JohnRich 4 #1 November 8, 2010 News:Use of Laser Pistols to Begin in Place of Pellet Guns Modern pentathlon’s governing body approved laser pistols for junior competitions, instead of pellet guns, starting in January, but stopped short of mandating their use for the 2012 Olympics. The federation, known as U.I.P.M., said at its congress in Riga, Latvia, that international junior and youth events should use the safer, more environmentally friendly pistols.Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/08/sports/08sportsbriefs-shooting.html?_r=1&src=twrhp I can see this as a "foot in the door" to mandate the use of laser guns instead of real guns in future Olympics... The first problem is that a laser is a straight line-of-sight target aiming system. There are no ballistics involved, due to the force of gravity pulling the bullet downward. Thus, no mental calculations are necessary to adjust the sights for bullet drop at various distances. A laser is also unaffected by wind, and thus no mental calculations and sight adjustments are necessary for windage. Furthermore, the variations of loaded ammo are removed, such as the amount of powder charge, the weight of the bullets, and the neck tension holding the bullet in the cartridge case. Meticulous care in loading ammo will no longer be necessary to produce uniform results. In other words, as a test of skill, and mental and physical prowess, it will turn shooting sports into nothing more than a cheap video game. Maybe the entire Olympics should just be replaced with Wii games! A laser beam does NOT replicate the shooting of actual bullets. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #2 November 8, 2010 QuoteA laser beam does NOT replicate the shooting of actual bullets. As anyone who has used a laser bore sight to sight in an optic will attest, it isn't even close at any sort of appreciable distance in which ballistics would matter. At those close ranges all there practically is, is sight over bore, but with longer distances (as used in competition) it is a fallacy to think that a laser accuracy recreates the skill of precision shooting. Maybe we should just do the winter Biathlon on a Norditrack and with a Wii instead!--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zep 0 #3 November 8, 2010 Smells like it has the European gun o phobe stamp all over it Gone fishing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skipbelt 0 #4 November 8, 2010 if the euros only knew how dangerous lasers were to airline cocpits , but then again , maybe they do , should a laser gun simulating a ballistic gun always be treated as if it was loaded ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #5 November 8, 2010 I had to lookup what Modern Pentathlon is. Pistol shooting, épée fencing, 200 m freestyle swimming, show jumping, and a 3 km cross-country run. Must be a "Modern Pentathlon" thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 569 #6 November 8, 2010 Quote News: Use of Laser Pistols to Begin in Place of Pellet Guns Modern pentathlon’s governing body approved laser pistols for junior competitions, instead of pellet guns, starting in January, but stopped short of mandating their use for the 2012 Olympics. The federation, known as U.I.P.M., said at its congress in Riga, Latvia, that international junior and youth events should use the safer, more environmentally friendly pistols. Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/08/sports/08sportsbriefs-shooting.html?_r=1&src=twrhp I can see this as a "foot in the door" to mandate the use of laser guns instead of real guns in future Olympics... The first problem is that a laser is a straight line-of-sight target aiming system. There are no ballistics involved, due to the force of gravity pulling the bullet downward. Thus, no mental calculations are necessary to adjust the sights for bullet drop at various distances. A laser is also unaffected by wind, and thus no mental calculations and sight adjustments are necessary for windage. Furthermore, the variations of loaded ammo are removed, such as the amount of powder charge, the weight of the bullets, and the neck tension holding the bullet in the cartridge case. Meticulous care in loading ammo will no longer be necessary to produce uniform results. In other words, as a test of skill, and mental and physical prowess, it will turn shooting sports into nothing more than a cheap video game. Maybe the entire Olympics should just be replaced with Wii games! A laser beam does NOT replicate the shooting of actual bullets. Jeez maybe it is to make them feel good about themselves when using a laser pointer in a presentation. It is a really stupid move. My boys are just learning to shoot an pellet gun and struggling to get the strength up to shoot accurately from the shoulder. BTW I bought some of the coloured targets from Walmart that "splatter" on impact for a high-visibility hit they are pretty neat and the kids love them.Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davjohns 1 #7 November 8, 2010 I shot precision rifle for years and again with my daughter. I lament the demise of the pellet gun in this sport. I don't think the laser will be the same. I also think the reasons cited are silly. Safety? Has any olympic shooter ever injured themselves or another because they were that incompetent with their weapon? Come on. Sounds like an anti-gun thing to me.I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet.. But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #8 November 8, 2010 QuoteHas any olympic shooter ever injured themselves or another because they were that incompetent with their weapon? The article is not about Olympic shooting, it's about Modern Pentathlon Juniors. The running and shooting is combined into one event, similar to a Biathlon at the winter olympics. I can see why they think a laser would be saver for kids. Plus it looks like it gets kicked out of the olympics soon anyways. QuoteIn spite of the event's strong pedigree in the modern Olympics, and its status as the only event created specifically for the modern Olympic Games, its lack of widespread popularity outside Eastern Europe has led to calls for its removal from the Olympic Games in recent years. However, a vote by the IOC on July 8, 2005, keeps it in the Olympic program at least until 2012. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davjohns 1 #9 November 8, 2010 Thanks for the clarification on the Olympic issue. I still think anyone competing with a weapon should be competent to keep from injuring someone. It is a weapon. If it can't injur anyone, it is a toy. Just as a FYI thing: George S. Patton, Jr. competed in the Olympics in Modern Pentathlon. As I recall, they gave him a Bronze after the fact. During the contest, they ruled it was impossible that he had put two bullets through one hole. They declared that he must have missed the target entirely. That decision was later reversed.I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet.. But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tokter 0 #10 November 8, 2010 I can totally see that, those guns are really precise. I was shooting 10m Air Rifles growing up, until 16 then they trust you with a SIG-550 Assault Rifle on 300m, which was more fun :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #11 November 8, 2010 get with the times people replace the javelin throw with Nerf hell, just make everything Nerf (brought to your by Nerf Marketing) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lost_n_confuzd 0 #12 November 8, 2010 Quote get with the times people replace the javelin throw with Nerf hell, just make everything Nerf (brought to your by Nerf Marketing) Still yoo dangerous. Motion sensors is where it is at.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #13 November 8, 2010 It could happen. Honestly, as dangerous as it is, I'm surprised Chicago hasn't tried to ban these things... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLprAAxFvjk&feature=related--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,563 #14 November 8, 2010 QuoteThus, no mental calculations are necessary to adjust the sights for bullet drop at various distances. All targets are at the same 10 metre distance. QuoteA laser is also unaffected by wind, and thus no mental calculations and sight adjustments are necessary for windage. They shoot indoors. QuoteFurthermore, the variations of loaded ammo are removed, such as the amount of powder charge, the weight of the bullets, and the neck tension holding the bullet in the cartridge case. They use air guns.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #15 November 8, 2010 QuoteAll targets are at the same 10 metre distance. They shoot indoors. They use air guns. I was extrapolating into the future and seeing this rule apply to all Olympic firearm sports. Nevertheless, even with air guns there are some variations in air pressure charges and pellets, from shot to shot. Those variations will not be a factor with lasers. The only thing that will count with a laser is holding the gun steady and trigger pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,563 #16 November 8, 2010 QuoteI was extrapolating into the future and seeing this rule apply to all Olympic firearm sports. The Olympics don't make the rules, the sports make the rules.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #17 November 8, 2010 QuoteQuoteI was extrapolating into the future and seeing this rule apply to all Olympic firearm sports. The Olympics don't make the rules, the sports make the rules. The extrapolation would be that Firearm sports will not exist.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #18 November 8, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteI was extrapolating into the future and seeing this rule apply to all Olympic firearm sports. The Olympics don't make the rules, the sports make the rules. The extrapolation would be that Firearm sports will not exist. Weaponized lasers are the wave of the future. Nothing wrong with being visionary. Pfft - primitive combustion projectile weapons. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #19 November 8, 2010 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteI was extrapolating into the future and seeing this rule apply to all Olympic firearm sports. The Olympics don't make the rules, the sports make the rules. The extrapolation would be that Firearm sports will not exist. Weaponized lasers are the wave of the future. Nothing wrong with being visionary. Pfft - primitive combustion projectile weapons. Football will no longer allow contact. Baseball will use a virtual ball All track and field will be completed on treadmills . . .I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #20 November 8, 2010 QuoteFootball will no longer allow contact. The NFL is already taking steps to become a flag-football league!--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,072 #21 November 8, 2010 >Football will no longer allow contact. Sharks will have lasers on their heads. Freaking sharks with freaking lasers on their _heads._ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #22 November 8, 2010 Quote Quote Football will no longer allow contact. The NFL is already taking steps to become a flag-football league! That is just how the Irving Cowgirls play . . . It will get better.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #23 November 9, 2010 QuoteSharks will have lasers on their heads. We already do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #24 November 9, 2010 Quote Quote Sharks will have lasers on their heads. We already do. We HAVE had that for a while - I thought Bill was up to date on mechanical and scientific advancements.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skipbelt 0 #25 November 9, 2010 a lawyer , a banker , and a doctor fall off of a cruise ship , the banker, and doctor get eaten by sharks , why not the lawyer ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
