The diplomatic discussion on using the system to your advantage.

[Zach 0]

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Which is why people that will work with me in the future will be earning great income, and living a comfortable lifestyle. Our dropzone will be carbon neutral, and our aircraft will be used to track wild kiwi and other wildlife birds as a voluntary donation to the department of conservation. We will help eradicate pests and introduce wild spacies back to areas that will otherwise be forgotten.

Where can I fill out an application?

With regards to the carbon neutral part, I think that's bad ass. I wish more people had that attitude toward the environment. I'm a fly fisherman and I would love to visit to New Zealand and have a go. I'm not educated on the possiblities of a carbon neutral drop zone, but whether it is possible or not (and I'll take you at your word that it is), I think it's awesome that you're doing it.

Zach

[kelpdiver 2]

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With regards to the carbon neutral part, I think that's bad ass. I wish more people had that attitude toward the environment. I'm a fly fisherman and I would love to visit to New Zealand and have a go. I'm not educated on the possiblities of a carbon neutral drop zone, but whether it is possible or not (and I'll take you at your word that it is), I think it's awesome that you're doing it.

Zach

How can you take him at his word when he's so clearly established his code of ethics in this conversation? I bet he thinks that ripping off Walmart and camping for those two weeks was a carbon credit earning activity.

[Bolas 5]

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Our dropzone will be carbon neutral

How will you accomplish this? It sounds great but unless your plane is solar powered, seems impossible.

You should read more about sustainability, since clearly you don't understand the concept.

I was thinking he was just buying carbon credits to offset the operation's carbon usage which isn't really neutrality.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[DiverMike 5]

[inline troll.jpg]

For the same reason I jump off a perfectly good diving board.

[Zach 0]

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How can you take him at his word when he's so clearly established his code of ethics in this conversation?

Because I don't know enough about the issue to say whether what he is saying is possible or not, and his ethics as established by "Walmart-gate" don't have any bearing (in my opinion) on his attitude toward the environment. Also, there is the fact that a person can, in general, be a complete douche and still perform good deeds (although I'm not saying that this is or is not the case here, just making a point).

Zach

[Andy9o8 2]

I've looked at the Wal-Mart return policy on its corporate website. From looking at the aggregate of its entire policy, posted on a couple of different pages, it is quite clear that their preference is that the merchandise be returned unused (where possible) and/or in its unopened containers/packages (where possible). They make it a lot easier to return many (even if not all) types of unused and/or unopened merchandise for a full refund, generally preferring to offer store credit toward the same or more expensive merchandise for return of used or opened items.

Now for good or ill, my field has made me a professional expert in massaging the letter and intent of language in order to morph back and forth between a silk purse and a sow's ear. And I'm gonna tell you that the reason why Wal-Mart has the return policy it does is to stand behind their product, and to accommodate customers who buy the stuff in good faith, originally intending the stuff to be kept - not to give deadbeats a free rental. Period.

[Zach 0]

I meant I didn't know enough about the carbon neutral thing, not the Walmart thing. I'm pretty clear on that one. I would have just bought a tent from a company that I respect.

Zach

[wmw999 2,439]

Yeah, I've found that not much caring for Wal-mart is easily solved by generally not shopping there.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[kallend 2,026]

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Our dropzone will be carbon neutral

How will you accomplish this? It sounds great but unless your plane is solar powered, seems impossible.

You should read more about sustainability, since clearly you don't understand the concept.

I was thinking he was just buying carbon credits to offset the operation's carbon usage which isn't really neutrality.

It is if the credits are used for carbon negative purposes.

Can also power a plane with biomass-derived fuel (both avgas and jet fuel have been made from bio sources on a pilot plant scale). That is carbon neutral.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Andy9o8 2]

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I've found that not much caring for Wal-mart is easily solved by generally not shopping there.

Then where would I get my suits?

[Remster 30]

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I've found that not much caring for Wal-mart is easily solved by generally not shopping there.

Then where would I get my suits?

And they say that there are no classy lawyers!

Remster

[rhys 0]

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Where can I fill out an application?

With regards to the carbon neutral part, I think that's bad ass. I wish more people had that attitude toward the environment. I'm a fly fisherman and I would love to visit to New Zealand and have a go. I'm not educated on the possiblities of a carbon neutral drop zone, but whether it is possible or not (and I'll take you at your word that it is), I think it's awesome that you're doing it.

Zach

I'll be advertising in this site as soon as I 'need' more staff and I am sure I can offer a good income for those that come, It will take a little time as it is a start up DZ.

by the way, the fly fishing is amazing check ot these photos,

New Zealand fly fishing Images if you like hunting the department of coservation wants anything with 4legs (excluding reptiles) GONE! I'll be getting a thunder stick soon.

this is why.

and also this,

MMMM wild organic meat

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[rhys 0]

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How can you take him at his word when he's so clearly established his code of ethics in this conversation? I bet he thinks that ripping off Walmart and camping for those two weeks was a carbon credit earning activity.

No, I didn't rip anyone off,and it had nothing to do with the environment.

I would have had to buy a tent and get rid of it a couple of weeks later otherwise.

Until you can explain what was wrong with what I did, you will find that you are wasting your time nd making yourself look like an idiot.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[turtlespeed 219]

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Just as well I work for myself then aye

There ya go, no problem!

Hmmm - Skyride Owner in disguise?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[rhys 0]

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Hmmm - Skyride Owner in disguise?

explain! There are too many in here that can throw around the insults and make assumptions at the expense of others, how about you show your backbone and put your thoughts out on the table.

If you are too scared of what people may think about you if you expose you motiv then don't bother saying anything at all.

Come on show us what you have got.

I don't really understand the skyride bizzo much because it doen't interest or effect me, I'm gonna have a look and see what you are accusing me of.

If someone can give me the 'limp edition' for the skyride scenario,then I might be able to understand what it is that you are accusing me of.

I suggest you be less vague and get to your point.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[turtlespeed 219]

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Hmmm - Skyride Owner in disguise?

explain! There are too many in here that can throw around the insults and make assumptions at the expense of others, how about you show your backbone and put your thoughts out on the table.

If you are too scared of what people may think about you if you expose you motiv then don't bother saying anything at all.

Come on show us what you have got.

I don't really understand the skyride bizzo much because it doen't interest or effect me, I'm gonna have a look and see what you are accusing me of.

If someone can give me the 'limp edition' for the skyride scenario,then I might be able to understand what it is that you are accusing me of.

I suggest you be less vague and get to your point.

You so funnay -

You clearly don't know me - I have NO ISSUES and am not scared of what people might think of me.

Besides, you might not believe Skyride to be wrong. My guess is that you probably, almost certainly, by the moral fortitude that you exhibit, agree with their business practices.

And besides the hap hazzard commment, you don't warrant enough energy or time invested into writing it all out. ther would be pages upon pages.

In a nut shell, you are directly, adversley affecting the pocket books of others. You are abusing a system, not using a system. That is wrong.

Try thinking of it like this: If I visited your DZ and snuck on a few loads without paying - would you be upset? I didn't see anything that said specifically that I am not allowed to do that.

Maybe you have beer in your beer fridge, its open and since it is there - I decide to take the good stuff and replace it with american domestic beer. Would you be happy? Nothing in the DZ rules says I cannot do that - so - you should not have a problem with that and should defend me if anyone there does.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[rhys 0]

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Hmmm - Skyride Owner in disguise?

Apparently that is an attack on my integtrety, you are calling me dishonest and a fraud.

I havd better explain yourself, that was a personal attack, and an unfounded one.

I would put $20 on the fact that you would not have the guts to say that to my face, I am a non violent person but you would not hang around too long because you would soon be the object of ridiucule. Remember that would be in a place that personal attacks would be allowed and I would be defending myself.

Grow the fuck up!

I could create a list of people now that have told me I am;

A fraud,

breaking the law,

despicable,

dishonest,

and untrustworthy.

yet not of these people, like yourself, have the intellegence or theory to back up your assertions.

You based your reaction on a whim and the percepton of what other people think of you, You do not respect yourself and you lie to yourself and to others in order to make yourself look better.

You interety is apparently non existant.

How about an intellegent conversation? Or you could go back to being a post whore talking about irrelevant stuff while trying to impress your freinds of the same Ilk.

That is what you are more likely to do as you cannot please everybody when you are open and honest now, can you.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[rushmc 23]

For an attack on ones integrity to occur, one must have it to begin with

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[turtlespeed 219]

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I could create a list of people now that have told me I am;

A fraud,

breaking the law,

despicable,

dishonest,

and untrustworthy.

yet not of these people, like yourself, have the intellegence or theory to back up your assertions.

You based your reaction on a whim and the percepton of what other people think of you, You do not respect yourself and you lie to yourself and to others in order to make yourself look better.

I base my reactions on what you state are your moral values. You freely admit to taking certain actions, you bragged about them. You invited comment about those actions. You NOW have taken offense to the opinions and judgement that you welcomed into your life by readin and responding to these threads. Why? If you can't take the responses, then don't expose your beliefe system to those of us that will voice an opinion.

You, more than likely, were hoping that we would all jump on your little broken wheeled band wagon and stand up for or against whatever it is that you are trying to build yourself up on. What was that? That it is ok to comit fraud? That is how it ios and was presented.

In reality, there are really more people that have a grasp of what the right thing to do is, as opposed to those that don't. It has been taught to us from when we were babies. I just hope that you didn't miss the REST of the lessons.

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You interety is apparently non existant.

Well, you can think whatever you want to think. The sad fact is that the actions and abuse of the system that you are bragging about are of the same principals.
Regardless of if you want to believe them to be, or not, is irrelevant. What is, is. Just because you wish it to be different, doesn't make it so.

If you find that the integrity of the comparison to be lacking and less desireable than your self image, then perhaps you should examine why. As I have stated before, you probably do not have any issues with their business practices, as you have clearly stated that you participate in, if not the exact actiona and subversions, then dirivitives of and liknesses of them.

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I would put $20 on the fact that you would not have the guts to say that to my face, I am a non violent person but you would not hang around too long because you would soon be the object of ridiucule. Remember that would be in a place that personal attacks would be allowed and I would be defending myself.

As I repsponded before, you OBVIOUSLY do NOT know me. I would venture to guess that if I did meet you, I would likely ask you something along the lines of, "SO . . . which Walmart you are abusing THIS time or have you moved on to bigger and better yet, you know how these things escalate." ,and it would go from there. I call it like I see it.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Bolas 5]

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yet not of these people, like yourself, have the intellegence or theory to back up your assertions.

Most, if not all, of the people explained what and why they thought the way they did. Some multiple times.

Just because you choose to dismiss their explanations doesn't mean they weren't made.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[turtlespeed 219]

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yet not of these people, like yourself, have the intellegence or theory to back up your assertions.

Most, if not all, of the people explained what and why they thought the way they did. Some multiple times.

Just because you choose to dismiss their explanations doesn't mean they weren't made.

Unnaceptable!

It wasn't what he wanted to hear about himself, so he rejected that reality and substituted his own.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[davjohns 1]

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That is what the discussion is about and I will agree that it is morally incorrect to do so in cases where the provider is an ethical entity.

You answer your own question here. You admit what you did was morally incorrect. You just claim that your victim being unethical justified your immoral behavior. So...cops getting together after hours to hold up known drug dealers and keep the money is cool? Afterall, they're criminals. Surely you can steal from them.

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I know they only have the policy because people are too meek, proud, or Christian etc to utilise it. I am not of that ilk.

I think you are in an area of semantics that will not support your argument here. You admit the policy is utilized because the public is presumed to be good, moral and honest. I know. My words. But I use them because you intentionally avoided them. Then, you go on to exclude yourself from that group. The conclusion is that you once again admit that your actions are wrong.

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Walmart however want more than that, they want to maximise profits to levels they do not need at the expense of their unsuspecting or desperate employees and anything else that gets in their way.

I was respecting your argument that Wal Mart is not good and pure right up until you declared yourself the ultimate arbiter of how much profit they NEED to make. Exactly how much do they NEED to make oh exalted one?

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My decision to take advantage of their policy was to take advantage of them

Bingo

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My actions will have no significant impact, at worse the manufacturer may have it returned to them and lose the sale.

I only stole a few dollars out of your wallet. No significant impact. So, no crime. Right?

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Walmart implemented that policy purposely to increase profit not to do anyone a favour.

Agreed. That's the purpose of a corporation. In fact, there is case law that too much philanthropy puts them in breech of a fiduciary duty to the shareholders. Your argument is that if they are too zealous about upholding their legal obligation to the shareholders, they are doing wrong. An interesting Catch 22 you've put them in.

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It was a little stab at the big guy from the little guy, no more than an itch for Walmart.

Kind of like a small lie isn't really a lie?

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I have morals and I am honest,

I'm not sure that's what you wrote earlier, but I'll try not to split hairs.

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I broke no rule or law,

Hold on there. You just went from morals and ethics to legalities. The line between legal and illegal is very different from the line between right and wrong. Once you cross into illegal, you have long since passed 'wrong'. You are now so firmly in the realm of 'wrong' that we, as a society, are willing to lock you up to prevent your having to make those tough choices for a while.

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I didn’t lie and I was completely straight forward in my approach.

Don't kid yourself. You never intended to purchase the product. You intended to rent it without cost.

Sorry. I think the fact that you have to villify the other party to try to justify your actions makes it clear. You did this for self-gratification. You decided you were the ultimate arbiter of what is just and you acted to punish the one you villify. The fact that their rules allow it does not somehow vindicate you.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[billvon 2,989]

>There are too many in here that can throw around the insults . . .

Why would you consider that an insult? Skyride employees have contrived many excellent excuses for their business practices, rivaling your explanations of how your 'free rental' system is ethical. Why would you consider a comparison to someone else who uses the system to _their_ advantage to be an insult?

[rhys 0]

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You answer your own question here. You admit what you did was morally incorrect. You just claim that your victim being unethical justified your immoral behavior.

Did you forget or decide not to acknowledge the part where they do not have such a policy, you know 'no questions asked'.

They would have a warrantee polcy but not a no questions asked policy. if they did have a n questons asked policy, at that point i would cease to be a bad thing!

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I think you are in an area of semantics that will not support your argument here. You admit the policy is utilized because the public is presumed to be good, moral and honest. I know. My words. But I use them because you intentionally avoided them. Then, you go on to exclude yourself from that group. The conclusion is that you once again admit that your actions are wrong.

Once again just like the noises coming from my dads elvis records, while making scratch music when I was a Kid. chika chicka, repeat repeat, chicka chicka, havn't heard that before...

The public is presumed to be too apathetic or scared of what people will think of them to bring them back, that is how they get away with it. There cerainly are people that are not, and they have accounted for them.

I challenge you to explain what is immoral about my actions.

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I was respecting your argument that Wal Mart is not good and pure right up until you declared yourself the ultimate arbiter of how much profit they NEED to make. Exactly how much do they NEED to make oh exalted one?

Thats your choice, I respect that.

To answer your cheeky question, I beleive they do not need to take advantage of their saff and their communities to maintain dominance over the market, if a company is doing well, its staff should be doing well also,that is morally correct.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[sundevil777 102]

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It wasn't what he wanted to hear about himself, so he rejected that reality and substituted his own.

Seems so much like his assertions regarding 911 conspiracy theories, doesn't it?

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am