RonD1120 62 #226 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuote Oh I did. It starts with, do you accept Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Son of God? Followed by, do you believe in the Holy Trinity? Did you ask them why YOU are mistaken and represent a cult? Please try to pay attention and keep up. I defined cults some pages back. Read my former post. Christianity is a religion. Islam is a religion. The Watchtower Society is a cult. The Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter Day Saints is a cult.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rynodigsmusic 0 #227 February 18, 2010 Yes. A truth, but you already know I'm a beleiver, so it should be clear what my mind accepted as truth. God loves us."We didn't start the fire" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #228 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuote Again, facts are independent of any outside observer. They simply are. The speed of light IS 186,000 miles per second. It doesn't matter who in the universe measures it. Actually, it would. Miles per second is your frame of reference. QuoteWater IS H2O. It doesn't matter if humans exist or not. These are facts. True, but there are different ways of looking at the same fact. Is water H2O or is it 9 protons and 9 neutrons? Is it neutrons and protons or quarks? I understand what you're saying. Just because there's nobody around to hear it, doesn't mean the falling tree is silent. I'm just making the point that so-called facts are always changing. Maybe we're just using the term "fact" incorrectly. "Facts," as we use the term on a daily basis, are all relative. It's whatever the lastest science experiment said was true. 120 years ago Thompson explained the atom as a raisin bun. 70 years ago it was fact that black people were intellectually inferior to white people. 10 years ago it was fact that gravity is just a force between two objects. I hope you get my point. Quote"Truth", on the other hand, is a state of judgement about a fact. I kind of think about it the other way around. Facts are what we label our understanding of the world. The truth may be, and often is, something entirely different. QuoteIf I say "Water is H2O" and we both agree on the meaning of the symbology then we can both agree that statement is true or not. I would argue that depends on who you're talking to. Yes, it is H2O... but is that all there is? If I asked you if gravity was the force between two masses, would you agree? Would a string theorist agree on the same level? QuoteBTW, it's still a "fact" even if you personally don't believe it's the "truth." It's a fact based on what we know right now. The truth maybe different. QuoteYou probably should leave the words "fact" and "truth" out of any discussion with regards to god. Why? Because humans have been so great at explaining everthing so far? Very well stated. Kudos to you.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #229 February 18, 2010 Quote People WAKE UP! Keep your non-sense believes at home or in your church! Do NOT to try to impose them on others and definitely DO NOT to try control politics and science with religion! I refer you to my post #208. If you have been following rynodigsmusic's and my posts, then you have been given the gospel message of Jesus Christ of Nazareth. God loves us and has provided THE WAY for us to spend eternity with HIM. Take it or leave it, no imposition implied.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,489 #230 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteYou've just made 3 statements about the relationship of knowledge and wisdom. QuoteKnowledge applied with consistent outcome creates wisdom. Wisdom is non-tangible and the Bible teaches that it is the attribute of God and exists eternally. Knowledge always has its origin in the reprobate human mind. It is of the flesh and in opposition to wisdom, Explain how each of these three statements is not a complete contradiction of the other two. See post #192, rynodigsmusic provides a good explanation. No, it doesn't. Ryno's post may be (yet another) general rambling about the nature of wisdom, but it is not an answer to the specific question I asked you about your contradictory statements. ...Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
philh 0 #231 February 18, 2010 Your wrong the speed of light does not depend on who is measuring it. This is well established by relativity and relativity has enormous amounts of credible evidence to support it. If you are going to say otherwsie you need to show your evidence, you cant just say "actaully it would" and exepct people to take you seriosuly. "Is water H2O or is it 9 protons and 9 neutrons? Is it neutrons and protons or quarks? " You are commiting the fallacy of the false dichotomy. The description of water at a molecular or atomic level are not inconsistent , so your point is meaningless. Are facts constantly changing? It depends what you mean by fact. I'm not sure the idea that blacks were intellectually inferior to white was ever a "fact". It may have been a popular opinion. It better to talk of statments which have overwhelming evidence for them. Science has plenty of them, religion has absolutley zero. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #232 February 18, 2010 Quote Your wrong the speed of light does not depend on who is measuring it. This is well established by relativity and relativity has enormous amounts of credible evidence to support it. If you are going to say otherwsie you need to show your evidence, you cant just say "actaully it would" and exepct people to take you seriosuly. "Is water H2O or is it 9 protons and 9 neutrons? Is it neutrons and protons or quarks? " You are commiting the fallacy of the false dichotomy. The description of water at a molecular or atomic level are not inconsistent , so your point is meaningless. Are facts constantly changing? It depends what you mean by fact. I'm not sure the idea that blacks were intellectually inferior to white was ever a "fact". It may have been a popular opinion. It better to talk of statments which have overwhelming evidence for them. Science has plenty of them, religion has absolutley zero. An indisputable fact, I did not make these statements. Your failure to accurately determine the appropriate hypothetical paradigm kind of proves the point of the original poster. Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
philh 0 #233 February 18, 2010 Perhaps its not clear whos typing what , but whoever Im addressing, the point stands. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frequentfaller 0 #234 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuotedo you mean this? "I operate in the fields of spirituality and psychology" so? then you agree. you base your definitions of knowlege and wisdom from religious point of view. i base my definitions of knowledge and wisdom from scientific point of view. I am not fond of the terms religion or religious but, for the purpose of this discussion, yes, I agree with your point. what else would you lable sprituality? do practice transpersonal psychology?Born ok 1st time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #235 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuotedo you mean this? "I operate in the fields of spirituality and psychology" so? then you agree. you base your definitions of knowlege and wisdom from religious point of view. i base my definitions of knowledge and wisdom from scientific point of view. I am not fond of the terms religion or religious but, for the purpose of this discussion, yes, I agree with your point. what else would you lable sprituality? do practice transpersonal psychology? I prefer relationship with Jesus Christ of Nazareth. I retired from the field of rehab counseling.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,991 #236 February 18, 2010 > All my life I have seen a constant wearing away of our Christian heritage. > America is not growing stronger; we are getting weaker. America's strength is based in large part on the principles of our Constitution, one of which is that the government shall not get involved in religion. Maintaining that separation makes us stronger; ignoring the Constitution to indulge in our own personal beliefs makes us weaker. >So, I can assume the the symbol at the USSC is nothing more than a >shopping list reminder for the Chief Justice. However, it does not do much >to inspire confidence in the high court. A representation of the document they have pledged to uphold undermines your confidence that they will do just that? >The reality is, the court is not so much for the benefit of the citizens as it >is the grand arena for attorneys. As it is the last line of defense against the erosion of rights, and as the suits there are brought by ordinary people, I disagree. In 1967 a couple brought a case before the US Supreme Court. They were an interracial couple that had been denied the right to marry by Virginia. The US Supreme Court reversed that decision, and told Virginia that they had no right to deny this couple the right to marry. In other words, they forbade the state from taking away that right from them. I think that benefited those two citizens, and in later years, benefited millions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #237 February 18, 2010 QuoteYou are not going to like this. I do not beleive you are right at all. Your trying to make something fit your disbeleif is all. For all I know you have never thought about the difference between wisdom and knowledge at all before. Then perhaps you should go to a local college and take an intro to science AND and intro to philosophy class. These are not my definitions, but the definitions used pretty universally. As an other option, you might try cracking open a dictionary.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #238 February 18, 2010 QuoteAmerica's strength is based in large part on the principles of our Constitution, one of which is that the government shall not get involved in religion. Maintaining that separation makes us stronger; ignoring the Constitution to indulge in our own personal beliefs makes us weaker. I think it's clear that any attempt to pull this thread back to the original (more interesting) topic is not appreciated - we need to stay on the current tangent of the same old narrow minded (futile/impotent/deathly tedious) debate of: religion good vs religion bad and those that disagree with either side must be labeled as horrible and terrible people with crappy agendas (rather than just individual beliefs that they hold dear) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frequentfaller 0 #239 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuoteAmerica's strength is based in large part on the principles of our Constitution, one of which is that the government shall not get involved in religion. Maintaining that separation makes us stronger; ignoring the Constitution to indulge in our own personal beliefs makes us weaker. I think it's clear that any attempt to pull this thread back to the original (more interesting) topic is not appreciated - we need to stay on the current tangent of the same old narrow minded (futile/impotent/deathly tedious) debate of: religion good vs religion bad and those that disagree with either side must be labeled as horrible and terrible people with crappy agendas (rather than just individual beliefs that they hold dear) freedom OF topic means freedom FROM topicBorn ok 1st time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #240 February 18, 2010 QuoteI think it's clear that any attempt to pull this thread back to the original (more interesting) topic . . . There was an original topic??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #241 February 18, 2010 Quote Quote I think it's clear that any attempt to pull this thread back to the original (more interesting) topic . . . There was an original topic??? In the big scheme of things? not really.... ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #242 February 18, 2010 Quote So arrogant is the human mind without humbleness. Why be humble? After all, all gods, including yours, are creations of the human mind.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #243 February 18, 2010 Quotefreedom OF topic means freedom FROM topic funniest post to date I'd like freedom from the same old topic in multiple threads just like the founders intended but then, Speaker's corner would be 3 threads - 1 - for guns 2 - for religion C - partisan insulting back and forth and: 3 - general country bashing all around ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #244 February 18, 2010 Quote All my life I have seen a constant wearing away of our Christian heritage. America is not growing stronger; we are getting weaker. Our heritage includes a clear statement that we are NOT a Christian nation (ratified by the Senate and signed by the President). It also includes a huge fresco in the US Capitol showing Washington and other prominent citizens in the company of Minerva, Neptune, Vulcan and other non Christian gods.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,991 #245 February 18, 2010 >1 - for guns >2 - for religion >C - partisan insulting back and forth and: >3 - general country bashing all around And don't forget X - conspiracy theories. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frequentfaller 0 #246 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuotefreedom OF topic means freedom FROM topic funniest post to date I'd like freedom from the same old topic in multiple threads just like the founders intended but then, Speaker's corner would be 3 threads - 1 - for guns 2 - for religion C - partisan insulting back and forth and: 3 - general country bashing all around new topic? should we shoot all the religious people who insult others for country bashing?Born ok 1st time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #247 February 18, 2010 Quote>1 - for guns >2 - for religion >C - partisan insulting back and forth and: >3 - general country bashing all around And don't forget X - conspiracy theories. shhhhhhhh - if you have a penny in your pocket, you know the government is listening with the tiny microphone hidden in Lincoln's nose ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #248 February 18, 2010 QuoteQuote All my life I have seen a constant wearing away of our Christian heritage. America is not growing stronger; we are getting weaker. Our heritage includes a clear statement that we are NOT a Christian nation That does not negate our Christian heritage.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,991 #249 February 18, 2010 >That does not negate our Christian heritage. Of course not. Nor does it negate our heritage as slaveowners, or as an almost entirely agricultural society, or as a nation of horse riders. But (fortunately) those things do not define us; they just provide context so we can understand where we came from. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #250 February 18, 2010 Quote>That does not negate our Christian heritage. Of course not. Nor does it negate our heritage as slaveowners, or as an almost entirely agricultural society, or as a nation of horse riders. But (fortunately) those things do not define us; they just provide context so we can understand where we came from. That is so sad.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
