Pot smokers

[jcd11235 0]

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They want to legalize all drugs. Are you kidding me?

Among drugs commonly used for recreational purposes, alcohol and tobacco are the most lethal per 100,000 users. Why shouldn't others (e.g., cannabis, cocaine, MDMA, LSD, etc.) be legal?

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[jcd11235 0]

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This is a war on the drugs themselves and their dangers, not a war on those who choose to go the crimminal route.

To which dangers are you referring?

The War On Drugs is one of the greatest policy blunders of the past century. It has caused far more harm than the drugs from which it is supposed to protect people.

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[nanook 1]

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Among drugs commonly used for recreational purposes, alcohol and tobacco are the most lethal per 100,000 users. Why shouldn't others (e.g., cannabis, cocaine, MDMA, LSD, etc.) be legal?

. . ."we already have dangerous crap, why put more out?" . . .

This was never a good argument for legalization. It's only a good example of double standards. Going the other way, we aren't illegalizing alcohol. Remember prohibition? Alcohol is too Americana; pot isn't. People today would rather pay the taxes and keep the "war" than have a tax base and have it everywhere. Hell, I don't want it. I pay a lot of taxes for it, even in War zones.

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"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jcd11235 0]

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Among drugs commonly used for recreational purposes, alcohol and tobacco are the most lethal per 100,000 users. Why shouldn't others (e.g., cannabis, cocaine, MDMA, LSD, etc.) be legal?

. . ."we already have dangerous crap, why put more out?" . . .

This was never a good argument for legalization.

You're the one who keeps bringing up how dangerous drugs are.

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Alcohol is too Americana; pot isn't.

Bullshit. You're kidding yourself if you believe that.

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[nanook 1]

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You're the one who keeps bringing up how dangerous drugs are.

Good. Now you are up to speed.

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Bullshit. You're kidding yourself if you believe that.

By any chance, is your group of friends very similar to you? Is your work environment very homogenous? You know, similar pictures and decorations; everyone has the same degree; same job; you all have the same tastes in jokes and favorite movies, music ect. ect. .?

I think you exist in some bubble of influence and don't peer too much outside of it. Grab a football and go to the park and start up a game with some people. Get on a sports team of some sort. Hell, go hang out with the IT/comic book types for the weekend even if it means playing some on-line game for hours on end. volunteer in your community. Get some experience with mulitple opinions and lifestyles.
You might just find out how much your "bullshit" call points to a lack of awarness of your surroundings.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jcd11235 0]

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You're the one who keeps bringing up how dangerous drugs are.

Good. Now you are up to speed.

You're still overlooking the fact that illegal recreational drugs in general, and pot in particular, pose a lesser threat of death to users than alcohol or tobacco.

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By any chance, is your group of friends very similar to you? Is your work environment very homogenous? You know, similar pictures and decorations; everyone has the same degree; same job; you all have the same tastes in jokes and favorite movies, music ect. ect. .?

No, not since I was in the military. That's the only time I've been exposed to such a homogeneous environment.

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I think you exist in some bubble of influence and don't peer too much outside of it.

Once again, you are incorrect.

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Get some experience with mulitple opinions and lifestyles.
You might just find out how much your "bullshit" call points to a lack of awarness of your surroundings.

An ironic suggestion, don't you think?

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[nanook 1]

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You're still overlooking the fact that illegal recreational drugs in general, and pot in particular, pose a lesser threat of death to users than alcohol or tobacco.

No I didn't. It's been addressed before. And, I have said why it doesn't matter. You are missing the point. No one has to acknowledge that argument. No one is going to legalize pot just because someone claims that Alcohol is worse. It brings attention to the fact that there are already problems existing. I even gave you an example of what someone brushing the argument off will say.

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No, not since I was in the military. That's the only time I've been exposed to such a homogeneous environment.

Strange. When I played "Army" (I even had to wear their ACU's) the last year or so, I saw a lot of different opinions(i could have sworn there are more democrats than republicans in the Army), beliefs and culture. However, I did see something similar to them all: They all wanted to do their best. Maybe you are confusing Dicipline with Homogeony.

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Once again, you are incorrect.

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An ironic suggestion, don't you think?

No dude. Really. You need to take a look. Seriously. Read all your posts for the last year. Sometimes your posts reflects processes that are based on an ideal perfect world on paper. And you confuse the idealology as the reality in your arguments. Your posts lack the human variable that makes the reality of the paper-perfect theory. Its as if you don't realize that there are people out there.
It sounds like you would be a loner without your computer or your DZ.
It definately makes your credibility in the "bullshit, I see outside my bubble" without much worth.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[Bolas 5]

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No one is going to legalize pot just because someone claims that Alcohol is worse. It brings attention to the fact that there are already problems existing.

One way to address problems is to provide less harmful alternatives. To do this, you have to allow people to make their own decisions as well as make them accountable for their actions.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[nanook 1]

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One way to address problems is to provide less harmful alternatives. To do this, you have to allow people to make their own decisions as well as make them accountable for their actions.

I like any alternative that puts the ball in the hands of the individual. But, I believe that it begs confidence in the individual's ability to accept responsibility and accountability.

This sounds like Parenting. This is definitely what I hope to do for my daughter. Allow for her make her mistakes and hold her accountable. Here's my opinion on to why this may not work outside the household: Some people do not get the base dicipline or even come from the best homes. Accountability is something that is taught by love of the parent and dicipline of the real world and such. It's really up the them if they want to be held accountable. Drug addiction and abuse in the Family have always caused the children to have an attitude that does not allow the acceptance of accountability. I have seen this growing up poor and surrounded by this atmosphere, and I have seen this plenty in the Navy: The few success stories come in two ways: my favorite, lend an ear, observe and a great amount of patience; the other, very harsh measures that shocks them into seeing the effects of being in the wrong. But mostly, they almost always fail and get kicked out. you just can't be nuturing or "shock and awe" some people. It's sad. Some of these guys had ASVAB scores through the roof.

There is enough of these types in our society right now that makes things difficult for us. This is with control. Laxing the control may just very well empower responsibility, but there will be a lot more use and many more problems because of it. This is just one of those things where empowerment vs. govt draconian control becomes a balance that despite what we would like to see, would be better off pointing to the Control.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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They want to legalize all drugs. Are you kidding me?

Among drugs commonly used for recreational purposes, alcohol and tobacco are the most lethal per 100,000 users. Why shouldn't others (e.g., cannabis, cocaine, MDMA, LSD, etc.) be legal?

That would reduce the money available to important government agencies like the DEA and private prison owners.

Personally I'm all for total legalization.

I'd rather a pot head ask for brownie mix than stumble across a grower's booby trap in national forest. I'd rather kids wanting to trip on X be overly touchy-feely when they get the real thing than getting whatever cheap substitutes the chemists mixed in illegal pills. Coke users wouldn't be so bad if they could stay home and be paranoid instead of doing sleazy things to feed their expensive habit. I worry more about meth cookers blowing up the apartment next to mine than tweekers on the bus.

The risks to me as an innocent bystander come nearly entirely from the fact that most recreational drugs are illegal.

Beyond that I like to eat my wife's gourmet cooking. I love to chow down on a stream of tasty hors d'oeuvres leading up to the succulent entree. I have fond memories of the chef ending tantalizing amuse bouches to my table. They can have my fork when they pry it from my cold dead fingers.

If the government can protect us from things like alcohol (currently 85,000 annual fatalities) and drugs (currently 15,000 from illicit drugs), they can do something to 'help' those of us who eat poorly and get too little exercise resulting in 400,000 fatalities each year.

California has already banned trans-fats in restaurants and the rest of the country follows their lead. While I don't like unnatural foods, butter is bound to follow on the slippery slope to a federally mandated boring diet. Duck fat works for a lot of French cooking but a man needs his pastries.

I digress while I digest.

Most of the expensive and dangerous consequences of illegal drugs come from them being illegal. Let people do what they want, apply the laws against intoxication to the ones who drive/fly/operate day care centers under the influence, and spend less on treatment than you would to jail the ones who'd like to stop using since that's cheaper (prison is pushing $40,000 a year in high-cost states).

The few more thirty-something people that end up with heart problems from too much coke can keep those of us who there for dangerous sports accidents company.

[nanook 1]

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That would reduce the money available to important government agencies like the DEA and private prison owners

You know something funny? Not to fond of them. Fuck those guys. They are the CIA of the federal police. Them and the us customs office.

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Coke users wouldn't be so bad if they could stay home and be paranoid instead of doing sleazy things to feed their expensive habit.

Legalization may make it much cheaper. But I doubt it that they will always be at home when they use.

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I worry more about meth cookers blowing up the apartment next to mine than tweekers on the bus.

To be truthful, i think meth would completely disappear with total legalizaton. Too much work involved. Less Explosive ways to have fun in the marketplace.

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The risks to me as an innocent bystander come nearly entirely from the fact that most recreational drugs are illegal.

Not false. To me though, the risks are degradation of enough people to lower societal production and comfort that are hard-earned as of right now. I don't think many realize how much is involved with the communal upkeep of neighborhoods and communities at large.

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If the government can protect us from things like alcohol (currently 85,000 annual fatalities) and drugs (currently 15,000 from illicit drugs), they can do something to 'help' those of us who eat poorly and get too little exercise resulting in 400,000 fatalities each year.

Sorry. Ronald Mcdonald is quite the elusive fellow. But we got Grimace and the Hamburgler. C'mon, doesn't that count for anything? The Early Bird? That Bitch is toast. You just wait.
Seriously though, there just isn't any way the govt can protect us completely from DUI's and other alchohol related incidents since it is so plentiful due to legalization. My question is will that 15000 drug fatalities match the alcohol fatilities after legalization? I believe it will come quite close.

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California has already banned trans-fats in restaurants and the rest of the country follows their lead. While I don't like unnatural foods, butter is bound to follow on the slippery slope to a federally mandated boring diet.

The same state was able to legalize medical pot. Many other states followed suit. And, I am surprised to hear no one has brought out yet, Cali also has put out a legalization of pot bill that passed 3/4 in the public safety comittee (ab 390). it has to pass the public health comittee to move forward ect. ect. . . but if not in time, then next year be put back up.

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apply the laws against intoxication to the ones who drive/fly/operate day care centers under the influence,

Problem is, they have to drive/fly/operate the day cares to get caught. Just like those being caught with a DUI have to go out and drive. But what about the ones cops can't get to in time? I don't feel that risking public safety so someone can "feel free to do drugs" is the right way to go.

What is so important about drugs anyway? Why should a person's freedom to do what the hell he likes risk the life of my family?

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The few more thirty-something people that end up with heart problems from too much coke can keep those of us who there for dangerous sports accidents company.

I would rather sit in solitude with my healing femur than have a world where I would be side by side with a patient with a dependence issue. The guy more than likely will be dead in a few years.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[timmyfitz 0]

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You're still overlooking the fact that illegal recreational drugs in general, and pot in particular, pose a lesser threat of death to users than alcohol or tobacco.

I doubt that this is a fact as you claim. A true comparison can not be made because alcohol and tobacco are legal and readily available and illegal drugs are not as easily attainable. If Marijuana were to ever become legal and sold everywhere like alcohol and tobacco, then a true(r) comparison could be made.

[Bolas 5]

The problem with your logic is if the gov't controls, they don't have to ever be accountable. You can't teach it without allowing it.

Sorta like the overprotective parent that never lets the child screw up.

Then again, our gov't hardly holds anyone or anything accountable anymore, it mostly just writes checks.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[nanook 1]

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The problem with your logic is if the gov't controls, they don't have to ever be accountable. You can't teach it without allowing it.

Sorta like the overprotective parent that never lets the child screw up.

I agree. . . It's just that they have to screw up first, at the expense of other people, so they can learn important lessons in life.

There is charity in saying, "teach them accountability. Give them the power to correct themselves and elevate to a higher level of self-esteem". But, I ain't suggesting any program that will put wife, daughter, property at risk just to create the arena.

No one should ever have to bet their family when helping others out.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jcd11235 0]

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You're still overlooking the fact that illegal recreational drugs in general, and pot in particular, pose a lesser threat of death to users than alcohol or tobacco.

No I didn't. It's been addressed before. And, I have said why it doesn't matter.

You keep claiming the dangers of illegal drugs, then every time it is pointed out how they pose less danger relative to legal drugs, you back pedal and claim that their danger doesn't matter.

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No, not since I was in the military. That's the only time I've been exposed to such a homogeneous environment.

Strange. When I played "Army" (I even had to wear their ACU's) the last year or so, I saw a lot of different opinions(i could have sworn there are more democrats than republicans in the Army), beliefs and culture.

True, every soldier is not exactly the same, but variety is minimal compared to the civilian world.

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Maybe you are confusing Dicipline with Homogeony.

No, I am not confused by those two very different concepts.

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No dude. Really. You need to take a look. Seriously. Read all your posts for the last year. Sometimes your posts reflects processes that are based on an ideal perfect world on paper. And you confuse the idealology as the reality in your arguments. Your posts lack the human variable that makes the reality of the paper-perfect theory. Its as if you don't realize that there are people out there.
It sounds like you would be a loner without your computer or your DZ.
It definately makes your credibility in the "bullshit, I see outside my bubble" without much worth.

I'm not sure if it is forward or reverse progress that you've switched to projection from irony. Should we recap some of the absurd claims (that have been repeatedly shown to be wrong by several other poster, not just me) you've made in this thread?

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[jcd11235 0]

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Personally I'm all for total legalization.

I strongly concur, for mostly the same reasons you mentioned. (Although I can't relate to your love of food, to each their own.)

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[nanook 1]

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I'm not sure if it is forward or reverse progress that you've switched to projection from irony

Nope, not projection. You show traits that mirror people I know. Now go pick up a football or something and go meet some people.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jcd11235 0]

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Coke users wouldn't be so bad if they could stay home and be paranoid instead of doing sleazy things to feed their expensive habit.

Legalization may make it much cheaper. But I doubt it that they will always be at home when they use.

Judging from your posts in this thread, I seriously doubt you would even be able to identify a regular cocaine user that didn't need to resort to "doing sleazy things to feed their expensive habit." The same is true of methamphetamine users. Further, there is a high probability that you would be impressed by their motivation and productivity.

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To be truthful, i think meth would completely disappear with total legalizaton. Too much work involved. Less Explosive ways to have fun in the marketplace.

That's doubtful. Pharmaceutical grade product (e.g., Desoxyn) would replace the product currently provided by "bathtub chemists." Some people like downers (e.g., alcohol, cannabis). Other people like uppers (e.g., amphetamine, methamphetamine, cocaine).

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I don't think many realize how much is involved with the communal upkeep of neighborhoods and communities at large.

If anything, legalization would increase the involvement in "communal upkeep of neighborhoods and communities at large." I don't think you realize how many drug users avoid contact with their neighbors simply due to fear of being busted or found out as an illegal drug user. Further, in the current legal climate, drug users tend to be reluctant to support or participate in neighborhood watch (aka narc on your neighbor) programs.

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My question is will that 15000 drug fatalities match the alcohol fatilities after legalization? I believe it will come quite close.

Do you have any evidence supporting your belief?

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Problem is, they have to drive/fly/operate the day cares to get caught. Just like those being caught with a DUI have to go out and drive. But what about the ones cops can't get to in time? I don't feel that risking public safety so someone can "feel free to do drugs" is the right way to go.

Many studies suggest that cannabis use does not adversely affect driving ability beyond the extent expected of over the counter cold medicines taken as directed. The DUI scare tactic is a red herring w/r/t cannabis.

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What is so important about drugs anyway? Why should a person's freedom to do what the hell he likes risk the life of my family?

Since no one has provided any justification for their prohibition, there is no need to keep recreational drugs illegal. One person's drug use seldom risks the life of other people (driving under the influence of alcohol being a major exception).

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I would rather sit in solitude with my healing femur than have a world where I would be side by side with a patient with a dependence issue. The guy more than likely will be dead in a few years.

You would probably be surprised to find that heroin users (heroin being the most lethal per 100,000 users of commonly used recreational drugs) have about a 1 in 1000 chance of dying from their habit in any given year, approximately the same as skydivers. Would you be equally loathe to be side by side with a skydiver as your femur heals?

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[jcd11235 0]

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You're still overlooking the fact that illegal recreational drugs in general, and pot in particular, pose a lesser threat of death to users than alcohol or tobacco.

I doubt that this is a fact as you claim.

A quick search provided:
Source 1
Source 2

Note that the second source shows heroin to be approximately as dangerous as tobacco. I have previously read (but didn't look for the source just now) that some cutting agents increase heroin users' risk of death, a factor that would be greatly reduced or eliminated with legalization.

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[jcd11235 0]

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I'm not sure if it is forward or reverse progress that you've switched to projection from irony

Nope, not projection. You show traits that mirror people I know. Now go pick up a football or something and go meet some people.

You see traits that aren't there.

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[nanook 1]

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Judging from your posts in this thread, I seriously doubt you would even be able to identify a regular cocaine user that didn't need to resort to "doing sleazy things to feed their expensive habit."

I'll give you that. But since his drug is more important than the results of his contribution to the dealers, I really wouldn't care to.

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That's doubtful. Pharmaceutical grade product (e.g., Desoxyn) would replace the product currently provided by "bathtub chemists."

will the dangers of explosions go away? I meant to say earlier that the dangers of explosions will move out, not meaning to concentrate on the word "meth" itself.

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If anything, legalization would increase the involvement in "communal upkeep of neighborhoods and communities at large." I don't think you realize how many drug users avoid contact with their neighbors simply due to fear of being busted or found out as an illegal drug user. Further, in the current legal climate, drug users tend to be reluctant to support or participate in neighborhood watch (aka narc on your neighbor) programs.

Okay now.
1. the communal upkeep will be because of the increased dangers.
2. the drug users will not have to hide anymore with legalization. Who wants them around. Stay hidden please.
3. drug users tend not to do much of anything.

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Do you have any evidence supporting your belief?

Nah, I gave up giving you evidence, or even proof. No evidence will satisfy you. Whether on this topic or other topics in SC in general.

Just look at all the cites I have given over and over in various threads on this topic. You need to quit conveinently "fogetting" things put in front of you in the past.

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Many studies suggest that cannabis use does not adversely affect driving ability beyond the extent expected of over the counter cold medicines taken as directed. The DUI scare tactic is a red herring w/r/t cannabis.

You know what? Why don't you show me that study. The whole thing; not the partial mentioned source link through a website.

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Since no one has provided any justification for their prohibition, there is no need to keep recreational drugs illegal. One person's drug use seldom risks the life of other people (driving under the influence of alcohol being a major exception).

You need to read more. I have provided plenty. You really really need to get out more. You are not seeing the effects drugs have. Look at the people not the buildings and cars. Go on ride alongs with your police department.

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You would probably be surprised to find that heroin users (heroin being the most lethal per 100,000 users of commonly used recreational drugs) have about a 1 in 1000 chance of dying from their habit in any given year, approximately the same as skydivers. Would you be equally loathe to be side by side with a skydiver as your femur heals?

If he does heroin? Fuck no.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[Bolas 5]

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But, I ain't suggesting any program that will put wife, daughter, property at risk just to create the arena.

No one should ever have to bet their family when helping others out.

Families are already at risk and will always be at risk no matter what is done.

You've been told keeping drugs illegal is safer for your family and you want to do the best for your family, which is admirable, so you blindly believe that. This also explains why no matter what is said here, you won't ever change your mind.

The fact is possession and distribution crimes and their effects on society (not just the "criminals" family but all) is much higher than any crimes that would be committed while under the influence of the drugs were they legal.

While you may be willing to sacrifice rights and freedoms under the false guise of family safety, more and more others do not.

When it happens, it will more likely be for economic reasons than moral ones, just like casino gambling has been.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[nanook 1]

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You've been told keeping drugs illegal is safer for your family and you want to do the best for your family, which is admirable, so you blindly believe that. This also explains why no matter what is said here, you won't ever change your mind.

I haven't been told nothing. I'm not blind to what it does. No matter what is said here, you are right, I will not change my mind.

I can diffrentiate the difference between problems caused by the use of drugs and the drug market itself. There is really no perfect way for me to best portray the why I feel this way about drugs overall. I can only tell you that I definitely am not an armchair observer of the decay it can cause.

I do not expect you to understand. Maybe it would be easier to relate if you had to grow up like I have.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jcd11235 0]

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But since his drug is more important than the results of his contribution to the dealers, I really wouldn't care to.

Can you please clarify that statement? As it reads, it sounds like you're saying that the user finds his drug to be worth more than the money he uses to pay for it. I'm inclined to believe that isn't what you intended. (If it is as you intended, I would say that is true of most any good or service for which we voluntarily pay. If it wasn't, why bother buying anything instead of just keeping our money?)

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will the dangers of explosions go away?

Yes, at least to the extent that the danger of explosion is kept to a minimum in chemistry labs (as opposed to kitchens & bathrooms).

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Okay now.
1. the communal upkeep will be because of the increased dangers.

To what increased dangers are you referring? The neighborhoods won't suddenly be more dangerous simply because people can legally smoke pot or use other drugs.

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Who wants them around. Stay hidden please.

It is unlikely that you would even recognize them as drug users without actually witnessing them actually ingesting the drugs.

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3. drug users tend not to do much of anything.

Like found countries?

From George Washington's diary:
"1765, May 12-13. Sowed Hemp at Muddy hole by Swamp. August 7, began to separate the Male from the Female hemp... rather too late."

The August 7 entry is strong evidence that Washington was growing some of his cannabis for THC.

Further:

Dr. Burke, the President of the American Historical Reference Society, researched the correspondence of the first several presidents, and in 1975 confirmed that seven of them smoked cannabis. George Washington preferred to smoke "the leaves of hemp" rather than to drink alcohol. James Madison was once heard to say that smoking hemp inspired him to found a new nation on democratic principles. James Monroe, the 5th US President, was introduced to hashish when he was serving as Ambassador to France, and he continued to enjoy the smoke until he was 73 years old. When Andrew Jackson, Zachary Taylor and Franklin Pierce served as military commanders, they each smoked hemp with their soldiers. In one letter to his family, Pierce complained that hemp was "about the only good thing" about the Mexican War.

I've personally witnessed many highly successful people use illegal drugs recreationally, in many cases regularly. Included among those are airline pilots, Air Force pilots, well known cinematographers, successful business entrepreneurs/owners, college professors, inventors, soldiers, and world champion athletes.

Perhaps your idea of not doing much of anything differs from mine.

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No evidence will satisfy you.

Bullshit. What a cop out. If you can provide evidence, do so. If not, I'll have to assume that your assertion is once again baseless, without merit.

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Whether on this topic or other topics in SC in general.

Nothing could be further from the truth, but go ahead and continue attacking the player when you can't keep your eye on the ball.

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Many studies suggest that cannabis use does not adversely affect driving ability beyond the extent expected of over the counter cold medicines taken as directed. The DUI scare tactic is a red herring w/r/t cannabis.

You know what? Why don't you show me that study. The whole thing; not the partial mentioned source link through a website.

I'll overlook the hypocrisy of your request. Here is one such study. From the conclusion:

In a previous series of studies on the effects of THC alone we concluded that THC given in doses up to 300 1lg/kg has "slight" effects on driving performance (Robbe & O'Hanlon, 1993). The results of the present study now compel us to revise that conclusion. The present subjects' performance was more affected than their predecessors'. The present subjects showed impaired car following performance after THC 100 1lg/kg whereas the previous ones were not impaired by doses up to 300 1lg/kg. In the present study, road tracking performance after 200 ~g/kg was worse than the performance after 300 ~g/kg in the previous study. We believe that these differences are attributable to the groups' respective experience with THC smoking and to driving under the influence of THC. The present group was less experienced and probably had not developed the same degree of behavioral tolerance as their predecessors. Yet all of the individuals in both groups admitted to having occasionally driven under the influence of THC before entering the studies. Thus, the new data seem no less representative of how drivers normally operate under the influence of THC. The addition of these data to those previously collected merely broadens the range of reactions that might be expected to occur in real life. That range has not been shown to extend into the area that can rightfully be regarded as dangerous or an obviously unacceptable threat to public safety. Alcohol present in blood concentrations around the legal limit (0.10 g/dl) in most American States is more impairing than anything subjects have shown after THC alone in our studies. As mentioned, medicinal drugs have had worse effects on psychiatric patients' driving performance in other studies employing the same test procedures. If not blatantly dangerous, however, the effects of THC alone in this study were certainly more than slight. They were of sufficient magnitude to warrant concern. Drivers suffering the same degrees of impairment as the present subjects did after THC alone would be less than normally able to avoid collisions if confronted with the sudden need for evasive action. They would probably also be more likely to fall asleep during prolonged vehicle operation. In short, while the effects of THC alone in doses up to 200 1lg/kg might be categorized as "moderate" in the tests, they could easily become "severe" under exceptional circumstances.

Another one:

The study showed that a modest dose of alcohol (BAC = 0.034g%) produced a significant impairment in city driving, as measured by the molar approach, relative to a placebo. More specifically, alcohol impaired both vehicle handling and traffic maneuvers. Marijuana, administered in a dose of 100 ｵg/kg THC, on the other hand, did not significantly change mean driving performance as measured by this approach. Neither alcohol nor marijuana significantly affected driving performance measures obtained by the molecular approach, indicating that it may be relatively insensitive to drug-induced changes.

Driving quality, as rated by the subjects, contrasted with observer ratings. Alcohol impaired driving performance according to the driving instructor, but subjects did not perceive it; marijuana did not impair driving performance, but the subjects themselves perceived their driving performance as such. Both groups reported about the same amount of effort in accomplishing the driving test following a placebo. Yet only subjects in the marijuana group reported significantly higher levels of invested effort following the active drug. Thus there is evidence that subjects in the marijuana group were not only aware of their intoxicated condition, but were also attempting to compensate for it. These seem to be important findings. They support both the common belief that drivers become overconfident after drinking alcohol and investigators' suspicions that they become more cautious and self-critical after consuming low doses of THC, as smoked marijuana.

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Since no one has provided any justification for their prohibition, there is no need to keep recreational drugs illegal. One person's drug use seldom risks the life of other people (driving under the influence of alcohol being a major exception).

You need to read more. I have provided plenty.

You have confused your absurd claims (e.g., potheads are litterbugs that destroy beaches, smoking pot reduces property values, etc.) with actual justification for the laws prohibiting many recreational drugs.

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You really really need to get out more.

Right. Back to attacking the player instead of playing the ball. Incidentally, I get plenty of exercise; thank you for your concern.

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You are not seeing the effects drugs have. Look at the people not the buildings and cars.

Like the Presidents? Like the pilots? Maybe you mean I should look at the successful entrepreneurs? Or perhaps it's the world champion athletes that use drugs that I should be looking at? The professors?

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You would probably be surprised to find that heroin users (heroin being the most lethal per 100,000 users of commonly used recreational drugs) have about a 1 in 1000 chance of dying from their habit in any given year, approximately the same as skydivers. Would you be equally loathe to be side by side with a skydiver as your femur heals?

If he does heroin? Fuck no.

Way to avoid the question as it was asked.

A heroin user has about the same chance of dying from heroin use in a given year as a skydiver has from dying from skydiving in a given year. Are you loathe to share your room with a skydiver like you are the heroin user, since either one is about as likely to be dead soon from their habit as the other? If you wouldn't mind the skydiver as a roommate while waiting for your femur to heal, why do you have the double standard?

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I do not expect you to understand. Maybe it would be easier to relate if you had to grow up like I have.

Did you not grow up while drugs were illegal? So apparently the laws didn't make it any better.

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