Mosque Ground Zero

[billvon 2,991]

>Lets compare last years "In the name of Islam" deaths to those of all other
>religions.

OK.

Now, can you answer my question? Are both crimes listed in my post representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

[turtlespeed 220]

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>Lets compare last years "In the name of Islam" deaths to those of all other
>religions.

OK.

Now, can you answer my question? Are both crimes listed in my post representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

Which one was that?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,991]

>Which one was that?

Perhaps third time will be a charm.

Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

[turtlespeed 220]

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>Which one was that?

Perhaps third time will be a charm.

Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

That would depend on the outcome of the competency hearing.

It sounds to me that the child murderer was insane, while the other was acting with rational intent and intuition.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[dgskydive 0]

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Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

Any religion that says I should kill you for not believing the same thing I do is evil.

Dom

[winsor 236]

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>Which one was that?

Perhaps third time will be a charm.

Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

Yup.

[billvon 2,991]

>It sounds to me that the child murderer was insane, while the other was
>acting with rational intent and intuition.

So the Christian beheader was not indicative of the evilness of Christianity, even though he killed his son to "save him from the Antichrist." But the Muslim beheader was. Because he's Muslim.

About what I expected.

[kelpdiver 2]

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>Which one was that?

Perhaps third time will be a charm.

Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

That would depend on the outcome of the competency hearing.

It sounds to me that the child murderer was insane, while the other was acting with rational intent and intuition.

Bill, it seems hard to ignore the culture of honor killing one side. You can try to paint them both as acts of mental illness, but one community rejects such killings universally, and the other one struggles mightily with it.

It was last Fall when a father in Arizona ran over his daughter (and her bf's mother) because she became too Westernized and independent. His family assisted him in his attempt to flee the country.

[turtlespeed 220]

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>It sounds to me that the child murderer was insane, while the other was
>acting with rational intent and intuition.

So the Christian beheader was not indicative of the evilness of Christianity, even though he killed his son to "save him from the Antichrist." But the Muslim beheader was. Because he's Muslim.

About what I expected.

Do you know the difference between rational and irrational?

What did the competency hearing decide?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[dgskydive 0]

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It was last Fall when a father in Arizona ran over his daughter (and her bf's mother) because she became too Westernized and independent. His family assisted him in his attempt to flee the country.

i mentioned that already and he didnt reply to it.

Here is another example of how tolerant Islam is.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=8303567&page=1

Dom

[billvon 2,991]

> You can try to paint them both as acts of mental illness, but one
>community rejects such killings universally, and the other one struggles
>mightily with it.

Worldwide I'd agree. Here in the US I would not. I don't know a single Muslim who lives here who "stuggles mightily" with whether decapitation is appropriate or not.

(I mean, you could say that Christians "struggle mightily" with whether or not abortion clinic bombing is OK - but again, I've never met any that thought it was anything other than a crime.)

[kelpdiver 2]

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> You can try to paint them both as acts of mental illness, but one
>community rejects such killings universally, and the other one struggles
>mightily with it.

Worldwide I'd agree. Here in the US I would not. I don't know a single Muslim who lives here who "stuggles mightily" with whether decapitation is appropriate or not.

I already cited an obvious counter example - this woman's family appeared to have no issue with the father killing the daughter. Or at best, they struggled with it and still assisted him, stalled the police.

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(I mean, you could say that Christians "struggle mightily" with whether or not abortion clinic bombing is OK - but again, I've never met any that thought it was anything other than a crime.)

You might do better with this line of response, as certainly there is some segment of the pro lifer movement who are willing to use violence to drive their agenda.

[dgskydive 0]

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Worldwide I'd agree. Here in the US I would not. I don't know a single Muslim who lives here who "stuggles mightily" with whether decapitation is appropriate or not.

Even if they did agree with it. They are not going to admit it.

If someone is a pedophile. Are they going to tell you they think it is ok? No they are going to lie and tell you what they should say. Not what they really feel.

Dom

[turtlespeed 220]

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>Which one was that?

Perhaps third time will be a charm.

Are both crimes listed in my post (i.e. the Muslim beheading his wife in the name of Allah, and the Jesus freak beheading his son to keep him out of the hands of the Antichrist) representative of the evilness of the respective religions?

That would depend on the outcome of the competency hearing.

It sounds to me that the child murderer was insane, while the other was acting with rational intent and intuition.

Bill, it seems hard to ignore the culture of honor killing one side. You can try to paint them both as acts of mental illness, but one community rejects such killings universally, and the other one struggles mightily with it.

It was last Fall when a father in Arizona ran over his daughter (and her bf's mother) because she became too Westernized and independent. His family assisted him in his attempt to flee the country.

It goes beyond "Struggles with it"
Examples:
Stoning Video Not for the faint of heart.
Kurdish Girl Stoned No video
Iranian Woman CNN News Cast Video - She was whipped 99 times already
Iraqi Girl Another CNN News Cast

All this was on the first page of a google search "Muslim Stoning Women video"

Here is the link to the Google Search "Christian Women Stoned"

Here are some stats from a web site I found . . .

Due to the secrecy of these executions, accurate statistics are hard to come by. Reports suggest that there have been at least 1,000 women stoned to death, primarily for marital or sexual violations, in Iran, Nigeria, Somalia, Sudan, Iraq, United Arab Emirates, Afghanistan, and Pakistan during the past 15 years. The United Nations estimates that some 5,000 women each year, including some in the U.S., become victims of so-called "honor killings" in which family members kill a woman who has allegedly brought dishonor on them through such acts as dressing provocatively or engaging in illicit sex.

I believe the "tit for tat" comparisons are a little lacking in substance, let alone credibility.

Let them defend the actions depicted above.

It seems to me that there are either a FUCK LOAD of extremist Muslims in Islam, or this is accepted. Which begs the question, "How many extremists does it take to not be regharded as extremists anymore, and simply part of the general public?"

Edited to fix link and structure

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,991]

>If someone is a pedophile. Are they going to tell you they think it is ok?
>No they are going to lie and tell you what they should say.

Agreed.

So let's go with the facts. In the Catholic Church alone, 4300 priests had allegations of child sexual abuse made towards them. That's 4% of all Catholic priests in the US.

Of them, 1900 had hard evidence produced (semen stains etc) and 1000 did not. The rest died before any investigation could be made.

So those are the numbers for one Christian religion. What are the numbers for one Muslim religion? (say, Shi'a)

[normiss 798]

Nice to omit the Christian history of stoning people to death. Good think Jesus put an end to that I suppose.

[turtlespeed 220]

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Nice to omit the Christian history of stoning people to death. Good think Jesus put an end to that I suppose.

Well good thing you didn't bring up cave man marriage rituals either - but who needs relevance.

I am talking about present day . .

Did you miss the part where 5000 women are killed each year for "Honor"? STILL!

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[normiss 798]

Then it's good such behavior is against the law here.

So again, relevance to freedom of religion please?

[happythoughts 0]

Hmmm... those darned racist Californians are protesting the building of a mosque there.

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"Ernie White, who described himself as a possible candidate for Temecula City Council in November, was among the most outspoken critics of the mosque plan." Ernie White is an activist with a California Tea Party group in the Riverside, California area.

[turtlespeed 220]

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Then it's good such behavior is against the law here.

So again, relevance to freedom of religion please?

Muslims cannot ever have freedom of religion in this country, unless they change their religios laws.

SO, either we have people that come to the US and simply closet their beliefs and secret their actions, or we have people come here and change their religious laws.

It's the former that is the threat.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[jakee 1,489]

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It goes beyond "Struggles with it"
Examples:
Stoning Video Not for the faint of heart.
Kurdish Girl Stoned No video
Iranian Woman CNN News Cast Video - She was whipped 99 times already
Iraqi Girl Another CNN News Cast

All this was on the first page of a google search "Muslim Stoning Women video"

Here is the link to the Google Search "Christian Women Stoned"

While you're happy to tar the bulk of modern, moderate, western muslims with the same brush as the people in these sick cultures, I wonder what you make of some third world Christian phenomena such as the African 'witch children'?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[normiss 798]

It is my understanding that the majority of Muslims do not believe nor support the extremists interpretation of Sharia law.
I would fully disagree with your blanket statement.

[turtlespeed 220]

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It is my understanding that the majority of Muslims do not believe nor support the extremists interpretation of Sharia law.
I would fully disagree with your blanket statement.

Are you saying that the only extremists are the ones that believe in Sharian law?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[jakee 1,489]

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Muslims cannot ever have freedom of religion in this country, unless they change their religios laws.

SO, either we have people that come to the US and simply closet their beliefs and secret their actions, or we have people come here and change their religious laws.

It's the former that is the threat.

Or they come here and exactly the same things most Christians and most Muslims do, quote the bits of their books that they like, follow the edicts that they like, and ignore everything else that's too difficult/stupid/morally reprehensible to reconcile with modern society.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[kelpdiver 2]

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Due to the secrecy of these executions, accurate statistics are hard to come by. Reports suggest that there have been at least 1,000 women stoned to death, primarily for marital or sexual violations, in Iran, Nigeria, Somalia, Sudan, Iraq, United Arab Emirates, Afghanistan, and Pakistan during the past 15 years. The United Nations estimates that some 5,000 women each year, including some in the U.S., become victims of so-called "honor killings" in which family members kill a woman who has allegedly brought dishonor on them through such acts as dressing provocatively or engaging in illicit sex.

As this discussion is focused on the ability of Muslims to practice within the US, I don't think these external cases are applicable. If you search the world over, you'll find badly behaving Christians too.

That said, the local evidence still shows an issue with this, and the tendency of the community to rally around those who commit it indicate that this cultural blight is still present in the US. But allowing a mosque to exist is not the same as allowing Muslims to kill their women. The first is a protected right, the second is a crime.