyone should have to own a firearm, if you don't want to, fine. Just don't insist on others having that right removed.

Who's doing that?

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If you want to do drugs, I don't care as long as you don't harm others.

I despise drugs and agree, but drugs do permeate into all of society. We can skydive alone, we can't use drugs alone.

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If you want to commit suicide, go ahead, as long as you do not harm others.

Sure. How is Obama stopping that?

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If you want to refuse military service, fine, just don't insist on others doing as you do.

I think Dems are closer to compulsory service than are R's. Most Socialist nations have CS, so you are on the other end of that with your party.

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If you think we should leave AQ alone, fine, just do not ask for protection from them.

It's not that simple, it's about spending 1T and 5k lives to unsettle that region when no real good will come of it.

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There are many examples I can think of but why is it that the people who voted for Obama want to restrict the rights and freedoms of others.

You have clammered constantly about this deprivation, but have yet cite one with support.

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Why do they think that conservatives will commit civil warfare?

They won't, they're full of hot air.

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This is a serious topic and one that needs to be answered thoughtfully and without derisive remarks or jokes, so please if you have nothing to contribute, stay out of it.

Ok, I'll stay out.

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I am not saying if you have other ideas you cannot voice them, I just don't want the usual offenders to attempt destroying what could be a good debate.

We'll just agree with you then.

[Lucky... 0]

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Revolting against politics in a violent fashion has long been the turf of the ideological zealot liberal

Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Wendy P.

Nice one. Yes, the Rev War and the Emancipation Proclamation were 2 of the biggest liberal acts of all US history.

[Lucky... 0]

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It was more than just political differences that led to the Revolutionary War.

If it were merely just political rhetoric it would have never happened.

Of course you already knew this.

Yea, it ws taxation w/o representation; that's not political at all

[Lucky... 0]

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Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Good point. I am sure we were called 'insurgents' by King George at some point.

To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government.

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)

3. Withdrew from the Geneva Conventions (CIA Torture policy)

4. Worked very hard to repeal Row vs. Wade

5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act)

6. Repealed the Posse Comitatus Act, which allowed him to use the military in law enforcement activities on American soil, expressly against the constitution.

And then we have tax cuts for the top 1% of the uber-rich, giveouts to big oil and corporations on the taxpayer dime, the outsourcing of American jobs to India and China, the 500 billion dollar trade deficit, 150 dollar a barrel oil, raping the social security trust fund, reduction of worker rights and busting up of unions, the deliberate lies told by the administration in the runup to the Iraq war...

Did I miss anything?

And that's just the stuff we know about...

So far the democrats have told the justice department that they are going to respect the rights of the states to set drug policy and not prosecute individuals that are in compliance with state law, a right that was not bestowed to individuals in the Bush administration.

So, we have the democrats adding rights, and Bush trashing the constitution/bill of rights every chance he got... So is it the democrats or the republicans that are trying to "stifle your rights?"

Tried to shove thru the 28th Homophobe Amendment.

[grimmie 186]

The only Civil War that is going to happen is Rush, Hannity and Bill O' doing daily battle with Rachel, Chris and Keith.

The rest of us are too damn busy trying to make ends meet to start anything but our cars in the morning to go to work...

[Lucky... 0]

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Sorry, wave the flag around all you want to, but the founding fathers wouldn't even recognize the country they founded if they saw it today.

WASHINGTON: Hey Jefferson, why are all these coloreds' running around freely?

JEFFERSON: I dunno, maybe they figured out how to get out of their cages; next thing you know they'll be moving on up to the Eastside! Hey, there goes that one I fucked yesterday.

[Lucky... 0]

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your interpitation

And you chide my hurried spelling errors? That's not even an error, that's ebonics.

[kbordson 8]

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Exactly, those liberal people who kill abortion doctors; you're so right And what does let's say PETA do? They might throw paint on a fur coat, tear up an animal lab or protest on a ship like Greenpeace. Libs ruin property, conservs kill people.

Really?

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“Arson, property destruction, burglary, and theft are ‘acceptable crimes’ when used for the animal cause.”
— PETA co-founder Alex Pacheco

source

People get killed in arson. Allowing that, as an "acceptable crime", is NOT just a simple demonstration for rights. It's violence. Accept it and don't say "but... they're innocent." No, they're not. They just think that their crimes are justified.

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This is a serious topic and one that needs to be answered thoughtfully and without derisive remarks or jokes, so please if you have nothing to contribute, stay out of it.

Ok, I'll stay out.

Yeah... and I'm blond.

(wait a sec while I go and find a youtube video to appropriately fit what I think of you - not who you are or even a comment on your beliefs... but to fit "what I think") JK

(yeah... doesn't work for me, either....)

[Lucky... 0]

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The only Civil War that is going to happen is Rush, Hannity and Bill O' doing daily battle with Rachel, Chris and Keith.

The rest of us are too damn busy trying to make ends meet to start anything but our cars in the morning to go to work...

Right.... a lot of hot-winded Repubs down on their luck politically. Boo-fucking-who, 20 of 28 years have been R-run, so suck it up and welcome to the minority.

[Lucky... 0]

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Really?

Yes, really.

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“Arson, property destruction, burglary, and theft are ‘acceptable crimes’ when used for the animal cause.”
— PETA co-founder Alex Pacheco

How does that differ from what I wrote? I did write that property destruction, or as I wrote, 'tearing up property' I think it was, was ok to PETA. Not sure how your point opposes what I wrote.

PETA's rules are for not injuring people or animals. Just because fire does injure people doesn't mean it has to. Has PETA ever injured anyone? I checked and couldn't find anyone they've injured. They're pretty careful, as that would tarnish their agenda.

[birdshit 0]

Damn, lucky! That is the best response point by point ever! I love it! Especially the part about:

- He soon after set up concentration camps to house these people:
-Liberal Democrats
-Socialists
-Communists
-Homosexuals
-Anyone not in-line with fascist Nazi Republican ideals

Sounds like something George Bush would do...

Why not just toss a grenade in the guys sleeping bag? Sheesh!

[Lucky... 0]

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Damn, lucky! That is the best response point by point ever! I love it! Especially the part about:

- He soon after set up concentration camps to house these people:
-Liberal Democrats
-Socialists
-Communists
-Homosexuals
-Anyone not in-line with fascist Nazi Republican ideals

Sounds like something George Bush would do...

Why not just toss a grenade in the guys sleeping bag? Sheesh!

Right, thx. I've done a lot of reading on the subject as of late. The Republcian doctrine most closely fits that process, the Dems are more Socialist maybe communist at an extreme. I laugh when I see the Dems compared to the Nazi Party, the R's are most closely related metaphorically.

[birdshit 0]

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Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Good point. I am sure we were called 'insurgents' by King George at some point. Lets clear up some of your so called "points"

To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government. for non-citizens

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)for non-citizens or battle feild prisoners

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

3. Withdrew from the Geneva Conventions (CIA Torture policy)your interpitation

Interpitation isnt a word. Interpretation is.

4. Worked very hard to repeal Row vs. Wade Really? When and where?

5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act) again for non-citizens with plenty of help from your chozen party Wrong, and chosen is spelled with an 's'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warrantless_surveillance_controversy

Actually the NSA wiretapped 300,000 americans. Really.

6. Repealed the Posse Comitatus Act, which allowed him to use the military in law enforcement activities on American soil, expressly against the constitution. Really?

Yes really. Do some research. I assume you have internet?

On September 26, 2006, President Bush urged Congress to consider revising federal laws so that U.S. armed forces could restore public order and enforce laws in the aftermath of a natural disaster, in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.

These changes were included in the John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007 (H.R. 5122), which was signed into law on Oct 17, 2006.[3]

Section 1076 is titled "Use of the Armed Forces in major public emergencies". It provided that:

The President may employ the armed forces... to... restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition... the President determines that... domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order... or [to] suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such... a condition... so hinders the execution of the laws... that any part or class of its people is deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law... or opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws.[4]

And then we have tax cuts for the top 1% of the uber-rich, giveouts to big oil and corporations on the taxpayer dime, the outsourcing of American jobs to India and China, the 500 billion dollar trade deficit, 150 dollar a barrel oil, raping the social security trust fund, reduction of worker rights and busting up of unions, the deliberate lies told by the administration in the runup to the Iraq war... This is just damn funny. Thanks

No problem. I am always good for a laugh

Did I miss anything? Most all of it

And that's just the stuff we know about...

So far the democrats have told the justice department that they are going to respect the rights of the states to set drug policy and not prosecute individuals that are in compliance with state law, a right that was not bestowed to individuals in the Bush administration.

So, we have the democrats adding rights, and Bush trashing the constitution/bill of rights every chance he got... So is it the democrats or the republicans that are trying to "stifle your rights?"

What planet did you get this all from?

earth. been there?

Come ON rushmc. Everything I stated was 100% truth. If you cant see it then you need to open your eyes.

[rushmc 23]

There is nearly always and exception or extreme example. You listed those things as generalities which is simple bull shit (flag thrown you have been penalized)

And the specifics you and yours love to forget is that this was done with open arms and the blessings of the Dems that were needed to pass these things you list. And then you go and yet again generalize it is Bush's fault

Back up 15 yards sir

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Good point. I am sure we were called 'insurgents' by King George at some point. Lets clear up some of your so called "points"

To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government. for non-citizens

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)for non-citizens or battle feild prisoners

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

3. Withdrew from the Geneva Conventions (CIA Torture policy)your interpitation

Interpitation isnt a word. Interpretation is.

4. Worked very hard to repeal Row vs. Wade Really? When and where?

5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act) again for non-citizens with plenty of help from your chozen party Wrong, and chosen is spelled with an 's'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warrantless_surveillance_controversy

Actually the NSA wiretapped 300,000 americans. Really.

6. Repealed the Posse Comitatus Act, which allowed him to use the military in law enforcement activities on American soil, expressly against the constitution. Really?

Yes really. Do some research. I assume you have internet?

On September 26, 2006, President Bush urged Congress to consider revising federal laws so that U.S. armed forces could restore public order and enforce laws in the aftermath of a natural disaster, in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.

These changes were included in the John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007 (H.R. 5122), which was signed into law on Oct 17, 2006.[3]

Section 1076 is titled "Use of the Armed Forces in major public emergencies". It provided that:

The President may employ the armed forces... to... restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition... the President determines that... domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order... or [to] suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such... a condition... so hinders the execution of the laws... that any part or class of its people is deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law... or opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws.[4]

And then we have tax cuts for the top 1% of the uber-rich, giveouts to big oil and corporations on the taxpayer dime, the outsourcing of American jobs to India and China, the 500 billion dollar trade deficit, 150 dollar a barrel oil, raping the social security trust fund, reduction of worker rights and busting up of unions, the deliberate lies told by the administration in the runup to the Iraq war... This is just damn funny. Thanks

No problem. I am always good for a laugh

Did I miss anything? Most all of it

And that's just the stuff we know about...

So far the democrats have told the justice department that they are going to respect the rights of the states to set drug policy and not prosecute individuals that are in compliance with state law, a right that was not bestowed to individuals in the Bush administration.

So, we have the democrats adding rights, and Bush trashing the constitution/bill of rights every chance he got... So is it the democrats or the republicans that are trying to "stifle your rights?"

What planet did you get this all from?

earth. been there?

Come ON rushmc. Everything I stated was 100% truth. If you cant see it then you need to open your eyes.

100%? and it is wiki links used to back it up?

Nice

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Would that include the founding fathers and the Revolutionary War?

Good point. I am sure we were called 'insurgents' by King George at some point. Lets clear up some of your so called "points"

To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government. for non-citizens

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)for non-citizens or battle feild prisoners

What about Jose Padilla? Do some research.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29

3. Withdrew from the Geneva Conventions (CIA Torture policy)your interpitation

Interpitation isnt a word. Interpretation is.

4. Worked very hard to repeal Row vs. Wade Really? When and where?

5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act) again for non-citizens with plenty of help from your chozen party Wrong, and chosen is spelled with an 's'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warrantless_surveillance_controversy

Actually the NSA wiretapped 300,000 americans. Really.

6. Repealed the Posse Comitatus Act, which allowed him to use the military in law enforcement activities on American soil, expressly against the constitution. Really?

Yes really. Do some research. I assume you have internet?

On September 26, 2006, President Bush urged Congress to consider revising federal laws so that U.S. armed forces could restore public order and enforce laws in the aftermath of a natural disaster, in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.

These changes were included in the John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007 (H.R. 5122), which was signed into law on Oct 17, 2006.[3]

Section 1076 is titled "Use of the Armed Forces in major public emergencies". It provided that:

The President may employ the armed forces... to... restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition... the President determines that... domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order... or [to] suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such... a condition... so hinders the execution of the laws... that any part or class of its people is deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law... or opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws.[4]

And then we have tax cuts for the top 1% of the uber-rich, giveouts to big oil and corporations on the taxpayer dime, the outsourcing of American jobs to India and China, the 500 billion dollar trade deficit, 150 dollar a barrel oil, raping the social security trust fund, reduction of worker rights and busting up of unions, the deliberate lies told by the administration in the runup to the Iraq war... This is just damn funny. Thanks

No problem. I am always good for a laugh

Did I miss anything? Most all of it

And that's just the stuff we know about...

So far the democrats have told the justice department that they are going to respect the rights of the states to set drug policy and not prosecute individuals that are in compliance with state law, a right that was not bestowed to individuals in the Bush administration.

So, we have the democrats adding rights, and Bush trashing the constitution/bill of rights every chance he got... So is it the democrats or the republicans that are trying to "stifle your rights?"

What planet did you get this all from?

earth. been there?

Come ON rushmc. Everything I stated was 100% truth. If you cant see it then you need to open your eyes.

And I just remembered this. You know Obama is fighting to keep the wire tap law, correct?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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To add a little to the thread:

If you look at the last 8 years of Bush&Cheney Inc., they:

1. Repealed the right to a trial by jury for any person detained by the federal government. for non-citizens

2. Repealed the right to a speedy trial (8 years in gitmo without even a phone call)for non-citizens or battle feild prisoners

Jose Padilla was born in New York and was still a US citizen at the time he was arrested in Chicago, designated an "illegal enemy combatant", sent to military prison, and held 3.5 years without a trial until the charges were dropped.

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5. Repealed the protection against unreasonable search and seizure (i.e. NSA Wiretaps of American citizens without a court order - in violation of the FISA Act)again for non-citizens with plenty of help from your chozen party

We don't know what the NSA did after they installed fiber-optic splitters in the AT&T internet backbone and connected them to semantic traffic analyzers in secure wiring closets.

[kbordson 8]

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Really?

Yes, really.

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“Arson, property destruction, burglary, and theft are ‘acceptable crimes’ when used for the animal cause.”
— PETA co-founder Alex Pacheco

How does that differ from what I wrote? I did write that property destruction, or as I wrote, 'tearing up property' I think it was, was ok to PETA. Not sure how your point opposes what I wrote.

PETA's rules are for not injuring people or animals. Just because fire does injure people doesn't mean it has to. Has PETA ever injured anyone? I checked and couldn't find anyone they've injured. They're pretty careful, as that would tarnish their agenda.

You wrote "And what does let's say PETA do? They might throw paint on a fur coat, tear up an animal lab or protest on a ship like Greenpeace. Libs ruin property, conservs kill people."

I'm arguing that by condoning arson, they are stepping over the line.

You are right, their "policy" isn't about intentionally harming humans. But there are some levels of property destruction that are more violent and people do die.

PETA is not "innocent" ... they just justify their violence and attempt to hide behind the "It wasn't us... it was the ALF" argument, while supporting the ALF

Eleven Defendants Indicted on Domestic Terrorism Charges
Ingrid Newkirk and the support of the ALF

To deny any wrong on the part of PETA or it's leaders is intellectually dishonest. It's like saying that the person that paid the hitman wasn't guilty.

[Lucky... 0]

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You wrote "And what does let's say PETA do? They might throw paint on a fur coat, tear up an animal lab or protest on a ship like Greenpeace. Libs ruin property, conservs kill people."

I'm arguing that by condoning arson, they are stepping over the line.

You are right, their "policy" isn't about intentionally harming humans. But there are some levels of property destruction that are more violent and people do die.

Certainly there is a real risk of harming someone if you burn down their buildings, labs, etc, but the agenda isn't that and they go to measures to prevent that so it doesn't harm their work.

Verssu an abortion doctor killer who does that intentionally. Not that they represent all conservs, radicals from the right are deadly by intent, left are not.

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PETA is not "innocent" ... they just justify their violence and attempt to hide behind the "It wasn't us... it was the ALF" argument, while supporting the ALF

Eleven Defendants Indicted on Domestic Terrorism Charges
Ingrid Newkirk and the support of the ALF

Sure they're not. Have they ever hurt anyone tho? I don't know of any and am not excusing their behavior, altho I back their agenda, maybe not their methodology all the time.

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To deny any wrong on the part of PETA or it's leaders is intellectually dishonest. It's like saying that the person that paid the hitman wasn't guilty.

This wasn't an argument of right / wrong, it was one of intent based upon which side uses which method. The right often uses a show of force, arms, threats of violence, death, etc., the left uses protest and destruction of property since they know the opposers are out for profit and they want to make animal torture unprofitable.

[billvon 2,998]

>The only bloodless coup that I would support is through the free election
>of politicians that had the interests of the country as the primary
>motivator.

Agreed. We have a mechanism for a 'bloodless coup' in place, and everyone in the US can avail themselves of it. That's insufficient for some people, unfortunately.

>But to have that, we would need the PEOPLE to become more aware,
>more educated, and less apathetic.

Yep. Which means it's unlikely to happen. With all our talks about which news network is more popular, and which is more accurate, American Idol still trumps them all in terms of popularity.

[kelpdiver 2]

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PETA is not "innocent" ... they just justify their violence and attempt to hide behind the "It wasn't us... it was the ALF" argument, while supporting the ALF

Yes, the ALF is their wet works wing. They have no issues at all with acts of terrorism against those they consider the enemy - researchers, geese farmers, anyone.

They do do some funny propaganda. Two blocks past a McDs in SF they painted a building with McCruelty's. The art is good enough I parked nearby looking for a quarter pounder.

[kbordson 8]

Quote

>But to have that, we would need the PEOPLE to become more aware,
>more educated, and less apathetic.

Yep. Which means it's unlikely to happen. With all our talks about which news network is more popular, and which is more accurate, American Idol still trumps them all in terms of popularity.

Which is sad. Very, very sad.